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Old 01-07-2012, 07:02 PM
 
5 posts, read 10,733 times
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I am a native New Yorker born and raised in Inwood, Manhattan.

I grew up west of >Broadway<, which to many who know Manhattan is understood as being a border in many ways;

the western area pertaining a different, sometimes better quality of life than the eastern portion of the neighborhood.

This is not unique to Inwood as the same can be felt in Washington Heights (read- Hudson Heights) and Harlem (Morningside Heights etc) and other similar street phenomena unique to New York.

My question is this ....

I've always been perplexed as to why such a small neighborhood possesses such drastic differences in quality of life...

Streets like Vermilyea will feel like the south Bronx while a few blocks over on Park Terrace (east or west) the ambience will be reminiscent of the West Village with its small, foliaged, well-kept streets.

Is it the people? The presence of condos/co-ops? And if not, what is it?

I mean, we share Broadway thoroughly, rub shoulders in the subway etc

I personally find this part of Manhattan to have a beautiful geography and a perfect dense assortment of GOOD architecture inclduing spacious apts (for nyc).

But the bottom line is, most of the neighborhood has potential to be better. Like on the verge of being an urban haven.

Personally, I've lived in Europe and Portland, Oregon, Visited many cities in 4 continents and even got a degree in Community Development aka I know a thing or two about cities....Yet still feel at odds.

I've recently moved back home and continue to see the odd quasi gentrification benefit the neighborhood but at the same time not really?

There are some nice businesses,a new condo, and other well kept co-ops but almost exclusively on the west side. The eastern portion continues on in their "traditional" ways....

I mean we all know that pushing people out of a neighborhood when they were here thick and thin is wrong but what about those.........ok I'm just gonna say it.....delinquent thug characters that seem to love spreading their nastiness litterally and figuratively.

I've been harassed by people on the eastern side despite my living here most of my life.

I respect my neighborhood and dont litter or loiter. Others do so gratuitously.

What's the deal? It's so frustrating having to take the bad rap because of others.


How do my other fellow NYrs, who love and respect this city, feel about this syndrome?
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Old 01-08-2012, 05:12 AM
 
Location: Manhattan
25,373 posts, read 37,093,283 times
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Income distribution in NYC is skewed perhaps more seriously than in any City in the United States. People segregate themselves based on wealth, always have, always will.
The poor are pushed away from scenic rivers, lovely parks, and of course cannnot afford amenities like beautiful buildings, doormen, concierges, security staffs. The rich demand and get increased police protection, after all that is the PURPOSE of the police, to protect wealth and property...the poor get the cold shoulder.

The worse it gets the more resentment builds, it is hard to say whether the rich hate the poor more than the poor hate the rich...but there's a lot of hatred.

It goes on and on and you eventually get what we have: pockets of immense wealth and pockets of grinding poverty. This is segregation by wealth (as far as I know, only NJ has made it illegal but the Mount Laurel decision has been chipped away bit by bit so now it exists only in name.)
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Old 01-08-2012, 05:18 AM
 
Location: Seine Saint Denis 93
573 posts, read 1,462,943 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kefir King View Post
Income distribution in NYC is skewed perhaps more seriously than in any City in the United States. People segregate themselves based on wealth, always have, always will.
The poor are pushed away from scenic rivers, lovely parks, and of course cannnot afford amenities like beautiful buildings, doormen, concierges, security staffs. The rich demand and get increased police protection, after all that is the PURPOSE of the police, to protect wealth and property...the poor get the cold shoulder.

The worse it gets the more resentment builds, it is hard to say whether the rich hate the poor more than the poor hate the rich...but there's a lot of hatred.

It goes on and on and you eventually get what we have: pockets of immense wealth and pockets of grinding poverty. This is segregation by wealth (as far as I know, only NJ has made it illegal but the Mount Laurel decision has been chipped away bit by bit so now it exists only in name.)
once again you spoke the truth
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Old 01-08-2012, 05:20 AM
 
106,724 posts, read 108,937,910 times
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i cant think of any place i have gone in this country where i found it any different. those with money dont want to live next door to those who dont. thats a borderless concept.
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Old 01-08-2012, 05:29 AM
 
Location: Seine Saint Denis 93
573 posts, read 1,462,943 times
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the legendary fear of the poor
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Old 01-08-2012, 05:40 AM
 
Location: Planet Earth
111 posts, read 173,797 times
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I lived in Harlem and Washington Heights. I lived on the East (Audubon) and West side (Ft. Washington) of Washington Heights. The Audubon area was shady and hoodish at times (especially in the Summertime and extremely crazy during the Dominican festival and parade). People hanging out in corners/infront of buildings, etc. Also, it seemed that people embraced the hood/ghetto mind-frame.The Broadway strip is common ground; it's neither good nor bad. The West of Broadway is completely different. You have less litter, less shady characters, a higher quality of life, etc. The West of Broadway has a lot of luxury buildings and development compare to the East.

