Hate crimes: Gays vandalize SF Castro church! (first amendment, official, single)
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Didn't you get the memo? If we so much as voice any dissenting views against homosexuality, we are engaging in hatred.
And if anyone dares to criticize the Christian or Catholic church, they are labeled a "church hater" or bigot... even I've been called a Christian hater by a member here, with no basis other than my views on this issue (when in fact I am a supporter & occasional patron/performer at local churches - not to mention my own religious affiliation). So it's a two-way street, and I honestly wish BOTH sides of this argument would settle down & learn to respect each other.
Well, if you want to go gay-bashing, where's a better place than in the gay capital of the world? I'm not gonna go to Provo, Utah looking to mess with gays, I'm gonna go to the Castro, West Hollywood, Greenwich Village or Hillcrest...
I live in San Francisco and I have passed through Castro street many times and I have never seen any White men there with swastika t-shirts or swastika tatoos. Just like you will never see any neo-nazis roaming through Detroit or Compton to go physically attack Blacks. Neo-nazis know it is suicidal to go mess with blacks and gays in areas where those 2 groups have safety in numbers.
And if anyone dares to criticize the Christian or Catholic church, they are labeled a "church hater" or bigot... so it's a two-way street, and I honestly wish BOTH sides of this argument would settle down & learn to respect each other.
I'm still taken aback by the Christians who insist on participating heavily in discussions about gays when they've made it clear that they are anti-gay. It's just bizarre to me.
Tolerating someone means that you can co-exist peacefully with people you disagree with. Tolerating does not mean blind acceptance of someone. For example, many people may disagree with Christianity but are able to tolerate the beliefs of others without accepting those beliefs as truth.
Okay, I know we're getting into semantics now, but disagreeing and not accepting are two different things. I disagree with eating pork and fish myself, but you'd never hear me say "I don't accept people who eat that stuff." Tolerance is basically another word for acceptance, so that particular sentence he said was the height of hypocrisy. If he'd said "I disagree with homosexuality but tolerate their presence," I would say that's a more acceptable attitude.
I live in San Francisco and I have passed through Castro street many times and I have never seen any White men there with swastika t-shirts or swastika tatoos. Just like you will never see any neo-nazis roaming through Detroit or Compton to go physically attack Blacks. Neo-nazis know it is suicidal to go mess with blacks and gays in areas where those 2 groups have safety in numbers.
Ask the cops and they'll tell you: Gays are most often victims of gay-bashings in heavily gay neighborhoods.
Someone looking for a gay guy to attack isn't going to go out to Pleasanton looking for gays; he's almost undoubtedly going to go somewhere around the Castro District.
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Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale
I agree, and I sure wouldn't want to be friends with someone who says he can "tolerate gays, but not accept them". As a gay guy, I'd have to have really low self-esteem in order to "tolerate" being friends with someone like that.
Ok ... so does that mean that before someone can be friends with a Christian, that they have to accept their beliefs as factual and not just tolerate them?
Location: The Chatterdome in La La Land, CaliFUNia
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Originally Posted by gizmo980
And if anyone dares to criticize the Christian or Catholic church, they are labeled a "church hater" or bigot... even I've been called a Christian hater by a member here, with no basis other than my views on this issue (when in fact I am a supporter & occasional patron/performer at local churches - not to mention my own religious affiliation). So it's a two-way street, and I honestly wish BOTH sides of this argument would settle down & learn to respect each other.
I agree with the last comment. I and many Christians I know do not go around calling unbelievers church haters or bigots and I'm sorry that you have had that misfortunate experience with so-called Christians and so-called Catholics. Labeling someone a bigot or hater just because that person does not agree is a demonstration of immaturity if you asked my opinion.
Location: The Chatterdome in La La Land, CaliFUNia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale
I'm still taken aback by the Christians who insist on participating heavily in discussions about gays when they've made it clear that they are anti-gay. It's just bizarre to me.
When these issues affect the church, it affects us. This thread is about an attack on a Catholic church and I would not be so quick to label it a "gay" thread as the perpetrators nor the motives have been determined in this case.
Location: The Chatterdome in La La Land, CaliFUNia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gizmo980
Okay, I know we're getting into semantics now, but disagreeing and not accepting are two different things. I disagree with eating pork and fish myself, but you'd never hear me say "I don't accept people who eat that stuff." Tolerance is basically another word for acceptance, so that particular sentence he said was the height of hypocrisy. If he'd said "I disagree with homosexuality but tolerate their presence," I would say that's a more acceptable attitude.
I've had a homosexual in my family (he passed away) who I loved dearly despite the fact that I heavily disagreed with his lifestyle choice.
Ask the cops and they'll tell you: Gays are most often victims of gay-bashings in heavily gay neighborhoods.
Someone looking for a gay guy to attack isn't going to go out to Pleasanton looking for gays; he's almost undoubtedly going to go somewhere around the Castro District.
This is true.
Pleasanton only had 1 gay guy i knew of the whole 4 years i lived there.
It would be hard pickings to go find one to beat up out there, just not much volume.
The castro would be the place to be. Or you can assume anyone is gay and bash them like those guys IN Brooklyn did when they killed those 2 brothers on the assumption that they were gay.
The Church-goers are whining about some spray paint and yet people are DYING because they are not only gay, but even if you APPEAR gay you are fair game for homophobes to kill.
We ALL should be outraged.
Last edited by Taboo2; 01-08-2009 at 04:23 PM..
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