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Ok, so what is the answer? I haven been accused of saying like it is and when I was younger, just didn't know any better. Wasn't trying to hurt or put anyone in their place. Now, just trying to be apart of the conversation, do not offer up opinions just life experience and still get negative feelings. And as the last one said, if you don't offer anything to the conversation your taken wrong also, so what is the answer!
Is being part of the conversation your only goal or do you hope to form friendships?
I would rather have friends, doctors and co-workers ”tell it like it is” rather than sugarcoat anything. I was raised in an era where nothing was sugarcoated and as much as something might have hurt at the time to hear, it was usually for my benefit. Too many people are thin-skinned nowadays and in the words of Al Pacino ”can't handle the truth”. They will then accuse those of us who do tell it like it is as being thoughtless and harsh.
I would rather have friends, doctors and co-workers ”tell it like it is” rather than sugarcoat anything. I was raised in an era where nothing was sugarcoated and as much as something might have hurt at the time to hear, it was usually for my benefit. Too many people are thin-skinned nowadays and in the words of Al Pacino ”can't handle the truth”. They will then accuse those of us who do tell it like it is as being thoughtless and harsh.
Its all in the delivery. It is possible to be truthful and still be respectful. IMHO, the more important the message is for the listener to hear, the more care I need to take to make sure they hear it. If they are too busy becoming indignant or composing a defensive retort, they've shut down. They're not listening. Kind of counterproductive. Too many times people confuse rudeness and candor...which IME really comes down to arrogance. As others have commented, many times someone claiming to "tell it like it is" is just saying up front all they care about is hearing the sound of their own voice.
Last edited by Parnassia; 03-25-2021 at 03:18 PM..
I would rather have friends, doctors and co-workers ”tell it like it is” rather than sugarcoat anything. I was raised in an era where nothing was sugarcoated and as much as something might have hurt at the time to hear, it was usually for my benefit. Too many people are thin-skinned nowadays and in the words of Al Pacino ”can't handle the truth”. They will then accuse those of us who do tell it like it is as being thoughtless and harsh.
I totally agree. This is a redacted copy of a toast I gave a close friend on the occasion of his 60th birthday, almost four years ago (names changed):
Quote:
Originally Posted by My toast to Sam at 60th birthday party
I first met Sam (name changed) during October 1972. The first time I spoke with him, or rather he spoke with me, I did not even know who he was. He correctly took me to task for a comment that was not especially appropriate. He did so in a businesslike manner which is memorable to this day, especially considering that we were 15 the time.
One of the many great things about Sam is his utter frankness. If you ask him for advice, he gives advice. And without sugarcoating or equivocation. It is because of this, not in spite of this, that we have been friends for almost 45 years. I doubt that my experiences are unique.
I had sent the copied text as a draft. His wife, after the party, responded:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Response from Sam's Wife
You spoke the truth about Sam. The fact that he doesn't sugarcoat his feelings or thoughts, caused me to be very angry with him often. Then I would eventually forget why I was angry. Instead of counting his faults, I started to count his goodness and there are many. He certainly considers you as a dear old friend of his. This is precious for both of you to have true friendship over several decades.
This is the history of this exchange.
TELLING OF OFFENSIVE JOKE
The first was that the very first time I met him, during October 1972 and before I even knew his name, I made a "Rabbi, Lawyer, Priest" type of joke at the high school weather station. I hadn't met Sam yet, and his last name is decidedly not Jewish. He interrupted the joke (which I was telling someone else named Alan, who is Jewish) saying "JBGUSA, don't you have pride in your people and their accomplishments...." I realized he was right and, combined with my father's death about three months later, I developed a deep and abiding interest in Judaism. I consider myself an "active Reform Jew."
RECEIPT OF URGENTLY NEEDED ADVICE
Fast forward to end of October 1976. We had graduated high school and I went on to Cornell, him to Yale. At the time I had very few friends at college, and was rather unhappy. Maybe a bit of adolescent angst, maybe a bit of awkwardness and depression mixed in. After going with him and his suite-mates to a Yale-Cornell football game and an Earth Wind & Fire concert, and we were walking back to his dorm at Yale, I said I wanted to talk to him privately. He was exhausted and somewhat reluctant but I pressed.