Look at the Hudson 192 Luxury building. About Hudson 192 | Hudson 192 The complex has 33 studios (starting at $1,398) 39 one-bedrooms ( starting at $1,725), and 13 two-bedrooms ($2,400). The prices of these apts might be out of reach for the residents of the Heights. As we know, Luxury buildings will not want certain people to live in their residences due to the fact they might lower the quality of life of the building and location.

The issues in Harlem and Washington Heights are social, economic and cultural. The biggest problem i feel is that there is no assimilation into the American culture. A lot of the immigrants and their American-born offsprings DO NOT want/care to adopt American values. To some, Washington Heights is the 2nd Dominican Republic.
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Old 01-08-2012, 09:36 PM
 
1,119 posts, read 2,654,573 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
i cant think of any place i have gone in this country where i found it any different. those with money dont want to live next door to those who dont. thats a borderless concept.
That is true in general. But the very rich in Carnegie Hill are living so close to the very poor in East Harlem. There is a small park in the middle of Park Ave between 96th and 97th street. While you are there, look at the south, so many luxury prewar apartment buildings. Then look at the north, so many red brick housing projects. The wealth of a single family on Park Ave below 96th can easily more than a whole block in the north. It is quite dramatic.
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:26 AM
 
Location: Manhattan
25,373 posts, read 37,093,283 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bill83 View Post
That is true in general. But the very rich in Carnegie Hill are living so close to the very poor in East Harlem. There is a small park in the middle of Park Ave between 96th and 97th street. While you are there, look at the south, so many luxury prewar apartment buildings. Then look at the north, so many red brick housing projects. The wealth of a single family on Park Ave below 96th can easily more than a whole block in the north. It is quite dramatic.
And you see the same on the West Side if you stand on 100th Street. It is as if someone drew a line from Broadway to Central Park and built only welfare projects to the North and luxury apartments to the South. Given the coincidence of the number 100 I have little doubt that is EXACTLY what happened.
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Old 01-19-2012, 01:22 PM
 
105 posts, read 322,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneNuYawka View Post
I mean we all know that pushing people out of a neighborhood when they were here thick and thin is wrong but what about those.........ok I'm just gonna say it.....delinquent thug characters that seem to love spreading their nastiness litterally and figuratively.

I've been harassed by people on the eastern side despite my living here most of my life.

I respect my neighborhood and dont litter or loiter. Others do so gratuitously.

What's the deal? It's so frustrating having to take the bad rap because of others.


How do my other fellow NYrs, who love and respect this city, feel about this syndrome?
Great, honest questions. When talking about these kinds of communities (I live in one: Bushwick), I think it's critical to separate the "low income" or "locals" in the community, from the criminals and thugs that tend to be present as well. These are not necessarily the same people as the OP points out. In my nieghborhood, there are many hardworking families, retirees, and industrious young people of color, who are just as sick and tired of the criminals and thugs as everybody else. No one should have to put up with it, rich or poor.

There have been several studies conducted over the last few years that indicate that gentrification doesn't necessarily displace "poor" people, and that in fact for the vast majority of the "locals", gentrification is a good thing, increasing quality of life and economic opportunity. (see one article here from 2008: Gentrification: Not Ousting the Poor? - TIME). Gentrification tends to push out the squatters and criminals first. Of course, gentrification can eventually displace some other long term residents as well, so there is a risk. The bottom line is that everyone deserves to live a safe and clean environment whether rich or poor. Criminals, thugs, gang members, and those that just want to intimidate should be forced out.
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Old 01-19-2012, 03:58 PM
 
Location: Bronx
16,200 posts, read 23,054,327 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tkak69 View Post
Great, honest questions. When talking about these kinds of communities (I live in one: Bushwick), I think it's critical to separate the "low income" or "locals" in the community, from the criminals and thugs that tend to be present as well. These are not necessarily the same people as the OP points out. In my nieghborhood, there are many hardworking families, retirees, and industrious young people of color, who are just as sick and tired of the criminals and thugs as everybody else. No one should have to put up with it, rich or poor.

There have been several studies conducted over the last few years that indicate that gentrification doesn't necessarily displace "poor" people, and that in fact for the vast majority of the "locals", gentrification is a good thing, increasing quality of life and economic opportunity. (see one article here from 2008: Gentrification: Not Ousting the Poor? - TIME). Gentrification tends to push out the squatters and criminals first. Of course, gentrification can eventually displace some other long term residents as well, so there is a risk. The bottom line is that everyone deserves to live a safe and clean environment whether rich or poor. Criminals, thugs, gang members, and those that just want to intimidate should be forced out.
True to some extent. Lets see how mixed housing works, when a single hard working Latina mother of two lets her boyfriend who came back from upstate who did a stint for selling drugs back in and starts selling drugs again and brings other criminal problem.
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