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I think the barn punctuates buyers' perceived problems with the whole property.
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Originally Posted by just_because
I agree that if the house were perfect, the barn would be less of an issue. But taken together, the OP already says that buyers often don't want an inlaw apartment OR a large outbuilding. In fact most probably don't need/want either. So with a house that already looks like a big project and already has spaces they will struggle to make good use of, they then see the barn and it pushes it right over the edge and they want to run. The OP can also do some minor things in the main house (staging, working on how it's shown and explained, working on the marketing messaging for the listing) to bridge some gaps there, but trying to address this with the barn is very difficult for the OP and probably too costly.
It sounds like we're saying the same thing just in a different way. I completely agree that the barn is a problem. It's definitely detracting from the property. If the house didn't have it's own issues, I think a lot of people would overlook the barn or would be happy to take on the barn as a project. As you say, the barn being what it is just exacerbates the problem. If I was going to fix something here though, it would likely be the main house as I think people would be more likely to overlook problems in the barn rather than in the main house.
Quote:
Originally Posted by just_because
210 Charles has a far different market. Older than the typical market for 171 Prospect (40s-50s). Already have a family home so more experienced in property. Maybe teens/early teens. You know the kind of people who are tinkerers? Their whole lives seem 'interesting' to average people. Untidy...nothing fits. PHD in chemistry but wrote three books on philosophy and a manual on making pear wine. Their whole lives seem like a ramble of unfinished projects. You go to their houses and the kitchen table is covered with books on every subject known to man, a laptop with some project in the works that would take them days to explain to you, and papers with red wine rings. They do things that make little sense to more practically minded people. They don't really worry about stuff. That's who I see in this house. Not ridiculing anyone, just trying to paint a picture here.
Alternative would be an exec type who wants to do a complete renovation. Frankly, i think that this is much less likely because of some of the issues that can't be solved like the pool location, small bedrooms, low ceilings, and need for some serious layout work to push it toward a modern 'executive' type home. I think many exec type egos want something with more grandeur and 'bigger bones' rather than country charm. The financial case will also struggle as they'll be in for closer to $2m than $1m when it's done and I don't think it'll be worth that in the end.
These sound like possible buyers to me. Given the fetish so many buyers have for "new" or "completely updated" I don't see a lot of buyers coming in to this property and just wanting to move in without doing any work. The buyer may be someone who's type A (the "executive" you described) or someone who does things a little more organically (the "professor" you described).
Quote:
Originally Posted by just_because
The positive action point for my post is to work with your agent to get the messaging and 'packaging' of the barn corrected so some of the negative feelings and fear is toned down.
I think the whole property needs to be shined up (except maybe the exterior) and all the marketing needs to be redone. The pictures are not ideal and the marketing has clearly not been setup to target the likely buyer of the property. It's aimed at the average buyer and they are going to pass on this as it's not an average home.
Quote:
Originally Posted by just_because
My the way, despite some minor differences in how much the barn is to blame, I think MikePru would be an ideal agent for this house as he makes some great points and has a good understanding.
That's really nice of you to say. I like to see when people have differences of opinion that they can be worked out in a respectful manner and that despite those differences there's still a mutual respect.
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Originally Posted by NewfieMama
I know you're saying that you can just get on the sidewalk across the street on Prospect, but the walkability factor still isn't there. It's 4 miles to Hingham Square. Even South is 1.5 miles away and parents aren't walking their elementary-aged kids to school that far.
210 Charles isn't in a neighborhood, but it's on a busy intersection with very close neighbors. Buyers aren't weighing neighborhood vs. bucolic setting.
But it's not really optional. I live close to 210 Charles on a busy street between a couple of neighborhoods. Like you, I wanted an antique house, which is nearly impossible to find in a traditional neighborhood. I wanted more privacy than a neighborhood could provide. My kids take the same bus as the kids in the neighborhoods right next to us, but it's not the same. If the neighborhood kids are having a play date, they just or bike to each other's house. I have to schedule a playdate and drive them there because you can't just send them down a busy street on their own.
