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I'm aware that racists use it, but it is sad that there is no "regional pride" symbol that is not associated with a Hate group, or leads people to roll their eyes and claim that you are "still fighting the Civil War". The usage as a symbol of racism/hatred seems to be more within the past 20 years or so; when I was a child, I even remember seeing African-Americans wearing Confederate Flags on their jean jackets, and not thinking anything of it, because it just meant "I'm a Southerner", not "I'm a Southerner circa 1860."
That's how I remember it, too, Francois, but I would say the past 30-40 years. I think the state outlines with "home" in them are the safest regional pride emblem or maybe a Co-Cola with a Moonpie.
That's how I remember it, too, Francois, but I would say the past 30-40 years. I think the state outlines with "home" in them are the safest regional pride emblem or maybe a Co-Cola with a Moonpie.
Perhaps there is a connection with the rise of "political correctness" and lots of people looking for something to get indignant about?
Last edited by carolinadawg2; 05-07-2015 at 02:28 PM..
The design of the Battle Flag of the Army of Northern Virginia was co-opted by various hate groups, including the KKK and used as a symbol of their racist beliefs.
You seriously aren't aware of this?
Coming from a very small town in NC, I had friends that drove pick up trucks BEFORE they were considered cool. Those were my redneck friends! I remember going to White Lake with them and they had beach towels with that flag on them. Were they racist? No. Maybe we were too young or too naiive to see it other than just a redneck symbol of the south. Just because some group takes an innocent symbol and changes it, why do "we" all have to believe it is THEIR WAY?
Coming from a very small town in NC, I had friends that drove pick up trucks BEFORE they were considered cool. Those were my redneck friends! I remember going to White Lake with them and they had beach towels with that flag on them. Were they racist? No. Maybe we were too young or too naiive to see it other than just a redneck symbol of the south. Just because some group takes an innocent symbol and changes it, why do "we" all have to believe it is THEIR WAY?
"We" don't.
I'm not defending it, I'm explaining it. No need to preach at me. I just found it odd you seemed unaware that the KKK and other groups use the BFOTANV as a symbol of their groups, and just as unaware that some people have bought into that and therefore view the flag negatively.
Last edited by carolinadawg2; 05-07-2015 at 02:29 PM..
Lets do this...see if you can identify the historical figure who said the following (and no cheating with Google):
"As long as blacks continue to live with the whites they constitute a threat to the national life. Family life may also collapse and the increase of mixed breed bastards may some day challenge the supremacy of the white man."
"I have no purpose to introduce political and social equality between the white and black races. There is physical difference between the two which, in my judgment, will probably forever forbid their living together upon the footing of perfect equality, and inasmuch as it becomes a necessity that there must be a difference, I...am in favor of the race to which I belong having the superior position."
How ironic given those quotes by Lincoln that your forebears had such a burr up their saddle to secede. Lincoln's not the subject of the debate here, however, nor did I lionize Lincoln in my earlier post. How about you answer my question instead? I react to a Confederate flag - regardless of whether it's a national flag, a military banner, or what have you - with the same revulsion as I react to the symbols of Nazi Germany - a government founded upon oppression that would have me, at best, a slave laborer. Growing up in South Carolina when the furor about the Confederate Flag on the dome of the State House was going on, I often heard the byline "Heritage, not hate." Well, what about when your heritage is hatred?
How ironic given those quotes by Lincoln that your forebears had such a burr up their saddle to secede. Lincoln's not the subject of the debate here, however, nor did I lionize Lincoln in my earlier post. How about you answer my question instead? I react to a Confederate flag - regardless of whether it's a national flag, a military banner, or what have you - with the same revulsion as I react to the symbols of Nazi Germany - a government founded upon oppression that would have me, at best, a slave laborer. Growing up in South Carolina when the furor about the Confederate Flag on the dome of the State House was going on, I often heard the byline "Heritage, not hate." Well, what about when your heritage is hatred?
And you are welcome to react however you'd like. Just don't expect everyone else to react with you.
The point of my post is that history is both complicated and messy. No one is all good, nor all bad. Thats a lesson we seem to have lost. For a good example, I wonder how many native americans feel about Old Glory? Might they view it a bit negatively? Thats a much better parallel to Nazi genocide than the one you provided.
Last edited by carolinadawg2; 05-07-2015 at 03:39 PM..
A flag, being a symbol, symbolizes different things to different people.
Exactly. And a person's insecurity about me displaying a flag (should I choose to) is not my problem. Automatically assuming someone is racist because they display some variant of the Confederate flag like the Chapel Hill parents did is absurd.
I'm a Yankee living here now, but I figure most who fly the flag do so out of pride of being Southerners, not hatred of blacks.
Remember that many Southerners who fought in the Civil War did not give a damn about maintaining slavery; they were (as they thought) defending their homeland against what was to them invaders.
At that point in time, only abolitionists cared about slavery. Most Northerners were at best, indifferent to the plight of the black man. Even if they were uncomfortable about slavery, they deemed the black man inferior in all ways to them.
Different time. Glad we've moved beyond that kind of thinking.
Today though, pretty much the P.C.-brigade has made anything that doesn't fit their preconceived notions of what should be allowed forbidden. It's just tedious. Anyone with a brain knew that most Southerners viewed the flag as a symbol of their love for the South and most people recognized that only a small group of bigoted jerks misused it.
most people recognized that only a small group of bigoted jerks misused it.
Unfortunately, some of those small groups happened to control state legislatures.
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Lincoln's not the subject of the debate here, however, nor did I lionize Lincoln in my earlier post. How about you answer my question instead? I react to a Confederate flag - regardless of whether it's a national flag, a military banner, or what have you - with the same revulsion as I react to the symbols of Nazi Germany - a government founded upon oppression that would have me, at best, a slave laborer. Growing up in South Carolina when the furor about the Confederate Flag on the dome of the State House was going on, I often heard the byline "Heritage, not hate." Well, what about when your heritage is hatred?
