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Old 09-18-2006, 08:02 AM
 
Location: Just a few miles outside of St. Louis
1,921 posts, read 3,823,885 times
Reputation: 1120
Quote:
Originally Posted by mom4 View Post
my mom always said "I cant wait until you have kids just like you" I tell my kids the same thing it must be THE MOTHERS CURSE.
Ah, "The Mother's Curse". Let me tell you that it works! My daughter and son-in-law have two sons; one is six, going on seven, the younger one will be three next month. They are in the air force, overseas at the moment, so I get alot of phone calls. Not one goes by without a tale or two about their behaviour, especially Son # 2! She keeps telling me that I didn't have to get so carried away with the curse, but, I remind her that there is another mother involved, (her mother-in-law), who surely had a hand in it as well.
I so enjoy her stories, and yes, I remind her that she's only getting what she dished out to me. So, hang in there, Mom4! You'll get your reward!
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Old 09-18-2006, 08:39 AM
 
Location: NJ
502 posts, read 1,722,785 times
Reputation: 530
I've personally find that children learn best by example although, of course, there are always exceptions. Whenever, I am talking to one of teenage nephews or nieces, I use myself as an example. I go over mistakes I've made and things I wish I've done differently that of course my parents warned me about and I didn't listen. They seem to relate better when someone they know directly suffered the consequences when not following principles their parent taught them. When I tell my nieces or nephew that they shouldn't hang out late after a certain time not only do I tell them that it is because I love them and I would loose my mind if something ever happened to them but also because I don't want what happened to a friend I once knew happen to them. It becomes more real to them when you can show them that you aren't just dictating what they should or shouldn’t' do because you are the boss but more so because you love them and you don't want them to suffer what you or someone you knew suffered. They start seeing you as someone that at one point in your life, you were just like them. I hope this makes sense, I'm kind of rambling.

And I don't understand why the topic of Rap music keeps coming up. As individuals we have the ability to make choices. I listen to Rap and Rock music and I don't believe in violence, breaking laws or cursing. I make the choice every day to be a good person and a law abiding citizen. I am not so weak minded that if I listen to a Rock or Rap song that says drugs feel great or kill a cops, I am going to do it. Firstly, I know that the song isn't giving a literal message and secondly, I know right from wrong. Just because I watch Rambo, it doesn't mean I'm going to put a bandana around my head, start screaming and shooting at people that upset me off. I know and always have known where to draw the line when it comes to the difference between music, movies and real life. I know it because my parents taught me to be a good a person. They always told me before you do something thing about how it would feel if someone else did that to you or (and this one always got me) if Jesus was in the same room would you be proud of what you are doing?

My parents raised me to be honest, hard working and most importantly, respectful of people and myself. They also taught me to think for myself and not let outside forces influence my behavior without taking a moment to think about things first. If you are a good person that teaches your child by example, your children should turn out okay and be smart enough to know that whatever messages they hear in music is not to be taken literally. I find that the majority of the people that don't like rap and say it is a bad influence on children are people that maybe heard 2 lines of the worst rap song ever written. Rap music like Rock (remember how much your parents hated that too?) discusses many different topics. There is Gangster rap which tends to be very violent but the majority of Rap music which isn't Gangster Rap focuses on romantic relationship, having a good time with your friends, what it was like growing up poor and in bad neighborhoods or growing up in a broken home. They talk about real life lessons that luckily I never had to experience but I can learn from them though their music.

Please don't ever forget that most of the time the reason why people hate things is because they misunderstand them. Remember when people thought Elvis was evil? I've always said it, that we just don't ever learn from our past.

Also remember that genes are also a factor and the reason why sometimes we see good parents with difficult children. You know how sometimes you think about certain people and say I don't understand it they are the nicest people in the world and are like the children of the corn! Some things you just can't help no matter how hard you try but the key is to keep trying because you love them and love never grows weary.

