Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The people on this thread don't understand that to entice an owner to move his team to your city, you will have to furnish him with a brand new stadium with many luxury suites and other amenities that can help him earn more money. San Antonio will not build a brand new stadium since they have invested so much in the Alamadome and their new NBA stadium. Refurbishing an existing stadium doesn't appeal to owners so saying an owner will move his team to San Antonio because it can be refurbished makes no sense. That requires money and a city will likely have to invest at least 200 million to build a new state of the art stadium. It's not easy to get a city to fork over that type of money. Besides money, you need land and there are a lot of politics and zoning laws that kick in. Many cities want a new stadium but not in their backyard necessarily and that's been the problem in LA. What owners have wanted to do is move to LA but the city can't come up with a plan to build this new stadium.
The Jags owner is sitting on a huge bargaining chip and he will take his time before he just randomly moves his team to just any city. He knows that some city will eventually build the type of stadium he wants that will make him money. Las Vegas will never get a professional sports franchise of any type due to the gambling issues and possible corruption, it's just a rule that all leagues have established. The NFL also has to approve of a move to a city. It's doubtful they will approve of a move to a small market like Orlando or Oklahoma City.
You underestimate the power and influence of Texas politicians. Particularly San Antonio leaders. Not long ago Bexar County officials offered to put up over $200 million dollars to lure the Florida Marlins over from Miami. In the end though it was just a ruse by the Marlins organization to get a new place built for them in Miami. But the money in San Antonio was legit.
The same thing would happen if an NFL team would come to town. The financing for a new stadium would be slapped together in no time at all. This city craves an NFL team so badly that it would sell the Alamo itself to make the dream come about. I see it inevitably happening however. It's just a matter of time. Probably when the TV market locally becomes large enough to satisfy the powers that be in the League.
You underestimate the power and influence of Texas politicians. Particularly San Antonio leaders. Not long ago Bexar County officials offered to put up over $200 million dollars to lure the Florida Marlins over from Miami.
The same thing would happen if an NFL team would come to town. The financing for a new stadium would be slapped together in no time at all. This city craves an NFL team so badly that it would sell the Alamo itself to make the dream come about.
Sadly, Texas politicians to not carry clout in the NFL like they do on "Dallas" or the "Simpsons". Being used as $200 million leverage by a worthless baseball franchise is VERY different than landing an NFL franchise. A few figures to chew on:
1) The average NFL franchise value is $1.1 BILLION dollars. The last person in South Texas with that kind of cash and an interest in the NFL was Red McCombs - who failed at the endeavor. Clearly, the local owner option is a non-starter. Which takes us to the more important second point.....
2) The 3 most recent NFL stadium construction projects are as follows:
-Meadowlands Stadium - $1.4 BILLION
-Cowboys Stadium - $1.8 BILLION
-Lucas Oil Stadium - $760 million
(These figures DO NOT include the hundreds of millions in civic infastructure costs associated with building a stadium)
How exactly do you think that San Antonio will "slap together" a billion dollar stadium "in no time at all" - especially with the 15 year old Alamodome still standing fallow? Given the current structure of NFL revenue sharing (and the likely revision next year), having a superlative stadium is essential to a franchise's health - more so than TV market size (viz. Cowboys being far more valuable than Bears). Stadiums generate revenue that belongs to the home team - they are the critical node in the ownership economics of the NFL.
The simple truth is that San Antonio cannot build a viable NFL stadium on public funds - patently IMPOSSIBLE. New York can barely do that, and Dallas could not. Asking an investor to take his $1 BILLION dollar team and add another $750 million to the stadium kitty means an investment of nearly $2 BILLION to secure the NFL's 4th smallest market. That's not happening.
As I mentioned earlier, the best bet for SA landing a team is to locate it near Austin, wait 20 years for the Alamodome to become morbidly obselete, and take advantage of the inevitable increase in favorable demographics that will occur. All this talk makes a lot more sense in the 2030s.
Sadly, Texas politicians to not carry clout in the NFL like they do on "Dallas" or the "Simpsons". Being used as $200 million leverage by a worthless baseball franchise is VERY different than landing an NFL franchise. A few figures to chew on:
1) The average NFL franchise value is $1.1 BILLION dollars. The last person in South Texas with that kind of cash and an interest in the NFL was Red McCombs - who failed at the endeavor. Clearly, the local owner option is a non-starter. Which takes us to the more important second point.....
If only we chould all fail at such an endeavor...
McCombs bought the Vikings in 1998 for $250M and sold the team 7 years later for $600M. On top of the operating profits he received he also got his share of the Texan's franchise fee ($700M) in 2002. He likely netted between $500M - $550M for his brief foray into the league. That likely didn't sour him on the feasibility of jumping back into the pool.
McCombs net worth is currently listed at $1.4B slightly behind Jerry Jones' $1.8B. Given that there are another 39 billionaires in Texas, it likely wouldn't be too difficult to assemble a couple of those ol' boys together to scrape up the necessary financing.
No knock on San Antonio, but I don't see the NFL going there. It's too close to the Cowboys (and Texans). Keep in mind owners have to approve moves and expansions. There's no way Jerry Jones is going to give up that area, especially with his new 100,000 seat stadium he has to fill.
