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Or houses -- many of the larger single-family homes in Uptown (and elsewhere, I just am most familiar with the houses in Uptown) are occupied by empty nesters. With time more of them will choose to downsize (those houses are BIG), and new families move in. In Uptown, however, the problem is cost; the houses aren't cheap, so many families with young kids can't afford them.
And it probably doesn't help that all of the new development is "luxury" apartments, which seems to be aimed at a younger, professional crowd.
I did an internship at the place that creates the Southwest Journal. I remember them talking about all the developments they were going to be covering in upcoming issues and a common theme was at most, these places were 2 bedrooms. That's enough for a small family, but certainly lacking if they want to grow a bit.
I forgot to mention expanding normal houses, so thanks for pointing that out UU. I do wonder if certain areas won't be able to add new families. For instance, if (and I don't know for sure) a lot of the empty nesters who are fairly close to the Chain of Lakes feel like stepping down into a condo or something else, they're likely to charge a steep price that most families of four simply can't afford. They might simply be replaced by another couple looking to move closer in from the suburbs or someone who wants excellent lake access.
Location: Cleveland bound with MPLS in the rear-view
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Let's start with 400,000 before we talk about 500,000. I think it can though, especially with revitalization and infill, but also [carriage housing*] or re-zoning residential to allow the alleyways to accomodate inhabitants in garages.
Well there are plenty of parking garages and surface lots in downtown. If we turned all of them into 15-20 story condo/lofts/apratments, then we are looking at adding 5 to 10 thousand people. Especially in areas along the metrodome.
I think the Central Corridor will really help increase population in both cities. I really hope the Midway in St. Paul gets an urban makeover and gets turned into a huge livable area with apartments (and some shopping/dining). If all the Midway gets redone, then it will add probably 15,000 to St. Paul (maybe a little too high).
Anyway back to Minneapolis. The areas along University Ave are going to develop so much with new condos and dorms for students and workers in the area.
And let's not forget the whole empty chunck of land behind TCF Bank Stadium. I know it is really industrial (other than the fields), but not all of it is used anymore. That area alone must be a square mile or two of pretty much unused land. That could be a Pearl District for Minneapolis or being a great area for the U. Could add 8,000 more people if done right.
Going back to the surface parking lots in downtown. I think there is a plan to turn Washington Ave area (by the library and 4th and 5th streets) to a large urban park. As much as I love promoting excersice and going green, we could really use some new condos. And really add to our downtown population. We could get over 12,000 people alone in downtown west if we really tried, therefore adding quite a bit to MInneapolis.
The other part of the city that will keep growing is Uptown. There are several condo buildings being built in the area and that trend will probably continue as the area keeps gaining popularity. However, despite the growth in a few areas of the city there continues to be decline in other areas of the city. Even with the revitalization initiatives on the southside on the Lake St corridor and growth along the Hiawatha corridor due to the light rail line there were alot of census tracts around there that lost people in the last decade. Also, if I recall there wasn't a single census tract on the northside that didn't lose a significant chunk of it's population in the last decade. Alot of those tracts lost 10-30%. As a challenged area that part of the city will probably continue to decline in population. It will take a rejuvenated interest in investment in the area to get people to move back there. Until this happens I don't think we'll see much growth in the overall city's population because the growth in some areas will continue to offset the losses in other areas.
As far as the carriage housing idea, I really like that as a way of increasing density in the many SFH neighborhoods in the city. From what I've seen I would say the majority of city lots have enough space for two homes. There are a few lots by our house where this took place at some point in time. If this was done at a large scale the city's population could increase substantially. Not to mention there are alot of homes on double lots and there are also still a decent number of vacant lots, especially in the poorer neighborhoods. All of these could be developed into additional housing units. Really at this point though I think there are only really a few neighborhoods where there would be the demand or desire to build another house on their lots. Maybe this could be done in some of the U of M neighborhoods, Lyn-Lake/Uptown/Whittier areas and in Cedar Riverside. Other than that currently I think either there isn't enough demand, or in neighborhoods in the SW there is housing demand but the populace there wouldn't be open to this idea.
Well there are plenty of parking garages and surface lots in downtown. If we turned all of them into 15-20 story condo/lofts/apratments, then we are looking at adding 5 to 10 thousand people. Especially in areas along the metrodome.
And let's not forget the whole empty chunck of land behind TCF Bank Stadium. I know it is really industrial (other than the fields), but not all of it is used anymore. That area alone must be a square mile or two of pretty much unused land. That could be a Pearl District for Minneapolis or being a great area for the U. Could add 8,000 more people if done right.
Going back to the surface parking lots in downtown. I think there is a plan to turn Washington Ave area (by the library and 4th and 5th streets) to a large urban park. As much as I love promoting excersice and going green, we could really use some new condos. And really add to our downtown population. We could get over 12,000 people alone in downtown west if we really tried, therefore adding quite a bit to MInneapolis.
We definitely need to get rid of surface lots downtown. It think they are, by far, the most wasteful things for land that has such high value. I'd love to see some mixed development downtown, but condos aren't necessarily the answer (I believe there is still a bit of a condo glut). I think building apartments for rent with first and maybe even second-floor retail would be a better option. It would be great if they could work in some sort of affordability too...a lot of the condos downtown are catered only to the richest people who likely have no children. Getting more people downtown is the answer to improving downtown.
