If you could move off Long Island...would you?? (New York: fit in, sale)

[clchu0331]

we considered moving out of long island for a few months now, as we are looking to upgrade the size of our house and move...but the costs of houses now are so high (500-600k) for a decent sized house in the school districts we are searching in.
my brother in law lives down in fairfax, VA, and for the amt that we are looking to spend up here, we could live like a king down there., not to mention, Fairfax, VA has some of the best schools in the nation!

the only problem is that for me to find a job down there, i need to get an advanced degree (i'm a pharmacist) and most places require a PharmD (sort of like a doctorate for pharmacists), and my husband just changed industries from being an Information technology analyst on wall street, to being an IT person in healthcare.

if we both were able to find jobs down there, there would be no doubt we'd move. it is more cost effective and we wouldn't have to worry about paying 15k in taxes, versus 5k down there!

Originally Posted by MovingLItoNC

We are considering a move to Charlotte, NC. Although, lately, I've been second guessing my decision.
Considering all of Long Island's Plus and Cons...would you move if you could??

[ClarkStreetKid]

Originally Posted by BigMike50

All within 15 mins from me: and most are free

Richmond Festivals | Art, Film, Food and Parades | Annual Events

Music Venues Richmond

The Top Live Music Clubs and Venues in Richmond, Virginia - Yahoo! Voices - voices.yahoo.com

The Richmond Virginia Music Scene

This doesn't include the coliseum or the landmark theater were I've seen major performers.

Talk about a word class Museum VMFA Virginia Museum of Fine Arts, Richmond, VA

We were fortune to host one of the most incredible once in a lifetime opportunity ever last year and it was amazing and generated millions to the local economy. VMFA: Picasso Exhibition Generated Nearly $30 Million for Virginia

Picasso's Personal Collection at the VMFA | Richmond.com

Hey, you forgot Charlottesville which is a quick 60 minute trip down 64!

I've been visiting Morgantown WV lately and finding that there's a ton of things to do anywhere if you look.

[Escape_From_NY]

Originally Posted by peconic117

If you are that unhappy here, then I wish you well in SC. But not everyone is in struggling to pay for a roof over their head here.

There are a lot of nice areas and nice thing on and about Long Island. I live in one of the most pastoral and bucolic areas on the entire island. Guy next door has about 300 acres under cultivation. I am surrounded by horse farms, vinyards, wineries, et al. Some would consider this paradise, and in a way, it is. But with the COL, taxes, rents and home prices outstripping wage increases year after year, there comes a point where this has become a Potemkin Village-esque sort of existence for some of us. I'm not unhappy BEING here. Quite the contrary. I've been living on LI for 50 years now, and would stay here, if cost was no object, if money wasn't becoming a problem, and I felt secure about my income going forward.

Unfotunately, that's not the case. LI has priced itself out of the market. Just look at our young people - the ones who aren't leaving for lower costs and better opportunities elsewhere, are moving back in with their parents because they can't afford the rents, because they can't find jobs that pay a wage commensurate with the COL here.

Yes, there are many here who are not struggling, and doing fine. (Until "something happens", anyway)
Then, you have people like my former co-worker who I ran into the other day for the first time in several years. His wife was the real bread-winner in their household - she was a bank vice-president. But the crash of `08 made a statistic out of her. Turns out they lost their modest home, are now renters, and are planning to move to Texas. Why? It seems they have come to the same conclusion that I did - there is no future for them on LI.

Originally Posted by peconic117

I lived in FL for 12 years and hated it more every year, cheaper living isnt the end all be all for everyone. For me personally you couldn't give me a house for free to live in a place like SC. But if it is your paradise then godspeed.

LOL! I hate Florida, too! My mom lives down there, Speaking of free homes, my mother, who is seriously getting on in years, has been preparing things and tying up loose ends as far as her Will and such, and asked me if she should put my name on the Deed (3brm, 3bath, 2 story, 2 car garage condo on Hutchinson island), and I told her "Thanks, but no thanks" and to put my brother's name on that albatross instead.

