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Old 02-11-2013, 05:26 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
10,032 posts, read 6,891,716 times
Reputation: 4207

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little-Acorn View Post
I've often wondered, about a slightly different scenario:

An adult man crosses the border illegally, and lives here. He marries someone, say another illegal alien. They have kids here. The kids are U.S. citizens under the current interpretation of the 14th amendment, since they were born on U.S. soil.

Then the man (and maybe his wife) get busted by ICE, proven to be illegal aliens (which tey in fact are), and get listed for deportation.

What happens to the kids?

The kids are U.S. citizens, no doubt about it. ICE has no grounds whatever for deporting them. But the parents are unquestionable illegal aliens, and the law is clear, the parents must be deported. Must the family be broken up? Who says so?

I've hear some people pretest that it's inhuman for ICE to separate the kids (who are, say, 3 and 4 years old by now) from their parents. But is is ICE who is doing that?

This man knew before he ever came here, that he was breaking U.S. law, and was subject to deportation if caught. And his wife, if she is also an illegal alien, knew the same about herself. And when they were making kids, they knew the same was still true.

It's notICE who is planning to split up this family, It is the man and his wife, knowing that he and she might be booted out at any time for breaking U.S. immigration law, and that any kids they produced while living illegally in America, would be citizens NOT subject to deporation. They knew all these things going in. And one must assume they planned for them.

So, what did this man and his wife plan would happen to their U.S. kids if and when they (the parents) got busted and deported? What plans did they make about what should happen to the kids? The kids have the legal right to stay in this country. And they also have the legal right to go with their parents back to the parents' home country.

The parents knew gong in, that their own deportation was possible and legal... and even just. WHAT DID THEY PLAN FOR THEIR KIDS if that were to happen to them?

Where does anyone get the idea that the government is responsible for the kids?

The parents are responsible for their kids. What have they planned?

Where have you been? This scenario has been played out countless times. Of course it always results in sob stories of how the family can't be separated and in most cases a free pass is granted of course.

 
Old 02-11-2013, 05:26 PM
 
Location: Dallas
493 posts, read 559,289 times
Reputation: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC View Post
Are you celebrating this situation? Yes or no.
No, because I don't see what the big deal is?
 
Old 02-11-2013, 05:29 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,717,889 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvocatusCenturion View Post
If this guy has a S.S. number and his parents brought him here when he was a kid then where is the criminal offense on his part? Looks like he is trying to legalize himself too.
He received a SS number through his DACA application by being granted work authorization. His SS number is a limiting number with a heading stamped on it "for work authorization only". DACA doesn't make him legal in any way, he is still an illegal granted deferred action and allowed to work while that action is allowed. He can not legalize himself from DACA, he has no path to legality unless amnesty is granted by Congress.
 
Old 02-11-2013, 05:30 PM
 
7,541 posts, read 5,171,016 times
Reputation: 1832
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
He's no longer 11 years old now, is he? Once he turned 18 he became responsible for himself as an adult.
and by breathing air he's committing a crime?

Do you jaywalk? Oops you committed a crime.

Go faster than the speed limit? Oops you committed a crime.

Did you drink before 21 years of age? Oops you committed a crime.

Have you ever littered? Drive without a license? Drive without insurance? Crossed against the red? Didn't do a complete full stop at a stop sign? Raced to beat the gates at a train track?

Thrown a Frisbee at a beach, without a lifeguard in the area? (California /. Los Angeles law).

Used a fire arm to fish? (A crime in Wyoming).

Ever pronounced Arkansas wrong? (Its illegal to do so in Arkansas).


There are serious crimes committed every day; worst than a person who is simply trying to live his life, in America, but the only thing wrong with him was that he was brought here illegally.

AGain, why should a person who came here through force of his parents, at the age of 11 be forced to to go back to a country he knows nothing about?

That's why I asked for which you ignored:

How would you like to be deported back to say Chile, if you were brought here by your parents at age 2? You know nothing about Chile, don't speak the language, don't even care about the politics of Chile, but you've contributed to American civilization by going to college and working, have friends and volunteer from time to time.


funny how anti-immigrants avoid facing that immigration isn't so black and white.