Mom4, your children sound wonderful. You'll always worry because that is what good parents do. Congratulations and bravo for a job well done.
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Old 09-18-2006, 09:59 AM
 
183 posts, read 846,292 times
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I tried using myself as an example but all I get back is "that was back in the olden days, times have changed mom". Thanks for all the encouraging words and advice from everyone. I will hang in there.
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Old 09-19-2006, 01:01 AM
 
Location: PSL,FL
421 posts, read 36,045 times
Reputation: 87
Well i hate to be the one to break it to you but there is no comparrison of rock and gangsta rap what so ever...and grandparents now can see that where they couldn't many moons ago. Gangsta rap is like a virus. If let alone will spread and continue to do all kinds of damage. Parents need to have alot more control over what thier kids are listening to. If you don't think music and musicians don't have any influence in a childs thinking, you are severely mistaken. Maybe they don't influence you or your friends, but trust me, there are tons who are. Case in point..in west palm beach a few months ago, gangs were killing each other over nothing more then a rap song that was written about a gang members girlfriend....kids go into school with a ghetto attitude and ghetto clothes and ghetto lingo...all stemming from ghetto music. I have never once said "RAP" music is bad...i am always careful to use the word "GANGSTA"...and sorry to say but that is what sells the most..sex, violence and all that is evil. So i hope this answers you question on why gangsta rap is brought up alot...and i will continue to do so...I am well researched and there are tons of gangsta rappers and all the lyrics are horrible...not just 2 lines either...and what kind of kid has the need to understand sex, drugs, alcohol, guns and murder? Your definition of rap is a little naive...LOL...romantic? you mean sex right? Having a good time? You mean drinking and drugging right? All rap and hiphop is totally sexual....they can't dance without it looking like they are having sex....Aids doesn't scare these ppl and they promote it. Growing up in bad neighborhoods? Being poor? Let me clue you in, they CHOSE to be in thier situation...lazy ppl like welfare and food stamps and section 8...then they make millions off rapping about it? HELLLLLLLO? Take off the ROSE colored glasses and come down to earth. Parents, schools and even the work place have no control over kids anymore...no respect what so ever and what music are they listening to?
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Old 09-19-2006, 11:28 AM
 
Location: NJ
502 posts, read 1,722,785 times
Reputation: 530
I am not naive about rap music. I just made the choice not to only see one side of the story. I choose not to generalize. I see both sides and just like Rock-n-Roll, Rap has good and bad. I'm not defending rap music. I'm just trying to get across that there is good and bad in both Rap as there is in Rock music. I mean there is even Christian Rap music just like there is Christian Rock.

Let's discuss Rock-n-Roll for a moment. First we have the slogan Sex, Drugs and Rock-n-Roll. Also when did the promiscuity and drugs become a huge problem? Wasn't that in the 60s, 70s? As far as I know Rap music wasn't even in the picture. It was all Rock-n-Roll on its own back then. Weren't parents losing their minds then just like they are now about the same things? Wasn't there many rock-n-roll musician deaths related to drug and alcohol overdoses or suicides? Didn't many people get Aids due to their promiscuity during that era?

Most of my family listens to Rap and Rock and we are all professionals, hard working law abiding citizens. My nephew and nieces listen to rap and we never had a problem with it. They are smart and are well guided by their parents so they know right from a wrong and aren't so weak minded that if they hear a message in a song they go and run with it like it's the bible. I'm not negating the fact that there are many misguided children out there that don't know the difference and are influenced negatively but it is not just by Gangster Rap but also by Rock Music and Violent Movies. I'm sure that a teenager watching the Sopranos isn't the best influence there is. If you are going to discuss negative influnces on teenagers, don't just discuss the one that personally bugs you. Put it all out on the table Gangster Rap is not all that is negative!

Furthermore, I dance to hip hop and rap and I don't grind up against anyone. Dancing has always brought freaks to the Dance floor regardless of what music is playing. It is all about the individual. Yes, I agree sex sells; it always has. That is why Paris Hilton, Jessica Simpson, Lindsay Logan, Pamela Anderson and Carmen Electra and a many others are in our faces 24/7 (Also not the best influence for teenagers).