We went to a pizza place, and I basically said "I notice how easily you mingle and seem to have lots of friends. As you know from our home town I really don't and it's worse, if anything, at Cornell." I said, "just lay it out, don't worry about my feelings." He started out by saying "JBGUSA, I see lots of problems," and started with the fact that I came across as insecure, using the word "nervous." He went on from there for close to an hour, almost without interruption. Later he said that if I hadn't made that approach the two of us would not have been in touch very much. Obviously we were given that I was at his 30th, 50th, 55th, 59th and 60th birthdays, his stepdaughter's wedding, his daughter's Bat Mitzvah and wedding and his grandson's first birthday party.
So returning to the thread topic I see people who "tell it like it is" as a great source of advice. That can be followed by friendship, or just using the advice for whatever it's worth. But don't people pay self-improvement/motivational types, psychologists and psychiatrists lots of money for often very muddled advice?
So returning to the thread topic I see people who "tell it like it is" as a great source of advice. That can be followed by friendship, or just using the advice for whatever it's worth. But don't people pay self-improvement/motivational types, psychologists and psychiatrists lots of money for often very muddled advice?
IME, sometimes experts' advice can appear "muddled" (to use your term) because they are aware of many qualifiers, exceptions, special circumstances that complicate any advice they might offer. Their expertise makes them aware of more options and possible outcomes. They tend to live in the grey areas, not just the black and white. If this, then that, but if that, then this. So, in an attempt to lay everything out for the person asking for help, they end up covering too much ground, even contradicting themselves.
Let's not forget, just because someone is deemed an "expert" doesn't guarantee they are all that effective in the communications department. Expert or not, people's interpersonal communication skills vary. Haven't you ever taken a class from a subject matter expert who was brilliant and insightful but couldn't explain their way out of a paper bag?
Last edited by Parnassia; 03-26-2021 at 03:05 PM..
I would rather have friends, doctors and co-workers ”tell it like it is” rather than sugarcoat anything. I was raised in an era where nothing was sugarcoated and as much as something might have hurt at the time to hear, it was usually for my benefit. Too many people are thin-skinned nowadays and in the words of Al Pacino ”can't handle the truth”. They will then accuse those of us who do tell it like it is as being thoughtless and harsh.
Wow, such generalizations! I was raised “in an era” when people tried to be tactful. Or not. Our generations have nothing to do with how frank some people are or are not.
Right now there is much speaking truth to power. For instance, Black people have been saying for years that they are commonly treated poorly by the police, and virtually no one wanted to hear their truth. It has taken multiple videos demonstrating that truth to convince more of us of their honest frankness.
IMO, most of us do not want to hear “truths” that we don’t want to believe. This has little to do with our ages, and much to do with our human nature.
Let's not forget, just because someone is deemed an "expert" doesn't guarantee they are all that effective in the communications department. Expert or not, people's interpersonal communication skills vary. Haven't you ever taken a class from a subject matter expert who was brilliant and insightful but couldn't explain their way out of a paper bag?
Location: Huntersville/Charlotte, NC and Washington, DC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-R-B
I know a person who is extremely proud of "telling it like it is", always interjecting late into conversations with the "perfect solution" and just generally never even considers that she could be wrong once in her life.
It is exhausting to be around someone who believes that they "tell it like it is" and whatever they say is correct no matter the subject because they "tell it like it is" and that is the end of it.
I tried to explain that maybe sometimes "telling it like it is" is really just that person's interpretation of the situation and it may not be "like it is".......Obviously it didn't work.
What the hell is up with these people? Do they really believe that whatever comes out of their mouths is they "way it is" ???????
Is it a complete lack of self awareness or what?
As a tell it like is type myself, you always have to balance being clear in your message with not off putting people with the delivery. Being an “like it is” person is not always about self-importance. I typically have a “like it is” convo when I see a friend doing something stupid. The addressing and the delivery is from a friend point of view who does not want to see his friend make an a@& out of their self and thinks his friend can learn a lesson.
I’m a believer in cancel culture and even I think America has gotten too soft and needs people who can tell it like it is, but come from a place of an informed opinion and not just bigotry.
As a tell it like is type myself, you always have to balance being clear in your message with not off putting people with the delivery. Being an “like it is” person is not always about self-importance. I typically have a “like it is” convo when I see a friend doing something stupid. The addressing and the delivery is from a friend point of view who does not want to see his friend make an a@& out of their self and thinks his friend can learn a lesson.
There is a difference between being frank but constructive and being demeaning. Is that what you're alluding to?
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dissenter
I’m a believer in cancel culture and even I think America has gotten too soft and needs people who can tell it like it is, but come from a place of an informed opinion and not just bigotry.
Off topic but what are you saying is good about cancel culture?
They also say mean or jerk like things all under the guise of just simply telling it like it is.
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