But if gave me a house for free on Long Island, I'd have to either immediately rent part of it out, or get a 2nd job just to pay the taxes and insurance, keep the lights on, and put aside enough for several $1500 a pop heating oli tank refills if we have a cold winter.

As for SC, I don't consider it paradise, and am not even LOOKING for paradise. I'll settle for "sustainable" I long ago lowered my expectations, as I am both a realist and a pragmatist.
No, not paradise, but easily affordable, dirt cheap taxes, low COL. That this haapens to be in a beautiful area of SC known as "The Upstate"(and yes, I've BEEN there. Have you?) that reminds me of northern New England(minus the freezing winters, of course), is just a bonus.

Originally Posted by peconic117

Wow you are going to fit right in down there lol. Are you going to build an end of the world shelter and stockpile some AKs as well?

Actually, not so much. I am, I suppose, a bit of a "Doomer", being aware of things such as global economic collapse and the implications of an EMP event, but I am not religious at all. My notion of "end of the world" is not biblical in origin, but rather based on what I see,
learn and know. It is simply looking at the evidence all around us, rather than choosing to ignore the writing on the proverbial wall.

Originally Posted by peconic117

Seriously though if what you speak of comes to pass living in SC isnt going to help much, nor will living anywhere else for that matter.

You're right, in a way. When I purchased the place in SC back in the summer of `08, the economic crisis had not yet sufaced, and few of us ordinary folks knew what was coming down the pike. I did not buy a doomstead, I bought what was then for me, a super cheap
little winter getaway, possible present ReLo (and get new job)residence and future retirement digs. That's mainly all it represented for me. It's not a doomstead where one could raise animals, grow food, and be independent of the grid and city water(the property is too small), and it's also not secluded and far enough away from neighbors and laid out and situated so as to be defensible and securable. I have what I would call an economic fallout shelter, and would not have bought it, had I known we were going to be looking at the very real prospect of an economic collapse only half a year later.

So, yes, you are right in that it is not well-situated for an all out SHTF/TEOTWAWKI-type event.
It wasn't bought for that purpose because the notion of such a purpose, did not even exist in my conciousness 6 months before Lehamn Brothers imploded. I was caught unaware and by surprise.

But all else being equal? Living in SC will help a LOT. A am single, no kids. I did a rough comparison of owning in SC vs. renting on LI (just for fun

SC: 3 bdrms, 1 bath, detached 1-car garage, 1/3 acre, city water and sewer. Half a dozen near-100"
tall shade trees over home, lot slopes downhill about 12' lower at the back of the property line, behind which runs a year round creek. Lot is about 50% heavily wooded, and abuts a forest at the rear of the property that owned by a furniture company. HVAC is electric. Mild winters and reasonable summers.
Not in flood-zone, hurricane ally, or earthquake-prone area. Odds of tornado 25% higher than national average, though.

Approx Monthly housing costs:
Taxes, $10
Water and sewer $38
Electric $100
Insurance $50
Maint:?? Your guess is as good as mine, but being in an areae with lower labor costs, it should be less than a similar home on LI. But let's say $50 - It's a small home (about 900sqft) and I mow my own lawn, and do my own painting.

So that's about $250 a month for a 3 bdrm. I could always rent out 1 bedroom for $200 a month, stay legal, and cut my monthly "nut" down to $50 bucks. And I can smoke *inside* to my heart's content and even get a pet if I want. And hog the driveway. And have overnight guests.

So, $250 a month, I get the run of the entire place all by my lonesome - no sharing anything with anybody. $50 a month if I'm willing to share with 1 person. Oh, and I get to CHOOSE who that 1 person is.

Long Island?