A Quick list off the top of my head of rap songs with a positive message:
1. The Light by Common (Love song)
2. Mary J. Blige and Method Man - I'll Be There for You/You're All I Need (Love song)
3. I need love by LL Cool J (Love Song)
4. Rappers Delight, Sugarhill Gang (having a good time)
5. Children Story by Slick Rick (why you shouldn't live a life a crime)
5. Jesus Walks by Kanye West

Dance By Nas
[lyrics cut out - copyrights]

Last edited by Administrator; 09-19-2006 at 11:48 AM.. Reason: lyrics cut out - copyrights
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Old 09-19-2006, 04:35 PM
 
Location: Colorado
10,010 posts, read 11,918,064 times
Reputation: 2027
Quote:
Originally Posted by mom4 View Post
I have 2 teenage girls ages 15/17 and 2 small boys and they are very good kids. My oldest girl is a dancer for the high school band. She performs with other girls during the football games half time shows. My younger daughter is an art student involved with the art club. They are both A/B students and haven't been in any kind of trouble in or out of school, but the mouth has to go.....I cant understand why every issue has to be a debate. When my husband and I were kids if the parents said no or told us to do something that was the end of the story no questions asked. What happened in the last 30 years to change things. Now, I can try and blame the things they see on TV or the movies they watch or maybe its because we dont follow through on the grounding we give them. Sometimes I think its just more of a hassle for me to keep them grounded because if they are home driving me nuts I cant get any peace. They never disrespect anyone other than my husband and I. For example; today my daughter came to me and said her car needed gas (the car that we bought her as a gift with no contribution from her) I said you have your allowance use it towards gas and she said that she was saving for a trip that she is going on in 2 weeks and then she had the nerve to say "the next time you use my car could you contribute toward the gas" thats all I had to hear, first of all, her father and I pay for the gas each week with our money, I have only used her car 3 times since we bought it for her 3 months ago. We have not allowed her to get a job yet because between school classes which are mostly AP classes, her dance practices, and her 75 hours of community service she is doing for a school scholarship we thought it would be to much. I think that we are pretty good parents and we make our mistakes and learn from them along the way. I think we give our kids to much and dont ask for much in return. I listen to the girls talk about how other kids disrespect their teachers and thank god mine dont. When we were in school we would never even think of talking back to a teacher or any adult. The lack of respect from these kids is out of control. I like Pixieshmoo's remarks in another post about not smacking the crap out of our kids enough that was halarious!!! I remember when my younger daughter was in middle school she came home and told me that I couldnt smack her because that was child abuse and I could go to jail. I told her the peace I would get in jail would be well worth it. Parents are affraid to discipline their children or they are into the lets talk/time out thing. I believe in time out but sometimes that is not enough. A good smack gets the point accross quicker. My sister-in-law is into the talking thing and has brought her 3 children up with very much involvement in the church...... they are the worst kids out of all the grandchildren. We are trying a different approuch to parenting with our two younger sons.
I have two teenage boys and yes they debate about everything and argue with us about everything!! I told them they need to be lawyers!!!! It will get better, I still have two more to go and I am not looking forward to it, but I had my kids very young so I do still remember alot of the teenage excuses, they dont work for me!!!
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Old 09-19-2006, 06:42 PM
 
183 posts, read 846,292 times
Reputation: 229
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregsbabe1 View Post
I have two teenage boys and yes they debate about everything and argue with us about everything!! I told them they need to be lawyers!!!! It will get better, I still have two more to go and I am not looking forward to it, but I had my kids very young so I do still remember alot of the teenage excuses, they dont work for me!!!
You sound just like me I still remember when I was young. I also have two more to go. Maybe I will try something a little different.
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Old 09-19-2006, 08:32 PM
 
