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This is the most asinine part of the medical system here. Instead of getting a single bill from the hospital, you get individual bills from each and every doctor you see. For a surgery, you'll get bills from the surgeon, anesthesiologist, doctor doing after-care, and the hospital itself.
It becomes impossible to budget for this because the bills keep coming, sometimes months after the actual surgery.
It would be like going to Walmart and getting bills from the deli, soda aisle, and dairy department, months after you shopped.
Most hospitals that contract out certain services, generally require providers to be in the same networks. It does not however eliminate independent billing.
I got electricity going through my heart, from my left arm and out the right arm, 3 years back.
Called my doctor, 10 min later I took an EKG at his office, 30 min later I was at the ER for a full check up and spent the night in the heart ward.
Was checked in the morning, everything was OK. Walked down the stairs and said bye to the personal at the entrance and walked out.
Never seen a bill.
Thats healthcare in Norway.
That is great, but don't make it out like everything is free. And it might work great for you. I don't think too many here would like it once they see the real costs for that free healthcare.
Income tax at 28-32% , Food items at 14% , Gas at taxed crazily , and at $7 a gallon. 25% sales tax And you still have to pay your CAP's , not that they are all that much. But this doesn't look free to me.
Oh yes. They hire the meanest collection agencies out there. A friend capped his insurance. After taking EVERTTHING they dragged is butt into court 4 times a year until the statute of limitations ran out.
I remember him saying, "What the hell am I supposed to do with an 800K bill?" He was worth ~$500K before (mostly home equity) and had never been laid off until he reached 63 years old.
Another friend had an X ray taken by one of those independent contractors that prowl E Rooms. They garnished like 4 months of wages. $6K for an X ray.
The Internet is chock full of anecdotal horror stories and not all of them are true.
Sounds like "your friend" took the risk of being uninsured if he was expected to pay an $800,000 bill out of pocket.
Hospitals typically sell their uncollected debt to the highest bidder.
I am hard- pressed to imagine a collection agency pursuing a court order for wage garnishment for $6000 of unsecured debt. If that was the case, the courts would be clogged with suits for judgments for revolving credit card debt from people who don't make minimum payments.
I never understood why the provider bills more than it contractually agreed to be paid.
Every insurance company is billed at the price set by the provider for the particular service code because different providers reimburse at different rates. If one company pays more and other companies are being biled a lower base rate, the company paying more will want the lower base charge and will pay less.
The EOB will list the base charge (the same for every patient, regardless of pay status), the allowed amount, the negotiated discount, how much the insurance company will pay, and the patient share.
That is great, but don't make it out like everything is free. And it might work great for you. I don't think too many here would like it once they see the real costs for that free healthcare.
Income tax at 28-32% , Food items at 14% , Gas at taxed crazily , and at $10 a gallon. 25% sales tax And you still have to pay your CAP's , not that they are all that much. But this doesn't look free to me.
How much tax do you think we pay? Add it up and don't forget to include sales tax, state and local taxes, social security and medicare tax.
The United States had the 25th lowest tax wedge among the 35 OECD member countries in 2016. The country occupied the same position in 2015. The average single worker in the United States faced a tax wedge of 31.7% in 2016 compared with the OECD average of 36.0%
Norway had the 21st highest tax wedge among the 35 OECD member countries in 2016. The country had the 20th highest position in 2015. The average single worker in Norway faced a tax wedge of 36.2% in 2016 compared with the OECD average of 36.0%. Taxing Wages 2017 - en - OECD
In Norway healthcare is 100% free for children, and adults have a maximum annual co-pay of $261. Childcare is capped at $299 a month. College education is free and all citizens are eligible for a pension at age 67. Add our costs for healthcare, childcare and college tuition to that 31.7% tax burden and Norway's system starts to look pretty darned good.
The Internet is chock full of anecdotal horror stories and not all of them are true.
Sounds like "your friend" took the risk of being uninsured if he was expected to pay an $800,000 bill out of pocket.
Hospitals typically sell their uncollected debt to the highest bidder.
I am hard- pressed to imagine a collection agency pursuing a court order for wage garnishment for $6000 of unsecured debt. If that was the case, the courts would be clogged with suits for judgments for revolving credit card debt from people who don't make minimum payments.
Two different people.
The 800K bill. He capped his insurance. The actual bill was 1,800,000.
As to the 6K guy. Guess again.
Her insurance listed cheaper alternatives and the date the corporate policy was going into effect concerning ER visits of a non-emergency nature. Live and learn. Caveat emptor.
I almost died from septic shock due to viral penumonia back in 2005. Guess where I found out that I was in septic shock? Urgent care. Because I followed my carrier's rules that day, my total bill for a week in private intensive care and all the trimmings was something like $450.
Last year, I had a really bad cough and was actually coughing up blood. But because I know if what I have turns out to be no big deal, an ER billing dept and my insurance carrier will prison rape me, I decided t find a doctor in my network, set up an appointment, get that checked out along with a physical, and it turns out it is a common symptom given my pneumonia history and having acid reflux. My XRay was through network, so was blood work. Whole thing cost me like $250. Had I panicked and gone to ER, I'd have been out of pocket to the tune of $10k no sweat.
I've learned not to panic. It's a big money saver. I've also learned to read fine print in contracts I sign. Again, big money saver.
I have no sympathy for people who do not read fine print, panic, or expect others to do their paying attention for them. I certainly don't feel a need to overhaul an entire industry in America in order to placate such people.
How much tax do you think we pay? Add it up and don't forget to include sales tax, state and local taxes, social security and medicare tax.
The United States had the 25th lowest tax wedge among the 35 OECD member countries in 2016. The country occupied the same position in 2015. The average single worker in the United States faced a tax wedge of 31.7% in 2016 compared with the OECD average of 36.0%
Norway had the 21st highest tax wedge among the 35 OECD member countries in 2016. The country had the 20th highest position in 2015. The average single worker in Norway faced a tax wedge of 36.2% in 2016 compared with the OECD average of 36.0%. Taxing Wages 2017 - en - OECD
In Norway healthcare is 100% free for children, and adults have a maximum annual co-pay of $261. Childcare is capped at $299 a month. College education is free and all citizens are eligible for a pension at age 67. Add our costs for healthcare, childcare and college tuition to that 31.7% tax burden and Norway's system starts to look pretty darned good.
My Federal income tax will be either 24% or 22%
Michigan State income tax is 4.25%
Food is zero
Sales tax is 6%
gas is around $2.30 here
We pay roughly $8k a year for BC/BS for our healthcare with an $8k deductible
Norway yearly co pay is closer $600
Gas is $7 a gallon, 80% goes to taxes
Food is taxed at 14%
Sales tax is 14%
Income tax is 28-32%
Sorry, I'll take my country over the utopia of Norway. Do the math. For those that smoke, how does $15 a pack sound to you ? I don't know ,but I'm sure the cost of cigars and bourbon is huge compared to here. What would the cost of hobby type things be ? I read it's illegal to snowmobile there, not sure about dirt bikes or ATV's. WTF ?! Really ? What do people do ? No guns, either...
Do people just hang out and drink (if they can afford it) listening to A-HA all day
This website says the cost of living is 59% higher than the US. Think about that. Nothing is free.
Moderator cut: link removed, linking to competitor sites is not allowed
Last edited by Yac; 02-14-2018 at 07:23 AM..
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