Gov. J.B. Pritzker unveils graduated state income tax plan he says would give break to taxpayers earning less than $250K (Chicago: 2014, living)

[Bitey]

Originally Posted by flamadiddle

So I'll admit that I'm pleasantly surprised by the proposed rate structure. My taxes would remain the same, which I did not expect. And I was happy to see that no one is getting a free ride. So far JB gets a thumbs up, but I'm still patiently waiting for an MJ store to open up in my hood. Tick-Tock...

Right, and the when the federal income tax amendment passed it was only going to be 7% and only on the wealthiest of the wealthy, and the alternative minimum tax was only going to hit the wealthy, and so on. Oh yeah, and remember when the state sales tax was only 4%?

Once the state constitutional prohibition against a graduated income tax is removed, all it will take is a legislative tweak before you find yourself ensnared in the marginal rates that were originally "only for the wealthy."

Only in Illinois could they perpetually raise your taxes and claim with a straight face to be giving you a "break" when they give you a paltry 5 one-hundredths of a percentage point back.

Originally Posted by My Kind Of Town

And all of the C-D conservatives go quiet.....lol. They can’t even decide how to rip this proposal. But I thought EVERYONE was going to pay MORE under the JB proposed progressive income tax structure?

Oh, you will. Maybe not at first, but you will eventually.

[nap1313]

Originally Posted by Grlzrl

I live among those people and I assure you, they aren't saying that. In spite of voting that clown into office, they still gripe about the tax increases and they are bigger than ever between the already huge tax increases 67-100% on state income taxes and property taxes. People were madder than I have ever seen them in 2016 when the huge reassessments came out and then the state tax increased in 2017. I saw more people than ever talking about moving. .

Your experiences are anecdotal, just as mine. I think you may be right among your circle of people, but I think this comes down to high earners’ perceptions in the burbs vs. the city. From what I can gather, you live in the burbs, and it may very well be that high income suburbanites want to leave the state.

I live in the city and am also around “those people”. I know a lot of high income people (I’m one of those people that will end up paying over 7% in state income tax if this thing passes), but know no one looking to leave the state unless it’s a step up in career with a prestigious compan. To recreate the urban experience, even with the taxes factored in, is next to impossible anywhere else in the country for less cash.

I can understand why people in the suburbs may want to leave, as it may make no difference to them either way as long as you can buy a house and have decent schools. You can recreate the suburban experience anywhere in the country, in most places a lot less cheaper than Chicago burbs.

But for high earners that live in the city and want that urban experience, there really aren’t a lot of cheaper choices to escape to.

[GhostOfAndrewJackson]

J.(elly)B.(elly) Prtizker is simply lying. His plan is to sucker you into voting for a progressive income tax that does not solidify the rates in the constitution, knowing full well that once the constitutional provision is stripped out the general assembly can raise the rates at will.

There already is a progressive income tax system in Illinois, because the tax code allows for income tax credits as a backdoor and likely unconstitutional method of thwarting the fixed income tax rate. . In fact the general assembly can already waltz around the flat tax and get the same rates by simply jacking the flat rate to 7.95% and then giving income credit rebates to lower it again. Think about why they will not do that. They can already do exactly what they claim they wish to do.

All this is about is a song and dance to give them one last chance to boost public sector salaries and lock in higher pension benefits. Fat boy is betting that Trump will be taken out of office and a more bailout friendly federal Democratic administration will be in place. A Democrat administration will need Illinois votes to keep in power, so a bail-out may be assured. That is Pritzker's and the public sector's gambit.

The keypoints to note is his Lardness will not put the tax rates in the Constitution nor is he even willing to change the Illinois Constitution to alter future pensions.

And the recession is coming, Illinois will be insolvent due to pensions and healthcare for retirees and many of us will laugh.

[aga412]

Originally Posted by fusillirob1983

You said the minimum wage hike, and other policies, would line the pockets of the Chicago and Springfield elite.

It will. Indirectly. More people will be going on government assistance, shoring up their voting base and cementing their power, while they can continue to court their crony capitalist pals that can "afford" their crazy wage hike and then use tax breaks to lure them here on the taxpayer's back.

[aga412]

Originally Posted by My Kind Of Town

No point in discussing further. Your minds are already made up because of the letter next to their name. I get it. There was nothing Rauner could do. His hands were tied so nothing was his fault. Never mind his time as governor will go down as one of the worst in state history.

I never insinuated JB would be the worst governor in history, you're the one using hyperbole. I'm certainly more right-leaning but there are many Republicans that draw ire from me. I wasn't even letting Rauner off the hook completely, but he's not the mustache-twirling villain that you all make him out to be either. There's no nuance with liberals, it's always just REPUBLICANS BAD.