Location: Jersey
2,094 posts, read 4,459,641 times
Reputation: 899
Quote:
Originally Posted by CelticLady1 View Post
Ah, "The Mother's Curse". Let me tell you that it works! My daughter and son-in-law have two sons; one is six, going on seven, the younger one will be three next month. They are in the air force, overseas at the moment, so I get alot of phone calls. Not one goes by without a tale or two about their behaviour, especially Son # 2! She keeps telling me that I didn't have to get so carried away with the curse, but, I remind her that there is another mother involved, (her mother-in-law), who surely had a hand in it as well.
I so enjoy her stories, and yes, I remind her that she's only getting what she dished out to me. So, hang in there, Mom4! You'll get your reward!
I second that! My mom used to wish kids on me! She'd say things like "I hope you have a lot of healty, smart, beautiful children...and who are just like you!" And I used to think to myself (That's right lady, they'll be cool just like me ) or she'd say "I can't wait until you have kids and they answer back!" And of course, I had all the answers "I'll be a cool mom" "I won't yell at my kids or give them too many rules"....yeah, right. Well, my end of it went "ka-plat" because I'm the typical "mean" mom who has all these rules and asks my kids where they're going, what their friends #'s and addresses are, who their parents are if they want to go over after school. They can't sleep over or go in a car, etc. if I don't actually KNOW the parents very well. They only have about one or two friends each that I trust enough for sleepovers. Just like my mom was "mean" for doing that to us....I guess my mom won. My kids are all snotty know it alls, especially girls. They're not even in high school yet, but they've known everything there is to know about the whole world and the people in it, since they were about 6 years old. No matter what you say the answer you get is " I KNOOOOOOW" or "O-KAAAAAAY" or "GOD (sounds more like gaaaaaaaaad". This includes much eye-rolling, I swear their eyes are going to get stuck in the backs of their heads. After this takes place, there's usually some stopping off in some direction or other with mumbling under the breath (which I assume to be something like "I hate her or I hate my life, I wish I had different parents"...you get the point. I've also had to slap my hands over my mouth plenty of times because I heard my mom or dad trying to squeeze their way out of my lips!!!!! I've used the common come back "So, if your friends all jumped off a bridge, would you do it too". To which my kids snottily reply "well, why not, if they're all going". AAAAAGGGGHHHHH!!!!!! I don't know how I'm not bald or tucked away safely in an insane asylum with a straight jacket. Everyone I know who has kids daughters is going through this, especially with daughters (any age) and sons who are in their teens. Unfortunately, I think we're outnumbered right now, not to mention, I am getting my payback because my daughters are just like I was (only I wasn't snotty until I was actually in my teens). I have actually stopped and thought to myself "oh my God, she's me", about all of my kids, at different times and in different situations. How my parents must be up there laughing and rolling around having a good time witnessing this scene down here. I guess I'm not much cooler than they thought they were before they had me!

By the way, that child abuse thing doesn't go over well in my house. I do not "beat" my kids, however, I was raised, if you mouth off, it's either your mouth or your ass (or both) that's getting smacked. I also had a father who was a cop, so his theory was "I am the law" in this house. So we weren't going to get anywhere by threatening anything to them. That's how my house is...you mouth off, you get smacked (more like a tough patting, but if it's done correctly, it will embarass the crap out of them for future reference). Don't mouth off, we're totally cool. I would never tell a parent to haul off and hit their child and I'm not bragging by recommending a swatting. And for the record, people who commit child abuse/neglect/molestation should be sent directly to the electric chair, however, this crap with kids threatening their parents with DYFS and such is bullsh*t. When we (as in most people on this forum) were kids, if you ever threatened your parents, you may as well have just walked yourself to the emergency room to await your beating. Kids would NEVER even think of doing or saying something like that to their parents back then.
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Old 09-20-2006, 01:58 AM
 
Location: PSL,FL
421 posts, read 36,045 times
Reputation: 87
Sex, drugs and rock and roll....the drug was pot, not crack...and the sex was pre-aids and please show me one rock song that compares to this, http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/50cent/howtorob.html...you obviously do not see the connection of gangsta rap and crime and STDs. I don't see ppl who try to look like Paris Hilton or any of the others you mentioned, packing a 440 in the back of thier pants. One final thought for you, in the 60s they weren't running the streets in packs beating on ppl...Aids started in 81...and came from Africa with a gay man. You mentioned Kanye West
....I take it you don't know of his extensive rap sheet? I take it you don't know he HATES white ppl?