Also, though my house is the same size as the neighborhood homes, there is no way it would ever demand the same $. In fact, I'd say that living in an antique home on a busy street reduces the sales price by at least 15% compared to a newer home in a neighborhood/side street. Just because it's what YOU (and I) wanted, doesn't mean anything. Most people don't want to tackle home updates and street traffic.
It's not THAT bad. You basically look into the kitchen window from the intersection, which isn't ideal, but I wouldn't say it's a steep, steep hill. Or that the bedrooms are at street level. I paid extra close attention when driving by it yesterday. Plus, it's brand new, so that is a major plus for potential buyers. Even then it sat on the market for long time and went for 20% below the original listing price. 210 Charles isn't right on the intersection the way that 171 is, but it's close enough to be a factor, I think.
Nice to hear from someone with similar tastes as the OP. You clearly have an understanding of how the market works.
From the feedback that I've heard, people love the house, but everyone wants to renovate it, and when they add $200-300k to the price and look at what else they can buy for the same money they realize maybe they don't need a barn or a mother-in-law suite on the first floor and they pass. The reality of doing all that work along with working and raising kids doesn't make sense for most buyers.
We recently put a new roof on the barn ($9800.), removed a concrete ramp and tore out all the old landscaping in front of it, put in new footings and landscaping, (a $10k project), replaced the trim and sills around the windows in the main house with Azek, replaced a picture window in the kitchen with French doors, etc. another $10k, replaced the pergola, so well over $30K and there was hardly any noticeable difference. A drop in the bucket.
"Mr. Blandings Builds His Dream House" Syndrome. Nice in the end, but oh, the process (and cost)!
I think the buyer who will commit to taking on this property has to have a reason to do so, as we did, with a home-based business, or they really want privacy and a peaceful setting and have a love of antique homes as well as a vision of what it could become.
A builder could take it on as an investment. You could easily put a garage between the house and barn and connect the two structures making it possible to enter either one from inside the garage. Would it help to hire an architect to draw that out and get an estimated cost from a few contractors? I don't know, I'm just grasping at straws here...
1. share with us what YOU think are the top 3 things you love and a Buyer will love about the home.
2. Get actual cost estimates from licensed contractors for what "remodeling" would cost.
1. share with us what YOU think are the top 3 things you love and a Buyer will love about the home.
2. Get actual cost estimates from licensed contractors for what "remodeling" would cost.
What I LOVE about the house and what the next owner can look forward to...
1. Number one is CHARACTER. It's different. Interesting. Both inside and outside, it has a lot of personality, a sense of history and quality. Living in it you feel special, like the house itself. A base from which you can be and do something great. It gives off energy. Maybe it's the old growth tree timbers or the horse hair in the walls. Or the fact that there has been a home here on this exact spot since the 1600's.
2. VERSATILITY. There are countless options for rooms and sections of the property to be easily used in a variety of different ways, limited only by your need and imagination. The ability to adapt to change. Business office in the barn today, tomorrow goats and chickens. First floor bedroom is a gym, until your dad dies and mom moves in to regroup. Now the gym is in upstairs of the barn. The second floor playroom becomes a little sewing factory for your 12-year old's latest business venture. No one notices any disruption. Life is a series of adventures. Ability to respond quickly to change.
3. PRIVACY without isolation. It has a street presence and curb appeal, but at the same time it's totally and gloriously private, yet not a retreat setting hidden from the world by trees, so the quality of light and sunshine is always spectacular. It's an unusual combination. And if your in a walk-in-the-forest mood, it's at the end of your driveway.
4. SCHOOL DISTRICT is EAST. There are 4 elementary schools in Hingham. Each district has it's own personality and style. East School is the newest one and closest to the library. When it opened 10 years ago they pulled the cream of the crop from the other three schools and moved them all to East. I like it the best. (Not saying it is the best. Everyone in Hingham thinks their school is the best.)
5. Made FINANCIAL SENSE - Zoned residential business w/employees, we were able to hit the 'sweet spot' financially in terms of finding the perfect balance of income, mortgage interest, taxes, expenses, etc. We were able to enjoy our primary home and vacation rolled into one, avoid the commute, and have enough time, money, and energy left over for education and travel, things that were important to us as a family.