I believe the land behind TCF Bank Stadium is intended to be for future U development. I know that area was supposed to be a lot of high-tech, medical buildings, but I believe it was put on hold when the economy sort of collapsed. I can't imagine you'd want to build too much around there anyway: weekends you'd have horrible traffic and people everywhere, there's not much around that caters to anyone but college students, and it's right next to the train tracks.
New apartments can attract a certain amount of people, but a lot of the city is zoned for much lower density. Getting converted garages and granny flats would likely add a lot of density and population as well. But the biggest thing we can do (and I said this before in this post) is to get more families back in Minneapolis. There are quite a few in certain areas, of course, but a lot of new growth is single people coming into the city and living alone. That's great that they're doing that, but if a bunch of single people move in while a bunch of families move out, it'll more than erase any growth.
I agree with the families. I know St. Paul has loads of young families (much of my family resides in St. Paul with their kids). St. Paul seems to have a handful. Minneapolis doesn't. It is because of the negative image "the city" has had since the 1970's, a crime ridden area with crappy old houses.
I do think St. Paul has done a better job with preserving their historic houses and areas. Minneapolis just seems more run down within the neighborhoods (not all parts, but a good chunk). How does Minneapolis become more appealing to families? It is already seemingly attractive with the amount of parks and bike trails and family friendly sport teams and venues, why is it single only? Is it becasue of the U, being all college and all?
To get more families more houses need to be revamped and refurbished, for modern living. As well as the crime. The "city" itself has a bad rep for being filled with crime, and if many cities get rid of that image, especially Minneapolis, more families will become attracted.
RE: families, southwest (and I think south) Minneapolis have seen the numbers of families increase in recent years; that's part of the reason they've been rushing to open new schools (a new middle school where Ramsey is now, for one) and otherwise open space in southwest classrooms to meet the increased demand. The problem is that the increasing number of incoming families (as well as people who have kids and who choose to remain in the city) has not been evenly distributed. In any case, some neighborhoods are packed with families, while others are not. I don't think Minneapolis is less family-friendly than St. Paul. St. Paul generally seems to be a bit cheaper, though, which would be a big draw for families looking to buy but on a tighter budget.
Personally, I'd like to see more apartments cater to families. Historically people around here like to live in single-family homes, but for families there's a LOT to be said for living in an apartment -- especially in this climate. I would love to see some of the new developments in Uptown, for example, try to tap into the market of urban families who don't necessarily want the single family house experience. Have a playroom. Offer more three-bedroom units. Have a playground on the site. Offer stroller "parking." On the other end of the spectrum, I'd like to see more apartments in Uptown (sorry to focus on Uptown specifically) market to the aging boomer crowd; Uptown is FILLED with large older homes occupied by empty nesters, people who may be starting to think that it's time to downsize. Give them some additional options to live, and in the process open up some housing for families.
FYI, for those of you with an interest in carriage houses, the Ventura Village neighborhood has done a lot with this, and even had eco-friendly blueprints drawn up. A few areas of the city are zoned to encourage the creation of this kind of housing, but for now, most areas are not. When I called the city to ask about the possibility, though, they were very encouraging. I think the main problem right now is that they're not going to be supportive of giving you a variance if you eliminate parking spaces (parking spaces for cars still overrides the need for housing for people, but that's another topic/rant...), but assuming you keep the downstairs a garage, you can probably get yourself a backyard apartment in many parts of the city.
Location: Cleveland bound with MPLS in the rear-view
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaxontwinz
I agree with the families. I know St. Paul has loads of young families (much of my family resides in St. Paul with their kids). St. Paul seems to have a handful. Minneapolis doesn't. It is because of the negative image "the city" has had since the 1970's, a crime ridden area with crappy old houses.
I do think St. Paul has done a better job with preserving their historic houses and areas. Minneapolis just seems more run down within the neighborhoods (not all parts, but a good chunk). How does Minneapolis become more appealing to families? It is already seemingly attractive with the amount of parks and bike trails and family friendly sport teams and venues, why is it single only? Is it becasue of the U, being all college and all?
To get more families more houses need to be revamped and refurbished, for modern living. As well as the crime. The "city" itself has a bad rep for being filled with crime, and if many cities get rid of that image, especially Minneapolis, more families will become attracted.
It's already very appealing to me, and I want to get well ahead of this impending rush back to the city and establish my family in a nice little nook somewhere in the city (probably south side somewhere).
As far as another area where Minneapolis could see significant population development: the West Side. That's definitely a PART of why they chose the SW rail alignment they did -- because of the development potential over there. Another large-scale project few people are talking about is the River Parkway North of downtown -- which also has master planned visions of added tens of thousands of residents. Additionally, I ALSO see the University Ave corridor sprouting up with new life, and the master plan for the area adjacent to St. Paul has been shown to be capable of quite a transformation, if the demand and dollars are there. Finally, like others have mentioned, keep people in the city (including your poor, refuse, and "huddled masses") and promote a more family-friendly environment. This starts with crime perception and ends with schooling: fix those two things and you have a Midwestern Seattle.
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