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The value of anothers labor is often overlooked, it's not about sweat, it's about dignity, it always has been and I'd suspect that most people want to feel useful and appreciated rather than denigrated for their unpardonable sin of not aquiring that "higher"education" and worse, being considered less worthy of economic oppertunity and decent financial compensation.
This thing of skill was the drumbeat of those early day more militant unionists who did indeed have skills but still needed the force of organization to insure the groups cohesion against the divisive tactic of multi level pay based on abrbitrary categories whose sole reasoning was to create competition among workers. Skill is simply one facet of work, not all work utilizes skills but all work demands a civilized level of compensation.
I've heard a lot of talk on here that seems to imply that the market kind of seeks it's own levels regarding compensation, that's just not so, low skill jobs still need good workers, on time, good work habits, honest in their work, and most of all being relatively content on that job. For that we will pay the price just as we do for that "premium" cost attatched to the so called professional services.
We all use the services of these folks who do the dirty work, computer guys, Doctors, lawyers, and bankers don't usually plumb their homes or work on their cars but those things have great importance in their life, the dock loaderman or construction laborer certainly enjoys his computer but doesn't understand the complexities of it. As long as there is a lesser value placed upon certain work that body of work will be dominated by the negative connotation given it and the wokers will act accordingly. As Red Green has been known to say,"we're all in this together, I'm pullin for ya." Good pay is good for everybody...........
Not true! Since the immigrants have flooded into America pay for the UNSKILLED dirty jobs have gone down. It use to be that because the job was so nasty and dirty they had to pay big bucks to get someone to do it, but now there is a ton of workers with no skills but a desire to work that will do just about anything just to make a paycheck.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melinuxfool
Dirty jobs that no one wants to do usually do get paid well. Next time you see a guy with a septic truck, ask him how much money he's making.
Not true! Since the immigrants have flooded into America pay for the UNSKILLED dirty jobs have gone down. It use to be that because the job was so nasty and dirty they had to pay big bucks to get someone to do it, but now there is a ton of workers with no skills but a desire to work that will do just about anything just to make a paycheck.
You need to read Sinclair's, "The Jungle." You'll find that your opinion isn't completely accurate.
Should everyone's dreams come true? Should there be a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow? Should everyone live happily ever after? Should there be world peace?
Everyone's pay is based on the point at which these two lines intersect:
1. What someone is willing to pay them.
2. What they are willing to accept.
Labor is a service subject, as Mr. jtur88 pointed out (sort of), to the laws of supply and demand. If there are Lots of people willing to do physically-hard, dirty work, relative to the number of such jobs available, then the price for that service will go down.
Historically labor value has not been based, on how physically demanding or dangerous it is. Most jobs that meed those criteria pay fairly-low wages.
The labor market is ruled by skills (not adverse conditions), for it is skills that are in short supply, relative to demand.
It is market capitalism at work, so know it, understand it and get skills.
basic communist/socialist position. workers unite, the educated are elite parasites feeding on the people. hence the deification of the unskilled worker in soviet union.
The value of anothers labor is often overlooked, it's not about sweat, it's about dignity, it always has been and I'd suspect that most people want to feel useful and appreciated rather than denigrated for their unpardonable sin of not aquiring that "higher"education" and worse, being considered less worthy of economic oppertunity and decent financial compensation.
This thing of skill was the drumbeat of those early day more militant unionists who did indeed have skills but still needed the force of organization to insure the groups cohesion against the divisive tactic of multi level pay based on abrbitrary categories whose sole reasoning was to create competition among workers. Skill is simply one facet of work, not all work utilizes skills but all work demands a civilized level of compensation.
I've heard a lot of talk on here that seems to imply that the market kind of seeks it's own levels regarding compensation, that's just not so, low skill jobs still need good workers, on time, good work habits, honest in their work, and most of all being relatively content on that job. For that we will pay the price just as we do for that "premium" cost attatched to the so called professional services.
