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I agree about Gradishar. Larry Grantham should also have been in for a while now. Thank God Howley is finally in.
A lot of AFL players who started their careers when the league first started have gotten the shaft for years and Grantham is one of them.
5 time AFL All-star
5 time AFL first team all pro
5 time AFL second team all pro
And according to my Pro Football Encyclopedia fact book he missed 6 games in 14 seasons. For a few decades the old AFL players were getting shut out of canton with the exception of Lance Alworth and that would have been impossible to do. During 1962-1971 Alworth was the best wide receiver in the game and went in on his first year of eligibility and was also the youngest player to go in.
That's fair. I do think he's borderline, but on the side of the border that.. Eventually.. He would make it. So.. Why hold off?
Look at a comparison of Sapp vs McMichael
Mongo -
Super Bowl champion (XX)
2× First-team All-Pro (1985, 1987)
3× Second-team All-Pro (1986, 1988, 1991)
2× Pro Bowl (1986, 1987)
Tackles: 838
Sacks: 95
Interceptions: 2
Sapp -
Super Bowl champion (XXXVII)
NFL Defensive Player of the Year (1999)
4× First-team All-Pro (1999–2002)
2× Second-team All-Pro (1997, 1998)
7× Pro Bowl (1997–2003)
NFL 1990s All-Decade Team
NFL 2000s All-Decade Team
PFWA All-Rookie Team (1995)
Games played: 198
Tackles: 573
Sacks: 96.5
Forced fumbles: 19
Interceptions: 4
Total touchdowns: 3
Sapp was pretty much considered a no-brainer. And.. They're not THAT far apart. Lots more Pro Bowls for Sapp, but I think that's due to the eras that they played in. McMichael was often overlooked, even on his own team because there were so many excellent defensive linemen at the time.
Admittedly.. It's hard to compare two different eras. But, I do think Mongo gets a bit overlooked because of the era in which he played.
That's fair. I do think he's borderline, but on the side of the border that.. Eventually.. He would make it. So.. Why hold off?
Look at a comparison of Sapp vs McMichael
Mongo -
Super Bowl champion (XX)
2× First-team All-Pro (1985, 1987)
3× Second-team All-Pro (1986, 1988, 1991)
2× Pro Bowl (1986, 1987)
Tackles: 838
Sacks: 95
Interceptions: 2
Sapp -
Super Bowl champion (XXXVII)
NFL Defensive Player of the Year (1999)
4× First-team All-Pro (1999–2002)
2× Second-team All-Pro (1997, 1998)
7× Pro Bowl (1997–2003)
NFL 1990s All-Decade Team
NFL 2000s All-Decade Team
PFWA All-Rookie Team (1995)
Games played: 198
Tackles: 573
Sacks: 96.5
Forced fumbles: 19
Interceptions: 4
Total touchdowns: 3
Sapp was pretty much considered a no-brainer. And.. They're not THAT far apart. Lots more Pro Bowls for Sapp, but I think that's due to the eras that they played in. McMichael was often overlooked, even on his own team because there were so many excellent defensive linemen at the time.
Admittedly.. It's hard to compare two different eras. But, I do think Mongo gets a bit overlooked because of the era in which he played.
Why hold off? Because there are many other, more deserving candidates who should be in. McMichael is a weak pick.
You compared him to Sapp, who had far more accolades and a greater resume. Just makes McMichael look worse of an inductee.
Why hold off? Because there are many other, more deserving candidates who should be in. McMichael is a weak pick.
You compared him to Sapp, who had far more accolades and a greater resume. Just makes McMichael look worse of an inductee.
The only defensive player who was a finalist this year that I'd put above McMichael who didn't get in is Harrison.
Quite frankly.. Harrison has plenty more time to see himself get in. So.. Did McMichael jump the line a bit? Perhaps. But.. I'm fine with that due to his condition. I think he certainly gets in, so.. If someone is pushed back a year to let him get in while he is still alive.. I think even that person would likely say "Yeah, ok"
Mongo had 7 seasons with at least 8 sacks.. The only ones with more are John Randal, Alan Page and Alex Karras.. All in the HoF.
