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Everyone keeps saying that the OP shouldn't try to change her husband. That's she's the one that needs to make all the changes, and my question is: why?
I don't think anyone said this. I (and others) have said that you can only change yourself. She CANNOT change her husband; god knows she has tried! Ideally he will mature and his priorities will shift and will choose to change himself, but nagging, begging, crying, yellng, will not change her husband. SHE is the one here asking for advice, so we are telling her things SHE can do to change that might help improve the relationship, to break the cycle of contempt breeding contempt, and MAYBE that will cause hub to WANT to step up and do better. But all she has control over is HER behavior. It really is a control struggle, and people like to win control struggles. They are not winnable.
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As for splitting up, sometimes people are just happier apart. ..... You have to decide how much of yourself you can sacrifice to keep the other partner happy.
This is very true. However OP has said that she does not currently want to end the marriage. Because she has no work visa, she cannot support herself (child support payments alone would not do it). Counseling is imperative to try to make this marriage work.
I don't think anyone said this. I (and others) have said that you can only change yourself. She CANNOT change her husband; god knows she has tried! Ideally he will mature and his priorities will shift and will choose to change himself, but nagging, begging, crying, yellng, will not change her husband. SHE is the one here asking for advice, so we are telling her things SHE can do to change that might help improve the relationship, to break the cycle of contempt breeding contempt, and MAYBE that will cause hub to WANT to step up and do better. But all she has control over is HER behavior. It really is a control struggle, and people like to win control struggles. They are not winnable.
This is very true. However OP has said that she does not currently want to end the marriage. Because she has no work visa, she cannot support herself (child support payments alone would not do it). Counseling is imperative to try to make this marriage work.
Work visa? I missed this. What should she need that for? Isn't she a legal citizen?
Work visa? I missed this. What should she need that for? Isn't she a legal citizen?
I'm on a H4 dependent visa until we get a green card. We moved down to the US from Canada for hubs' job.
So it's not like I'm completely at his mercy, I can technically go back to Canada and stay with my family, but as I said,
I'm not quite at the point where I'm unhappy enough to do it. We do have a good family and decent marriage overall, I think
the problems we do have are not that major and don't quite qualify as grounds for throwing it all away.
Public service announcement: If a group of women are discussing the difficult realities of being wives and mothers, and offering constructive advice to another woman who is struggling with the demands of her life ... it might not be the best time for a man to suggest that all they need to do is try harder like his sainted wife and mother. Has there ever been a woman who took kindly to this advice?
If you will look back at my original post, you'll see that I equally blamed the two of them.
I think they both got used to being bailed out by parents/grandparents. This makes me suspect spoilage in their own upbringing and from the get go.
They don't want to grow up and accept the full responsibility for their joint choice/decision to have children/ a child. It is obvious from what the OP said, that now that they are completely on their own they both resent the endless work of raising THEIR child. The harsh reality has now kicked in: child rearing is more often than not, really hard, exhausting, and thankless work.
Each one is placing blame on the other. They have lost their instant and willing babysitters, and are now experiencing what the real world is like.
I see fault with the two, not just the one.
FYI: Life is not fair. Sometimes you have to carry a full load.
But by all means, seek out some professional counseling to see if what I said rings/is true.
Last edited by picklejuice; 02-26-2013 at 02:46 PM..
If you honestly think him walking out is a possibility, then you are really in a precarious position. Honestly, I've never seen a marriage where someone seriously thought their spouse had any likelihood of walking out where the spouse didn't eventually do so. And your situation is made much more precarious by your visa situation, since you and your son are utterly dependent on him financially.
I think in_newengland is right: you have to disengage from the whole conflict for the sake of your marriage. You need breaks, absolutely. It sounds like despite the whining* your husband is willing to give them to you a couple times a month, and those who pointed out that you can supplement that with a mother's helper, trading childcare with a friend, and what-have-you are right. And you can gradually train your son to let you alone a bit while you sit nearby and read a book or what-have-you. You can get what you need, but you cannot change your husband's attitude towards spending time with his son, and trying to do so is hurting your marriage.
* Your interactions with your husband kind of reminded me of this article. Doubly so if the whining ever causes you to say something like, "Oh, forget it. I just won't go."
