Calif gov Schwarzenegger signs ammo-registration bill into law (Michael Bloomberg, unemployment, brainwash)

[ecvMatt]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think the assult weapon ban ever expired in CA, so Arnie has no reason to re-introduce it.

Holder talked about a bad to reduce the amount of guns going from US to Mexico, but he dropped it pretty soon after he brough it up. There was no bill to re-introducing the ban. This year has been a good year for NRA and gun activists because of so many restrictions have been removed this year.

You are correct, Ca still has an assault weapon ban, although, there have been some pretty creative ways of getting around it and still being legal.

[lionking]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think the assult weapon ban ever expired in CA, so Arnie has no reason to re-introduce it.

Holder talked about a bad to reduce the amount of guns going from US to Mexico, but he dropped it pretty soon after he brough it up. There was no bill to re-introducing the ban. This year has been a good year for NRA and gun activists because of so many restrictions have been removed this year.

As far as I know California like New Jersey have their own ban despite it being sunset on a national level.

Obamas campaign site listed bringing back a "newer and better" aka expanded and permanent weapons ban, citizens became active against it so they dropped it "for now". However they want it don't kid yourself. It doesn't matter to them how effective against crime it would be. So then they lied, and they were exposed as lying in trying to tie weapons in Mexico as a reason to bring back the ban.

Evidence shows the ban was useless, they were caught lying about reasons why to bring back a ban. The question is why would they? So "trying to do the right thing" is a fail on them. Sad that many will vote for them anyway because they are loyalist Democrats.

[GOPATTA2D]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think the assult weapon ban ever expired in CA, so Arnie has no reason to re-introduce it.

Holder talked about a bad to reduce the amount of guns going from US to Mexico, but he dropped it pretty soon after he brough it up. There was no bill to re-introducing the ban. This year has been a good year for NRA and gun activists because of so many restrictions have been removed this year.

The only reason they [restrictions] were removed was because of the Supreme Court ruling. This law will not stand up either.

[dorock99]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

Yes, that is what you are arguing, and you do back it up by diluting numbers for bad states/areas with stats from non-violent areas. You are the one being dishonest here. It is a huge problem in some areas. Obviously you don't know too many victims of violent crime. Street gangs are a huge problem in many cities, and there are a lot of big cities in CA.

Yes, keep telling me how unlikely it is for you to be victimized by a street gang if you like in central Kansas.

Finn_Jarber the first sentence is the only accurate thing you've said thus far. However, while some states may have higher murder numbers due to size and population the overall indisputable fact remains true. Crime and violent crime are all falling nationwide. The numerator and the denominator are both decreasing year after year.

However, for the sake of the argument let's focus on California since that is where the law was passed.

http://ag.ca.gov/cjsc/publications/h...m05/Crimes.pdf


In 2005 The murder/homicide total in California was 2,503


Total Murders in the United States 16,692

Total Murders in California 2,503 (2,503/16692 = 14% of all homicides in the United States occur in California)

In other words 14% of the least committed crime in the United States occurs in California

Break Down in California by Race of those arrested for Homicide

White 19% (386)
Hispanic 48% (946)
Black 24% (487)
Other 7% (137)

Break Down in California by Contributing Circumstance (known 1,977 and unknown 526)

Robbery 151 (151/1977 = 7.6% of all homicides in California)
Arguments 791 (791/1977 = 40.0% of all homicides in California)
Gang Related 653 (653/1977 = 33.0% of all homicides in California)
Drugs 103 (103/1977 = 5.2% of all homicides in California)
Other 279 (279/1977) = 14.1% of all homicides in California)

In other words 33% of the least commited crime in California is Gang Related

Total Violent Crimes in California 189,593 (189,593/5,200,000 = 3.6% of violent crimes committed in the United States happen in California.)

