Do you see America headed towards pan-enclavism/enclavism? (multiculturalism, illegal immigration, v)
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This concept is based on the assumption that real people in America are insecure and are uncomfortable around others who are not like them. That may be true of many on this forum but is not the case in the real world. Except for a small vocal minority that thinks they are being persecuted, are socially paranoid, or live in a self-defined status of victim-hood, most people successfully live, work, worship, and associate with others who are quite different. Some people thrive on that. In spite of claims to the contrary, that is one of our unique strengths.
Society has created de facto enclaves but many people want to be out, not in.
Why not focus on the positive benefits? Enclaves provide economic opportunities and social capital that mass society is unable to provide.
"Pan-Enclavism calls for a serious of homogenous and semi-autonomous communities that are part of a broader multi-ethnic and multi-cultural patchwork. It encourages neighborhoods to think of themselves as a people with shared bonds and it celebrates and supports existing ethnic and immigrant enclaves. It also calls for those who don’t currently take part in enclavism to emulate diasporas in creating their own enclaves, for building communities based on an identity, for freedom of association as the main principle, for the creation of opt-in groups, places value in people having these groups to help fulfill their personal needs, and opposes primary loyalty to mass society. These enclaves could be based upon an ethnic background but are flexible in that they could be multi-ethnic communities of people with shared values, such as politics, religion, culture, or aesthetic preference. It calls for thinking in terms of an area as a community that serves its residents rather than just a place to live and work with the added benefit of a balance in political and economic power. There are some similarities to Ethnopluralism."
"A future of enclavism in California could either be many people emulating the existing immigrant diaspora model within the current legal framework, freedom of association under a Neighborhood Freedom Amendment in the State Constitution, or a millet system. Under this scenario enclaves would be able to build up for their people without the concerns of whether they have to keep out or accommodate outsiders."
What about freedom of association? It is the idea that individuals can chose who they sell to, rent to, do business with, even if based upon ingroup identity?
We have Freedom of Association. 90% of people who say their for it, don’t currently realize we have it and are just racists who hope their neighbor will discriminate with them…
Americans have never been more free to associate than today, that’s while damn near every neighborhood including many ethnically Hispanic and Black neighborhoods are largely integrating.
We've had segregated enclaves for decades upon decades. It did not help in having a truly united country. You cannot have a truly united country and have segregated enclaves.
Most of the major metros are already broken up into enclaves of each and every race.
SoCal alone has Chinese SGV, Armenian nabes llike Glendale, Rich light skinned Beverly Hills, Brown skinned Anaheim, Black Inglewood, and Koreatown.
NYC has same thing.
This isn’t true at all. Now NYC definitely has some ethnic neighborhoods as well as L.A. but calling the SGV, Glendale, Beverly Hills, Anaheim, Inglewood or Koreatown ethnically homogenous is disingenuous.
Monterey Park is about 65% Asian American and the most in the SGV. It’s Asian population declined from 2020 when it was about 67%. It’s only 47.7% Chinese… it’s an ethnoburb but to call it an enclave or the SGV as a whole is not true, theirs damn near as many Hispanic people in the SGV as Chinese.
Glendale- is somewhere just above 40% Armenian
Beverly Hills- 78% White
Anaheim- 54% Latino
Inglewood- 41% Black (roughly 50% Latino)
Koreatown- 28%- Korean (old data but it’s becoming less Korean). Damn near more Mexicans live there than Koreans (25%+) and it’s 50% Hispanic.
Like I said, this trend of calling ethnically mixed neighborhoods and cities segregated needs to stop. They do exist but it’s almost never purposeful and it’s due to history or poverty.
It is not a reactionary system of oppression like Jim Crow, but rather a progressive system of autonomous ethnic (or other voluntary opt-in identity based) communities. It is pro-multi-culturalism.
Uh, no. Just...no.
When you talk about "autonomous ethnic communities" you're advocating either for racism or for bigotry. You appear to be trying to walk a thin line by having your segregation enforced by a private party instead of by the government.
You also either don't understand or deliberately misused the word "progressive". You're calling for a return to segregation - that would be regressive; your proposed "autonomous ethnic community" would be a return to practices outlawed over half a century ago.
This isn’t true at all. Now NYC definitely has some ethnic neighborhoods as well as L.A. but calling the SGV, Glendale, Beverly Hills, Anaheim, Inglewood or Koreatown ethnically homogenous is disingenuous.
Monterey Park is about 65% Asian American and the most in the SGV. It’s Asian population declined from 2020 when it was about 67%. It’s only 47.7% Chinese… it’s an ethnoburb but to call it an enclave or the SGV as a whole is not true, theirs damn near as many Hispanic people in the SGV as Chinese.
Glendale- is somewhere just above 40% Armenian
Beverly Hills- 78% White
Anaheim- 54% Latino
Inglewood- 41% Black (roughly 50% Latino)
Koreatown- 28%- Korean (old data but it’s becoming less Korean). Damn near more Mexicans live there than Koreans (25%+) and it’s 50% Hispanic.
Like I said, this trend of calling ethnically mixed neighborhoods and cities segregated needs to stop. They do exist but it’s almost never purposeful and it’s due to history or poverty.
Do you see a pattern here? Except for Beverly Hills all the others you mentioned have more Latinos/Mexicans than any other racial group and that is true of many more towns in Calif. Do I need to tell you why that is so? It's directly due to illegal immigration and that's neither natural nor lawful.
No the fastest growing population in the 2020 census by and large was the mixed race population.
Most intermarriages listed are actually Whites plus White Hispanics. After that it is White and Asian and even then there is a growing Eurasian based identity. Intermarriage creates new ethnic groups not abolishes race.
When you talk about "autonomous ethnic communities" you're advocating either for racism or for bigotry. You appear to be trying to walk a thin line by having your segregation enforced by a private party instead of by the government.
You also either don't understand or deliberately misused the word "progressive". You're calling for a return to segregation - that would be regressive; your proposed "autonomous ethnic community" would be a return to practices outlawed over half a century ago.
There was this obsession with integration on the left and with the melting pot among classical liberal republicans in the late 20th century. However all the politics of the late 20th century are obsolete as America is fragmenting.
"The perfect example of reconciling enclavism with YIMBYism is how Brooklyn’s Orthodox Jewish communities, such as the Satmar dynasty, operate with some degree of autonomy. These Hassidic communities need room to expand due to their high population growth and have been successfully petitioning the City of New York for changes in zoning or building permits to build larger and denser structures. These are projects that serve their community as they are smart enough to work around anti-freedom of association fair housing regulations. That Brooklyn’s Satmar community has succeeded in “building thousands of units and keeping the neighborhood affordable for families—on private land, and without public money—is a testament to their strongly pro-development attitudes and a bloc voting strategy reminiscent of the ethnic politics patterns of the Tammany Hall era.” This hybrid YIMBY-enclavist model makes much more sense than using restrictive zoning as a substitute for community cohesion or ethnocentrism."
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