I would love for the OP to read the article linked in this post ^ and begin down the path of operant conditioning. You CAN change your husband's behavior! Read Don't Shoot The Dog by Karen Pryor. You will learn how to create and shape the behaviors you want and how to decrease and eliminate unwanted behaviors. Operant conditioning is effective with every species, including humans. I practice it all day every day with dogs as part of my profession, and I bring it with me into every other area of my life. There's been a recurring theme echoed throughout this thread: "You can't change him". Even the OP herself has asked "but how can I get him to change?" Animal trainers have figured it out! It really does work on humans. You'll be absolutely amazed.
I don't think anyone said this. I (and others) have said that you can only change yourself. She CANNOT change her husband; god knows she has tried! Ideally he will mature and his priorities will shift and will choose to change himself, but nagging, begging, crying, yellng, will not change her husband. SHE is the one here asking for advice, so we are telling her things SHE can do to change that might help improve the relationship, to break the cycle of contempt breeding contempt, and MAYBE that will cause hub to WANT to step up and do better. But all she has control over is HER behavior. It really is a control struggle, and people like to win control struggles. They are not winnable.
I got ya. You're right, she shouldn't try to change him and I missworded that.
That said, in the larger scheme of things, the cynic in me believes that if the genders were reversed, people wouldn't be so quick to let the working mom off the hook (What? She's doing the best that she can. She spends 90 minutes a night the with kid and gives him a bath at night? She'll be better with him when he's older. She'll come around). But maybe I'm being too cynical.
I guess one major thing that I've realized from all these posts is that I do need to work on my expectations when it comes to fairness and 'keeping score', as many posters have picked up on.
This is something that was always a big part of my personality for whatever reason, I'm extremely big on fairness - I'm a diligent rule-follower and law-abider, I've never gone through a rebellious stage as a child or teen, and even as a kid I responded best to deals and negotiating, I was great at drawing up and following through with agreements; I remember around 4 or 5 yo my dad's best way to get me to do something was to 'make a deal' and shake hands on it, and from then on I would always do what I said I would. I'm huge on 'playing fair', and even now it bothers me a lot when things in life don't happen 'fairly', like say when someone gets a job based on connections rather than ability. Yea I know, 'life isn't fair, deal with it and put on your big-girl panties' and all that, but...as i said it's just a huge part of my personality.
Which is why, when I've encountered run-ins with DH, and I can now see DS has a LOT of his personality as well, it simply baffled me - they'll both refuse to do something, for instance, just because they refuse it - no logic and no amount of cajoling or reward system works to convince them otherwise. I mean DS has the excuse of being 3, but I really think it's just a character difference. To me that was just puzzling - I mean, I'm offering a FAIR way to split things up, YOU get what you want, I get what I want, all good, fair and square, right? Uhh, no...why? Because I don't feel like it. *bash head on wall*
I remember when we just moved in together, we went through a few weeks of squabbles over minor things, one was the TV - DH would only watch a couple of shows but didn't really care too much either way, and was used to having it off the rest of the time. I was used to always having it on as background noise and also had a few shows I liked to watch regularly. Neither of us enjoyed what the other watched, with the exceptions of a few shows we both liked. So DH would watch his show, then when I wanted to watch mine he'd start complaining: this stuff is so stupid, how can you watch this, uggh, just turn the thing off, let's go do X instead...When I'd get offended and point out that HE got to watch, he'd say ok, I don't have to watch. I suggested having us both have slots of time to watch our stuff so, again, it's fair...but he'd prefer to just have the tv off all the time just so he doesn't have to listen to my 'stupid' shows. I eventually won him over on this one, but again, it was always baffling to me: why have both people not getting their way, rather than both compromise so that both DO get their way some of the time?...Difference in personalities...
I would love for the OP to read the article linked in this post ^ and begin down the path of operant conditioning. You CAN change your husband's behavior! Read Don't Shoot The Dog by Karen Pryor. You will learn how to create and shape the behaviors you want and how to decrease and eliminate unwanted behaviors. Operant conditioning is effective with every species, including humans. I practice it all day every day with dogs as part of my profession, and I bring it with me into every other area of my life. There's been a recurring theme echoed throughout this thread: "You can't change him". Even the OP herself has asked "but how can I get him to change?" Animal trainers have figured it out! It really does work on humans. You'll be absolutely amazed.
Yes, forgot to mention - thanks to the poster who linked the article, it was a great and hilarious read, and I may try and implement it and see what happens...it kind of sounds funny and overly simple in a way...but hell, who knows, won't hurt to try .
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