For real estate people this is all probably nonsense, but obviously, we're not real estate people!
a. it's not 3 things
b. you have to condense that into what CAN be presented online. Nothing wrong with a lengthy essay in the house or available for distribution that lays it all out.
So, let's ask a few more questions/make a few more potential points ...
1. How many people would agree that East is the best school district? Does that results data or the online ratings confirm it's higher desirability?
2. While it's hard to CONVEY 1-3 in photos - they can certainly all be conveyed much better than they have been.
3. Can 1-3 be found easily in similar homes, especially those that are less expensive?
4. How unique is the lot size, shape, and ecological factors that make it superior?
If what you are selling is:
A "run your small business from your property witlhout occupying family space"
"Most desirable schools"
"Flexible layout ideal for multi-generation living"
a. it's not 3 things
b. you have to condense that into what CAN be presented online. Nothing wrong with a lengthy essay in the house or available for distribution that lays it all out.
So, let's ask a few more questions/make a few more potential points ...
1. How many people would agree that East is the best school district? Does that results data or the online ratings confirm it's higher desirability?
2. While it's hard to CONVEY 1-3 in photos - they can certainly all be conveyed much better than they have been.
3. Can 1-3 be found easily in similar homes, especially those that are less expensive?
4. How unique is the lot size, shape, and ecological factors that make it superior?
If what you are selling is:
A "run your small business from your property witlhout occupying family space"
"Most desirable schools"
"Flexible layout ideal for multi-generation living"
then sell that.
School rankings - It's like picking the 4 most popular dog breeds and asking which one is "Best".
They are all excellent schools. 25 years ago we would only look in the Plymouth River school district, but that has changed now because they rebuilt South and East. Each has it's own personality.
Someone mentioned low inventory here earlier. This seems really low. Now I'm thinking freshen it up, address the points mentioned that can be changed, new marketing strategy based on the comments here, new photos, conduct a smudge ceremony, and maybe it has a chance.
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School rankings - It's like picking the 4 most popular dog breeds and asking which one is "Best".
They are all excellent schools. 25 years ago we would only look in the Plymouth River school district, but that has changed now because they rebuilt South and East. Each has it's own personality.
A lot of people use great schools to rank elementary schools. It looks like they have 3 of the 4 elementaries in town rated a 9. Foster is an 8.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2houses.oh.no
Someone mentioned low inventory here earlier. This seems really low. Now I'm thinking freshen it up, address the points mentioned that can be changed, new marketing strategy based on the comments here, new photos, conduct a smudge ceremony, and maybe it has a chance.
That was me.
I think that's a great plan and sounds eerily familiar . . .
A lot of people use great schools to rank elementary schools. It looks like they have 3 of the 4 elementaries in town rated a 9. Foster is an 8.
That was me.
I think that's a great plan and sounds eerily familiar . . .
Thanks, Mike! I think we've made A LOT of progress in this thread. Thanks to everyone for taking the time to comment, offer your opinion and advice. Noticing things that I couldn't see. I'll let you know what happens. Off to clean out that barn and basement.
a. it's not 3 things
b. you have to condense that into what CAN be presented online. Nothing wrong with a lengthy essay in the house or available for distribution that lays it all out.
So, let's ask a few more questions/make a few more potential points ...
1. How many people would agree that East is the best school district? Does that results data or the online ratings confirm it's higher desirability?
2. While it's hard to CONVEY 1-3 in photos - they can certainly all be conveyed much better than they have been.
3. Can 1-3 be found easily in similar homes, especially those that are less expensive?
4. How unique is the lot size, shape, and ecological factors that make it superior?
If what you are selling is:
A "run your small business from your property witlhout occupying family space"
"Most desirable schools"
"Flexible layout ideal for multi-generation living"
then sell that.
Bo - Thank you very much for your help! Very insightful.
my pleasure - I hope that at least 1 thing something said helps get the house sold. At the end of the day, that's what ALL agents want is for homes to sell.
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