McMichael had the disadvantage of being lost in the crowd on that Bears defense. I don't think, if he was playing for the Patriots, and had those stats.. There'd have been any question.
The only defensive player who was a finalist this year that I'd put above McMichael who didn't get in is Harrison.
Quite frankly.. Harrison has plenty more time to see himself get in. So.. Did McMichael jump the line a bit? Perhaps. But.. I'm fine with that due to his condition. I think he certainly gets in, so.. If someone is pushed back a year to let him get in while he is still alive.. I think even that person would likely say "Yeah, ok"
Mongo had 7 seasons with at least 8 sacks.. The only ones with more are John Randal, Alan Page and Alex Karras.. All in the HoF.
McMichael had the disadvantage of being lost in the crowd on that Bears defense. I don't think, if he was playing for the Patriots, and had those stats.. There'd have been any question.
He was more of a complimentary player, not an outstanding player like Mike Singletary, Dan Hampton and Richard Dent. Plus, there are far more deserving senior candidates like Al Wistert, Dick Barwegan, Lavern Dilweg, Jimmy Patton, Del Shofner, Jim Ray Smith, Larry Grantham, Walt Sweeney, and Duane Putnam, who all belong over McMichael.
He was more of a complimentary player, not an outstanding player like Mike Singletary, Dan Hampton and Richard Dent. Plus, there are far more deserving senior candidates like Al Wistert, Dick Barwegan, Lavern Dilweg, Jimmy Patton, Del Shofner, Jim Ray Smith, Larry Grantham, Walt Sweeney, and Duane Putnam, who all belong over McMichael.
Agreed fully, and this is an excellent list to offer. I'll augment by adding players like Ox Emerson, Verne Lewellen, Billy Howton, Gene Brito, Lemar Parrish, Maxie Baughan, Dave Grayson, Joe Fortunato (just to show I have no anti-Bears bias), Walt Sweeney, Sterling Sharpe, Albert Lewis, Ken Anderson, and Jim Tyrer (I'm assuming the no-character-clause way of choosing HoFers is legit) to the mix. Not to mention Art Powell, who was unfairly passed on this time around. I'd have preferred any of these players to Steve McMichael for Senior enshrinement.
And don't get me started on the committee snubbing Powell and Buddy Parker. Utter freaking idiots.
Good job with the regular candidates, though -- all are solid HoFers. One can quibble about Dwight Freeney jumping the line over Jared Allen and making Antonio Gates wait a year, but those are minor issues. Both will get in soon enough and have tons of eligibility time left.
Last edited by bachslunch; 02-10-2024 at 08:51 AM..
Why hold off? Because there are many other, more deserving candidates who should be in. McMichael is a weak pick.
You compared him to Sapp, who had far more accolades and a greater resume. Just makes McMichael look worse of an inductee.
Absolutely. McMichael's honors profile of 2 first team all-pro selections, 2 pro bowls, and no all-decade team selections is now the weakest such numbers for any DL in Canton. Previous record holders here were Fred Dean and Richard Dent at 2/4/none.
Sapp's honors are loads better at 4/7/90s00s. And if you think sacks are important, Sapp has the edge here as well with 96.5 (in 13 seasons) to McMichael's 95.0 (in 15 seasons).
A lot of AFL players who started their careers when the league first started have gotten the shaft for years and Grantham is one of them.
5 time AFL All-star
5 time AFL first team all pro
5 time AFL second team all pro
And according to my Pro Football Encyclopedia fact book he missed 6 games in 14 seasons. For a few decades the old AFL players were getting shut out of canton with the exception of Lance Alworth and that would have been impossible to do. During 1962-1971 Alworth was the best wide receiver in the game and went in on his first year of eligibility and was also the youngest player to go in.
And speaking of AFL players getting the shaft, Art Powell got snubbed by the voting committee -- after being nominated for the honor by the Senior panel. He's very deserving, as far as I'm concerned.
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