Last edited by RAINBOWWAVES; 09-20-2006 at 02:16 AM..
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Old 09-20-2006, 07:20 AM
 
Location: NJ
502 posts, read 1,722,785 times
Reputation: 530
Quote:
Originally Posted by pixieshmoo View Post
I second that! My mom used to wish kids on me! She'd say things like "I hope you have a lot of healty, smart, beautiful children...and who are just like you!" And I used to think to myself (That's right lady, they'll be cool just like me ) or she'd say "I can't wait until you have kids and they answer back!" And of course, I had all the answers "I'll be a cool mom" "I won't yell at my kids or give them too many rules"....yeah, right. Well, my end of it went "ka-plat" because I'm the typical "mean" mom who has all these rules and asks my kids where they're going, what their friends #'s and addresses are, who their parents are if they want to go over after school. They can't sleep over or go in a car, etc. if I don't actually KNOW the parents very well. They only have about one or two friends each that I trust enough for sleepovers. Just like my mom was "mean" for doing that to us....I guess my mom won. My kids are all snotty know it alls, especially girls. They're not even in high school yet, but they've known everything there is to know about the whole world and the people in it, since they were about 6 years old. No matter what you say the answer you get is " I KNOOOOOOW" or "O-KAAAAAAY" or "GOD (sounds more like gaaaaaaaaad". This includes much eye-rolling, I swear their eyes are going to get stuck in the backs of their heads. After this takes place, there's usually some stopping off in some direction or other with mumbling under the breath (which I assume to be something like "I hate her or I hate my life, I wish I had different parents"...you get the point. I've also had to slap my hands over my mouth plenty of times because I heard my mom or dad trying to squeeze their way out of my lips!!!!! I've used the common come back "So, if your friends all jumped off a bridge, would you do it too". To which my kids snottily reply "well, why not, if they're all going". AAAAAGGGGHHHHH!!!!!! I don't know how I'm not bald or tucked away safely in an insane asylum with a straight jacket. Everyone I know who has kids daughters is going through this, especially with daughters (any age) and sons who are in their teens. Unfortunately, I think we're outnumbered right now, not to mention, I am getting my payback because my daughters are just like I was (only I wasn't snotty until I was actually in my teens). I have actually stopped and thought to myself "oh my God, she's me", about all of my kids, at different times and in different situations. How my parents must be up there laughing and rolling around having a good time witnessing this scene down here. I guess I'm not much cooler than they thought they were before they had me!

By the way, that child abuse thing doesn't go over well in my house. I do not "beat" my kids, however, I was raised, if you mouth off, it's either your mouth or your ass (or both) that's getting smacked. I also had a father who was a cop, so his theory was "I am the law" in this house. So we weren't going to get anywhere by threatening anything to them. That's how my house is...you mouth off, you get smacked (more like a tough patting, but if it's done correctly, it will embarass the crap out of them for future reference). Don't mouth off, we're totally cool. I would never tell a parent to haul off and hit their child and I'm not bragging by recommending a swatting. And for the record, people who commit child abuse/neglect/molestation should be sent directly to the electric chair, however, this crap with kids threatening their parents with DYFS and such is bullsh*t. When we (as in most people on this forum) were kids, if you ever threatened your parents, you may as well have just walked yourself to the emergency room to await your beating. Kids would NEVER even think of doing or saying something like that to their parents back then.
Pixie, when you described your kids, I feel like I've know them my whole life. I think you just described every kid in America. I also don't believe in hitting either. When I was acting up as a child, all my father had to do was give me the look. My father never had to lay a finger on me. My mother on the other hand smacked me upside the head once in while because she didn't posses the look. With my father, the look still works today. Also my mother always reminds me that just because I'm 34 and I have children of my own it doesn't mean that she can't still slap me upside the head. Gosh, I love that woman so much.
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