Pitt Applies for membership in ACC (Pittsburgh: metro, lowest, state)

[cry_havoc]

Originally Posted by JoeP

Apparently not.

Apparently so.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by MathmanMathman

I think more weighted toward market.

I think you need a more sophisticated model to understand how these conferences are formulating their strategies. Again, the primary financial goal is for your conference network to become a must-carry on lucrative systems, which even by itself requires some sophistication. But you also have to think defensively about the possibility that other conferences will try to raid your conference. All this makes it more than a little naive to just approach this as a game in which you pluck out isolated schools which are popular in big markets, both because that may cause your conference network to fall short of must-carry status in those markets, and because it could leave you vulnerable to future raids.

They don't need WVU. Besides they aren't AAU. Pitt-Penn State still have bad blood.

But the Big Ten is already getting a ton of marketing benefit out of Penn State, so restoring a rivalry with Pitt wouldn't really do all that much for the conference. Generally, the precise problem is that Pitt doesn't really add much to the Big Ten's network sales pitch, given what they already are getting out of Ohio State and Penn State.

Nebraska lost its AAU status afterwards.

They actually lost it before officially joining, and in any event, it is a precedent if they want to use it. Generally, I think it is clear the Big Ten has a preference for flagship state universities with good academics, which overlaps considerably with AAU schools, and they had previously expressed some interest in staying all-AAU (although see comment about ND below). But particularly with the Big Ten NOT being all-AAU anymore, I am not sure it would really be a barrier to adding a school like Virginia Tech if that was their best move otherwise, since Virginia Tech really is on a par with many of the Big Ten schools academically. However, it might be reason enough for them to prefer Virginia over Virginia Tech if they were choosing.

Not anything. The Big Ten has been very predictable at least when it comes to AAU schools.

Um, they certainly would have added Notre Dame if they could have.

Edit: By the way, if UNC was willing to leave behind Duke, then a combination of UVA and UNC would pretty much tick off every known box for the Big Ten as it went to 16. It would also work to add UVA and a school like Kansas (if they aren't done with western expansion).

[cry_havoc]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

I'd prefer actual confirmable data, since the impressions people post on the Internet are often inaccurate (particularly when they have been passed around among people with a personal vested interest in the topic).

We would be glad to share it in the appropriate forum. I'm not hijacking the Pittsburgh forum with a WVU discussion. It is irrelevant to Pittsburgh, Pitt, and the ACC problems.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by MathmanMathman

But with WVU, the Big 12 might find itself in a position to add east coast teams to make a 16-team conference. It can move after the SEC and the Big Ten have their pick but even then, there will be good teams and markets left over. Too good to pass up if the Big 12 wants to be competitive with the SEC and Big Ten.

Again, I understand the logic of the Big 12 trying to move into the East Coast to pick up whatever the Big Ten and SEC leave available. I just don't see how WVU actually makes much of a difference since it isn't much of an East Coast school. In other words, with or without WVU, the logic and opportunities for the Big 12 would be pretty much the same.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by cry_havoc

We would be glad to share it in the appropriate forum. I'm not hijacking the Pittsburgh forum with a WVU discussion.

Isn't it a little late to close that barn door? In your view it is appropriate for you to make claims in this forum about WVU's presence in states like NJ, but it is off topic for me to ask you to provide evidence to back up those claims?

That makes no sense.

[sskink]

As an aside, if I were a WVU alum and even if I was really happy in the B12, I'd still be pretty pissed off this morning as it's crystal clear the ACC lied to WVU about just about everything by taking in Louisville - a school with comparable athletics but worse academics and a secondary market in its state.

[JoeP]

the ACC lied to WVU about just about everything by taking in Louisville

?

a school with comparable athletics but worse academics

and a secondary market in its state

Metro Louisville is by far the largest market in its state and for also its metro area is well over half the total population of WV.

[sskink]

Originally Posted by JoeP

Metro Louisville is by far the largest market in its state and for also its metro area is well over half the total population of WV.

You're being too literal. Lexington is smaller, but UK owns KY and TV sets. Adding L'Ville was simply a defense against potential B12 poaching. All the arguments against adding WVU last year were tossed aside in order to make this strategy work.

And yes, despite their rep as hillbillies, WVU does have better academics than Louisville.

[cry_havoc]

Originally Posted by sskink

As an aside, if I were a WVU alum and even if I was really happy in the B12, I'd still be pretty pissed off this morning as it's crystal clear the ACC lied to WVU about just about everything by taking in Louisville - a school with comparable athletics but worse academics and a secondary market in its state.

Lville has worse athletics than WVU but I am not pissed. WVU was desperate last year and probably would have joined the ACC after the SEC told WVU they were waiting to see what happened to the Big 12 before accepting them. WVU then would have been trapped in the ACC and making less money. I am grateful about how things worked out.

Back on topic. This does undermine the ACC's credibility and shows it no longer cares about academics. It also shows how desperate the ACC is. Still it was the best choice for the ACC and I feel it is the smart thing to do. The ACC realized their football schools were unhappy and are finally trying to please them. The issue now is will Lville satisfy them.

[cry_havoc]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

Isn't it a little late to close that barn door? In your view it is appropriate for you to make claims in this forum about WVU's presence in states like NJ, but it is off topic for me to ask you to provide evidence to back up those claims?

That makes no sense.

The issue was settled. I am willing to go a little off topic but we settled this. Like I said I will address this in the appropriate forum.