Total Violent Crimes in United States 5,200,000


California Total Population 37 Million (12% of the United States Population)
United States 306 Million

Okay so California so here's the break down by occurrence

Known by the victim (friend, relative, etc) 957 murders
Stranger 638 murders
Unknown relationship 1082


74% of murder in California were committed with a fire arm



Gang Related 653 Murders in California (653/955 =68% of all Gang Related Murders in the United States occur in California)

Gang Related 955 Murder in the United States


2005 Total Crimes Committed in the State of California

http://stats.doj.ca.gov/cjsc_stats/prof07/00/1.htm

Property Crimes 722,333 (80% of all crimes in the state of California)
Violent Crimes 189,593 (20% of all crimes in the state of California)

Total Crimes 911,926 (3% of all crimes in the United States occur in California)

Total Crimes in the United States 23,000,000

Murders 2,503/189,593 = 1.3% of all violent crimes (and 0.27% of all total crimes)


Does creating a law "specifically" with the intent to lower crime by going after gang related homicide actually make anyone safer and lower the overall crime rate in the State of California?

Answer NO! Why?


Simple

656 Gang Related Murders (numerator)

911,926 Total Crimes (denominator)

=0.0719% of total crimes (not even close to 1% of total crimes)

Now how does it relate to violent crimes

656 Gang Related Murders (numerator)

189,593 Total Violent Crimes (denominator)


=0.34% (Again not even 1% of violent crimes)


Thus I've prove mathematically again that the creation of this law is complete and utter BS.

Just to prove my proof let's say all gang related homicides in the sate of California completely were eliminated to 0


2,503 - 656 =1,847

1,847 (which would equate to homicides dropping a full 26%)

1,847/189,593 = 0.97% of all violent crime (again less than 1%)

Old
1.3%

New
0.97%


Would have no effect on violent crime whatsoever and would have no effect on lowering the overall crime rate!

However, here's what an opportunistic dishonest politician would say to either get elected or pass an unfair/unjust law.

During my tenure as governor the Homicide Rate dropped 26% percent and i made you safer (which anyone with common sense that viewed the information, would know he is competely lying)

Or to pass an unfair/unjust law he might say

I'm passing this law because our streets are too violent (no evidence suggest this). This will help keep you safe from gangs and illegal firearms. Gang activity in the state of California accounts for more than 33% of all homicides (what he fails to tell you is homicide is the least comitted crime in the state). If something isn't done we will all fall victim to this senseless violence. I'm urging you to vote in favor of proposition "I'm an idiot 10." It is the only way that i can effectively keep you safe.

All of which is complete and utter BS! Anyway that's how they rope you in and get you to vote for things that are not in your best interest. As long as you sit on your lazy butt letting them feed you information like a baby, they can tell you what ever they want and get you to believe the sky is falling.

[GOPATTA2D]

Dorock. Check your math. I repeat - check your math. Your calculations are off slightly. Otherwise I agree with you completely.

[Finn_Jarber]

Originally Posted by GOPATTA2D

The only reason they [restrictions] were removed was because of the Supreme Court ruling. This law will not stand up either.

No, some removals were voted through at state level and some were voted through at Fed level and signed into law by Obama. See guns in national parks for example. Like I said, a good year for NRA and pro-gunners.

The SC was involved only in the DC ruling.

[Finn_Jarber]

Originally Posted by dorock99

In other words 14% of the least committed crime in the United States occurs in California

100% of the murders the Californians care about occur in California. Period.

[GOPATTA2D]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

No, some removals were voted through at state level and some were voted through at Fed level and signed into law by Obama. See guns in national parks for example. Like I said, a good year for NRA and pro-gunners.

The SS was involved only in the DC ruling.

They were removed at the state level as a preemtive measure AFTER the SC ruling.

[monkeywrenching]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

You'd be surprised, but Austria has pretty loose gun laws, much like Switzerland, so your character assassination attempt hits a brick wall of truth and facts.

sure thing, you can own semi automatic rifles and maching guns there, not.

maybe you should check out europes gun laws more carefully, besides switzerlands and theirs for the most part only effect their homegrown militia.

[harrycrat]

Guys,all of us pro gunners have to think how to appeal to non-gunners & anti-gunners...

Unless we put water in our wine & accept harmless restrictions,we will remain a vocal minority...

Already the gun free zones cover...half the area of any given city...

BTW,the USA gun culture is unique,no other nation comes even close,neither the Swiss ,nor the Finns or the Israelis..

It is lonely at the top...