[GhostOfAndrewJackson]

Originally Posted by My Kind Of Town

And JB, well, no matter what he does as governor it’s a huge mistake. He’s only a few months in but, look at this guy, he’s destined to go down as the worst governor in state history for obvious reasons (Madigan puppet). I think that about sums it up. Sad.

Exactly, J(elly) B(elly) Pritzker was sworn into office on Jan 14th and less than two months later we can safely pronounce his reign as Governor as a total failure. It really is rather amazing. I did not think you could do worse than Rauner, but J.B. has done it in less than 60 days. The next recession and it is all over. The state has done nothing to build reserves in these, good times. Amazingly his fatness is actually spending more on education, and will be on public sector salaries and this making the precarious pensions in even worse shape. And his big plan (LOL) is to rely on a bunch of taxes that are discretionary (marijuana, gambling, plastic bags), revenue that will disappear in a heartbeat during an economic decline, but those salary increases, program expansions and corresponding pension increases won't disappear

[fusillirob1983]

Originally Posted by aga412

There's no nuance with liberals, it's always just REPUBLICANS BAD.

That's not accurate at all. I know several people that would identify as liberal that want nothing to do with the national Republican party, other than someone like John Kasich or Jeb Bush, but they also want nothing to do with the local Democratic party in Cook County, or at least want it rid of its corrupt leaders. I think most millennials voters probably fit into this group at this point.

I think it's helpful to get news from other sources, not just Fox, Breitbart, Daily Caller, etc. because one may learn those websites are sometimes just making things up. I disagree with the general assertions made by most of those outlets, but I'll watch or read from time to time to see how the news is being messaged.

[flamadiddle]

Even though I was surprised by the proposed rate structure, I'd still vote against it. I prefer a flat tax where everyone pays the same rate.

[Curly Q. Bobalink]

Originally Posted by flamadiddle

Even though I was surprised by the proposed rate structure, I'd still vote against it. I prefer a flat tax where everyone pays the same rate.

I have to agree with you - as evidenced by some in this thread, "Robbing Peter to pay Paul will always have the support of Paul". If the Legislature wanted to simply have the wealthier pay more, as stated above, it could be done via a much larger below-the-line standard deduction and an increase in the flat rate. The 3% will likely not flee, but I believe you're going to see a whole lot more people making $249,000 going forward that currently report much more, JB isn't the only person in the world who's able to hide investments and income in the Cayman's. But I do think the "goal" is to sock the 3% while protecting the folks that are primarily responsible for getting JB elected and keeping Madigan in office - the Unions and state employees. Why else would they be so eager to open the Constitution to change the flat tax to a progressive one, yet not mention in any way eliminating the pension guarantee? Even if pension benefits already earned could not be diminished (and I don't think they should be), the "future", as-yet-unearned pension benefits could be reduced, which would have a huge impact on the state's finances going forward.

But my biggest problem with the esteemed Governor's plan (as a Fat Bastard myself, I resemble Ghost's portrayal of the state's highest executive as "Jelly Belly", although it is a little funny), is that it doesn't even begin to solve the State's problems. Illinois has a structural defect in the current budget that will be immediately gobbled up by this proposed increase, and that's with his choosing to (again) "kick the pension debt can down the road" to the tune of $800 million per year for the next decade or so. Ridiculous. Question: Where is all of his proposed new spending going to come from, if this tax increase only covers current spending, and the pension can is kicked further down the road? Taxing plastic bags and weed?

And, somebody (GOMB?) has recently reported that IL's infrastructure problem is at least as large as its pension debt. That, along with how property taxes are quickly becoming unaffordable for the majority of the state's residents, is why I'm going to vote "NO" on this when it comes up for public approval (if I'm still here, which is doubtful). Unless you're making the Big Bucks in Illinois, and I'm not, why in God's Name would anyone want to stay in a place with such a negative outlook? It's certainly not the weather. For somebody more knowledgeable than me: How much would the flat tax have to be increased, with no cuts, to balance current spending, rebuild the state's infrastructure, provide JB with the new spending he's earmarked, and provide significant property tax relief? I'm guesstimating ten percent. Any other opinions?

[scimitar12]

Originally Posted by dtcbnd03

If we amend the constitution for a progressive income tax then we should amend the constitution allowing us to reduce pensions. It's the most logical solution to pair the two together.

Yup. Pritzker said if anyone did not like his tax proposals he/she should come up with an alternative. There it is.