$500-600 gets you a *room*(no smoking, no pets, no overnight guests) in a (most likely) illegal private setup where you get to share the kitchen and bath with 2-3 other people not of your own choosing.

$750-850 gets you a "studio" or room with private entrance and bath. Also likely illegal.

$900-1500 gets you a 1 bedroom apt May ir may not be legal.

And in all cases, you better hope your "landlord" is solvent, paying the mortgage and taxes on time, and not secretly in foreclosure, pocketing money from you in a home he no longer owns. (That's already happened to me once, about 10 years ago)

BUYING on LI? I won't even go there!

So all that being said, where would you rather be when the economy tanks and and a real Depression starts in earnest? I know where *I'D* rather be when the layoofs start, and jobs and income dry up.

[Escape_From_NY]

Originally Posted by bigjretrac

You missed the crux of what I was saying. I, myself, plan on leaving the island at some point (as soon as 18 months), but if you choose somewhere just because it's cheap, and not because you like the place, you WILL end up unhappy. If you choose the wrong place, you can be bored with nothing to do, you can be lonely without friends and family, you can get tired of the weather, etc.

The point is that, even down south, the inexpensive McMansions that people like (which I think are gorgeous, btw), tend to be in far flung, isolated neighborhoods-- some people like that, some people don't. But to uproot just for a house is foolish. The money you save on the house can't buy family, it can't buy friends. Does that mean you shouldn't move? Of course not!! A lot of us just can't afford housing on Long Island-- but at least move somewhere you like.

Again, I'm all for leaving Long Island, but do it for the right reasons. As I said, my reasons for leaving aren't just money, it's QOL (traffic, fast faced atmosphere, political corruption, etc).

Now do you get what I was saying?

I understand what you're saying. But in MY case, the decision to buy in the Carolinas is one I arrived at after quite a bit of research and assessing my needs and desires. It was a strategic purchase, as location, proximity to jobs, transportation hubs and corridors and climate(as WELL as COL) were my main considerations. Faimly? Got none here to speak of. However, Mom is in FL, so would be 700 miles closer, and Amtrak station being only 10 minutes away(in SC) opens up some options for relatively stress-free travel between FL and SC. The (beautiful)
Greenville-Spartanburg international airport is only 20 minutes away. In and out in 5 minutes, quiet and nearly deserted at "rush hour"(as are the nearly-empty, litter-free and well-maintained 65mph highways)

I didn't just throw a dart at a wall map, or base my decision solely on cost

[peconic117]

Originally Posted by Escape_From_NY

There are a lot of nice areas and nice thing on and about Long Island. I live in one of the most pastoral and bucolic areas on the entire island. Guy next door has about 300 acres under cultivation. I am surrounded by horse farms, vinyards, wineries, et al. Some would consider this paradise, and in a way, it is. But with the COL, taxes, rents and home prices outstripping wage increases year after year, there comes a point where this has become a Potemkin Village-esque sort of existence for some of us. I'm not unhappy BEING here. Quite the contrary. I've been living on LI for 50 years now, and would stay here, if cost was no object, if money wasn't becoming a problem, and I felt secure about my income going forward.

Unfotunately, that's not the case. LI has priced itself out of the market. Just look at our young people - the ones who aren't leaving for lower costs and better opportunities elsewhere, are moving back in with their parents because they can't afford the rents, because they can't find jobs that pay a wage commensurate with the COL here.

Yes, there are many here who are not struggling, and doing fine. (Until "something happens", anyway)
Then, you have people like my former co-worker who I ran into the other day for the first time in several years. His wife was the real bread-winner in their household - she was a bank vice-president. But the crash of `08 made a statistic out of her. Turns out they lost their modest home, are now renters, and are planning to move to Texas. Why? It seems they have come to the same conclusion that I did - there is no future for them on LI.

I truly wish you luck and happiness down there. That's what its all about!