Also, I recall reading an article where someone analyzed the issue of the Jags relocation, and they said San Antonio would be considered a "small market", i.e. not somewhere the NFL wants to go again. It said the NFL would probably consider putting two teams in Los Angeles before putting a team in a small market again. And I know someone's probably going to say, "Hey, San Antonio's not a small market, plus we've got Austin". Trust me, it is. I would say the top ten in this list below are considereded large markets, all else would be viewed as small markets.
If only we chould all fail at such an endeavor...
McCombs bought the Vikings in 1998 for $250M and sold the team 7 years later for $600M. On top of the operating profits he received he also got his share of the Texan's franchise fee ($700M) in 2002. He likely netted between $500M - $550M for his brief foray into the league. That likely didn't sour him on the feasibility of jumping back into the pool.
I agree that fail is too strong a word to describe McComb's foray into NFL ownership - any endeavor that nets 9-figures can be seen as a successful business venture. He is a savvy car-salesman, and invested his NFL cash into increased wealth - buying a franchise cheap and holding on to it as the entire league went through exponential growth.
McCombs was, however, a classic cheapskate owner - in the mold of the Bidwell or Mike Brown. Unless you are in an abysmally small market (i.e. Jacksonville), the NFL is a printing press for money. Even more, if you owned a team in the mid-90s to now, your value has quadrupled. Once he realized a new, more-profitable stadium wasn't in the cards while he was still alive, (even after using a move to Los Angeles as leverage), he cashed out. As a Minnesotan, you know he was vilified as an owner. I would say he left richer but "sour" indeed. It was an investment - not many people own NFL teams for only 7 years.
The point is, McCombs is an 83 year-old man. I can assure you he will not be the energetic spearhead of a movement to land the NFL in San Antonio at this age. Teams cost $1 BILLION dollars now. He knows first hand how hard it is to get a stadium deal with his Metrodome experience. In this economic climate, NFL franchises are not quadrupling in value like they did last decade. It is a "hold" investment.
More importantly, there is no cabal of bolo-tied Texans who want a franchise in San Antonio. If ever there was a living-carictature of football-hungry Texas businessmen, they are now they Houston Texans' ownership group. No local billionaire exists in San Antonio that is committed to the civic pride of owning a football team - like you have in Wayne Weaver of Jacksonville or Ralph Wilson of Buffalo.. The club of NFL owners are NOT looking to expand in a small market - or move from one small market to another.
I personally think we will see two teams in Los Angeles, and possibly one in London, before we see a team in San Antonio. I might be wrong, but the burden of proof is not on me - San Antonio remains without a pro team and no current prospects exist of one coming their way. Additionally, any team would almost certainly have to cater to the Austin market, which will have a larger metro GDP than San Antonio in 5 years and possibly a larger population in 20 years.
London is so incredibly far they won't ever have a team situated there.. (Just imagine a trip from SF to London?) UNLESS they make an entirely different "European" conference. I don't see why Toronto wouldn't work. Half the Bill's fan base are from metro Toronto.
Sadly, Texas politicians to not carry clout in the NFL like they do on "Dallas" or the "Simpsons". Being used as $200 million leverage by a worthless baseball franchise is VERY different than landing an NFL franchise. A few figures to chew on:
1) The average NFL franchise value is $1.1 BILLION dollars. The last person in South Texas with that kind of cash and an interest in the NFL was Red McCombs - who failed at the endeavor. Clearly, the local owner option is a non-starter. Which takes us to the more important second point.....
2) The 3 most recent NFL stadium construction projects are as follows:
-Meadowlands Stadium - $1.4 BILLION
-Cowboys Stadium - $1.8 BILLION
-Lucas Oil Stadium - $760 million
(These figures DO NOT include the hundreds of millions in civic infastructure costs associated with building a stadium)
How exactly do you think that San Antonio will "slap together" a billion dollar stadium "in no time at all" - especially with the 15 year old Alamodome still standing fallow? Given the current structure of NFL revenue sharing (and the likely revision next year), having a superlative stadium is essential to a franchise's health - more so than TV market size (viz. Cowboys being far more valuable than Bears). Stadiums generate revenue that belongs to the home team - they are the critical node in the ownership economics of the NFL.
The simple truth is that San Antonio cannot build a viable NFL stadium on public funds - patently IMPOSSIBLE. New York can barely do that, and Dallas could not. Asking an investor to take his $1 BILLION dollar team and add another $750 million to the stadium kitty means an investment of nearly $2 BILLION to secure the NFL's 4th smallest market. That's not happening.
As I mentioned earlier, the best bet for SA landing a team is to locate it near Austin, wait 20 years for the Alamodome to become morbidly obselete, and take advantage of the inevitable increase in favorable demographics that will occur. All this talk makes a lot more sense in the 2030s.
I rememeber when henderson got kicked off dallas to houston he wrote that when he first entered the lockeroom he knew he had arrived at a second class situation. I highly doubt that San Antoino which can't even pass a decent airport could really do better than a second rate team.I don't think the NFL wants that situation now days.
I can guarantee you that they are not staying in JAX
LA just got approved to build a stadium. If you live in Jax, there home games are blacked out.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