Quote:
Business models need to change. From your link: These are difficult, dirty, exhausting jobs that, for previous generations, were the first rickety step on the ladder to prosperity. Looks like things will be going back to what they used to be in a generation or so, kids needing to get off the video games and grow up.
That isn't going to happen anytime soon. when the American dream being sold is to get an education and when you pay good money for higher education, you don't start in a process plant at minimum wage with no benefits. You graduate and get a 6 figure job and let the uneducated work those jobs.
 
Old 02-11-2013, 05:30 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 70,173,862 times
Reputation: 27525
I wonder how the Repubs in Congress are going to counter this. This will be a feather in the cap for Dems.
 
Old 02-11-2013, 05:31 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
10,032 posts, read 6,891,716 times
Reputation: 4207
Quote:
Originally Posted by cecilsav View Post
No, because I don't see what the big deal is?
Let's say I break into your house, take anything I want, and then refuse to leave. Would you think it was a big deal if the police did nothing when you called them?
 
Old 02-11-2013, 05:32 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,717,889 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arus View Post
And he's now allowed to be here because of a law. I'm sorry that you don't like our laws. Maybe you should talk to your congress critter about changing the law.
Its not a law, its a policy, 2 very different things. He can still be deported on a whim as he is still an illegal, the Obama admin is doing nothing more than using a loophole in the law for this DACA policy.
 
Old 02-11-2013, 05:33 PM
 
7,541 posts, read 5,171,016 times
Reputation: 1832
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
He received a SS number through his DACA application by being granted work authorization. His SS number is a limiting number with a heading stamped on it "for work authorization only". DACA doesn't make him legal in any way, he is still an illegal granted deferred action and allowed to work while that action is allowed. He can not legalize himself from DACA, he has no path to legality unless amnesty is granted by Congress.
Yes he can legalize himself through DACA. Like every other immigrant who legalizes himself here. they live here as a productive member for the required number of years (many are already qualified), take the citizenship test, take the interview, and then take the oath.
 
Old 02-11-2013, 05:33 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 70,173,862 times
Reputation: 27525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arus View Post

How would you like to be deported back to say Chile, if you were brought here by your parents at age 2? You know nothing about Chile, don't speak the language, don't even care about the politics of Chile, but you've contributed to American civilization by going to college and working, have friends and volunteer from time to time.
He's 19..just started college.

I've seen 14 year olds that just came from Mexico and plopped into the US.
They know nothing about the US, barely speak the language, have no friends and left many family members back in their country.

Within 6 months they've adjusted and adapted and picked up the language, including the slang, rather quickly.
 
Old 02-11-2013, 05:33 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
10,032 posts, read 6,891,716 times
Reputation: 4207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arus View Post
and by breathing air he's committing a crime?

Do you jaywalk? Oops you committed a crime.

Go faster than the speed limit? Oops you committed a crime.

Did you drink before 21 years of age? Oops you committed a crime.

Have you ever littered? Drive without a license? Drive without insurance? Crossed against the red? Didn't do a complete full stop at a stop sign? Raced to beat the gates at a train track?

Thrown a Frisbee at a beach, without a lifeguard in the area? (California /. Los Angeles law).

Used a fire arm to fish? (A crime in Wyoming).

Ever pronounced Arkansas wrong? (Its illegal to do so in Arkansas).


There are serious crimes committed every day; worst than a person who is simply trying to live his life, in America, but the only thing wrong with him was that he was brought here illegally.

AGain, why should a person who came here through force of his parents, at the age of 11 be forced to to go back to a country he knows nothing about?

That's why I asked for which you ignored:

How would you like to be deported back to say Chile, if you were brought here by your parents at age 2? You know nothing about Chile, don't speak the language, don't even care about the politics of Chile, but you've contributed to American civilization by going to college and working, have friends and volunteer from time to time.


funny how anti-immigrants avoid facing that immigration isn't so black and white.




That isn't going to happen anytime soon. when the American dream being sold is to get an education and when you pay good money for higher education, you don't start in a process plant at minimum wage with no benefits. You graduate and get a 6 figure job and let the uneducated work those jobs.




The issue is illegal immigration and not other laws that may have been broken. Try to stay on topic. He's illegal. Deport him. It is black and white.
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