We all use the services of these folks who do the dirty work, computer guys, Doctors, lawyers, and bankers don't usually plumb their homes or work on their cars but those things have great importance in their life, the dock loaderman or construction laborer certainly enjoys his computer but doesn't understand the complexities of it. As long as there is a lesser value placed upon certain work that body of work will be dominated by the negative connotation given it and the wokers will act accordingly. As Red Green has been known to say,"we're all in this together, I'm pullin for ya." Good pay is good for everybody...........
A string of words, and conveyed thought, with almost no connection to reality whatsoever.
Labor is a commodity subject to market forces, and skills, talents and abilities rule the roost.
A string of words, and conveyed thought, with almost no connection to reality whatsoever.
Labor is a commodity subject to market forces, and skills, talents and abilities rule the roost.
Labor is a human endeavor not a commodity, you seem to have the view favored by those corporatized zombies that just hi jacked your money and laughed about it.
Labor is a human endeavor not a commodity, you seem to have the view favored by those corporatized zombies that just hi jacked your money and laughed about it.
My labor is a human endeavor, yes. However, when I offer to sell it to another, it becomes a commodity. When you fill out a job application and go through the process of interviews, offers, counter-offers, and acceptance of a position, you are offering to sell it to another individual.
If you want a higher price than the guy next to you, it is up to you to convince the buyer that your labor is more valuable than the next guy's. If you cannot convince him, then why wouldn't he hire the guy who will work for less money?
Let's put it this way. I want to buy some corn. Farmer Bob will sell it to me for 60¢ an ear, Farmer Jim will sell it to me for 45¢ an ear. The corn is identical, and both of them put forth the same labor to grow it. What is my incentive to buy from Farmer Bob?
Or, instead of buying corn, you maybe I'm looking to hire someone to shovel my driveway. If one guy will do it for $10, and another will do it for $15, which guy would I hire?
This is the reason socialism is so expensive for people that live under such systems. Too many price controls getting in the way of the market forcing people to pay more for things for no other reason than some bureaucrat somewhere thinks it is just. When they establish a minimum wage law, they aren't so much dictating that employers must pay me a certain wage, they are telling me that I am prohibited from selling my labors for less than that minimum wage.
If you are unwilling to work for less than a certain amount, then you are free to refuse to work for less than that amount. But people also have the right to refuse to pay more than they want for a certain job, service, or good.
If your labor is too expensive, don't be surprised if you get passed over. Likewise, businessmen, if you're unwilling to pay a decent wage, don't be surprised if you get crappy workers, or none at all.
If any of you wants a better standard of living, then pursue it yourself, don't expect it to be provided for you.
I do dirty jobs and wasn't able to get college. I get paid well, but lack for work.
Not everyone can hand drag torches into the woods in dead of winter and cut out a U Joint on a skidder, heat the wrenchs and install another U joint in the woods, laying in snow, ice and mud.
Working on cars sucks... Working on boat engine, and other engines 'sports' use is fun and you earn good dough and even get tips.
So far the engine I can't fix ain't been made yet, and I have no idea how many engine I ain't seem, but I know enough that I can fix them all.
I don't really care what another man does. But then there are some laywers I really don't like. There is a banker I don't like either.
I made an appt taking time off work to see him, get a bank note for a new truck and his aid said he was out. I left and came back after calling the next day and his aid said he was out. This time I was armed with a novel on the War of 1812 'No Ship may Sail', and that fat banker slob just coudn't miss lunch.
He was a tad late getting his lunch that day, because I forced him to close out my account, which was far over the loan I wanted.
He tried to pass that off on his aid too, but he failed at that, for fear of a bloody nose. He did mention I made a physical threat, and my answer was you can tell that to the cops with a bloody nose.
All he was, was a women in a man suit..
The day is coming you won't buy service cheap. Less and less real techs are interested, and no one is replacing them.
Labor is a human endeavor not a commodity, you seem to have the view favored by those corporatized zombies that just hi jacked your money and laughed about it.
More Junior High School-level gibberish. Your services are a commodity - period. Grow up and accept that. The sooner you do, the sooner you will have a chance at being success.
And I AM a corporateized zombie that has HiJacked YOUR money. thanks loads, sukka
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