I actually agree with much of your post, and trust me I hate the corrupt governments and insane taxes on LI as the next guy, but I just wanted to add that jobs are scarce and houses are in forclosure everywhere. I had a front row seat to it in Florida, jobs are still very scarce down there (much of my family is down there). As a matter of fact I just read an article about the BMW plant in Spartanburg SC hiring a few hundred workers (all are temp workers, job only pays 12 an hr and can get canned at any time), yet Thousands lined up to apply. Times are tough everywhere not just LI. I will freely admit though that losing an income in a low cost state such as SC could make it much easier to weather the storm so to speak as it would up here.

[tigmet]

Originally Posted by clchu0331

my brother in law lives down in fairfax, VA, and for the amt that we are looking to spend up here, we could live like a king down there., not to mention, Fairfax, VA has some of the best schools in the nation!

I really question this. There are clearly some advantages in Virginia, most notable, a much smaller income tax.

But live like a king in Fairfax? No way. Fairfax housing is extremely expensive. And if you think the traffic is awful here, it actually is worse down there.

I don't know what sort of numbers you looked at to arrive at the "live like a King" scenario, but for Fairfax, those numbers had to be cooked.

[Escape_From_NY]

Originally Posted by peconic117

I truly wish you luck and happiness down there. That's what its all about!

Thank you.

Originally Posted by peconic117

As a matter of fact I just read an article about the BMW plant in Spartanburg SC hiring a few hundred workers (all are temp workers, job only pays 12 an hr and can get canned at any time),

Heh, since the crash of `08, my rent has tripled and my income is now only $.50 cents higher than those temp workers @ BMW, and I can get canned at any time, for any reason, or even no reason at all.
Oh, and that's only the 5 hours a day, P/T rate. If I work F/T, my pay rate drops to $10.80 per hour.
Being a temp worker @ BMW in Spartanburg(10 minutes away from my place down there) is looking more and more *several* steps up from living and working on LI. At least, for ME anyway.

[Mezter]

I wouldn't mind stayin a bit longer, but after 11 months here, I really do miss Denver alot. I should be moving in either September or October back to Denver. I like Hicksville though, & i'll be sad to leave my family.

[QueensKid]

Obviously a big question that encompasses many factors. My two cents is this: unless you work in New York City or have a great job on the island, it makes zero sense to live here. You're paying a premium because of the proximity to NYC and its resources. If you do not use those resources, it's better (in my opinion) to live somewhere else where you can stretch your money further.

I've spent most of my life in Queens but have traveled extensively throughout the U.S. and lived for five years in Ohio. There are plenty of great places in this country to live. It boils down to preference.

For me, I moved to Long Island (New Hyde Park) because I couldn't afford to buy in Queens. If money weren't an issue, I'd live on the Long Island City waterfront (one subway stop out of Manhattan), or somewhere in Westchester.

[bigjretrac]

Originally Posted by bigjretrac

One thing I've noticed is that people who leave strictly for monetary reasons often end up unhappy.

Originally Posted by Escape_From_NY

The "same house elsewhere for the same price on LI"?!? How about the same house elsewere for 1/10th the price - with correspondingly cheap taxes? Because that's about the difference between LI and an area like the Carolinas.

Originally Posted by Escape_From_NY

I understand what you're saying. But in MY case, the decision to buy in the Carolinas is one I arrived at after quite a bit of research and assessing my needs and desires. It was a strategic purchase...

...I didn't just throw a dart at a wall map, or base my decision solely on cost

I think we both agree, but both misunderstood each other . I was talking about people who are perfectly happy on Long Island, but want to move in order to get a nice house (5 bedrooms, 3 bathrooms, 3500sft). They hear that some city was on Forbes Top Places to live, visit for a weekend, buy a house, then complain about the area. That's more of what I'm getting at.

You moved not just because of COL, but also QOL. You seem happy in South Carolina, I wish you nothing but success down there. Hopefully I can eventually make the move off Long Island when I'm done with my degree.