Are the Men Who Always Complain About "Gold Diggers"... (dates, woman)
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Success for me is a man who enjoys what he does for a living and can live comfortably on his own money
Exactly.
I define success as having a firm grasp on what you want out of life and are taking the steps to succeed in that. This may mean living in poverty trying to start a non-profit, or trying to become a CEO of a Fortune 500. Whatever makes you happy.
...expressing frustration at women obsessed with money, or are they really expressing envy of men who are more successful than they are?
I ask because a lot of complaints about "gold-digging" are tinged with a subtle suggestion that wealthy men are getting access to women they don't really deserve...
Envy and jealousy are often used synonymously but I've learned that Catholicism originally distinguished between the two.
Jealousy is basically wanting something another has.
Envy is feeling inside yourself bad about your own good or excellence, or lack thereof, and feeling that the only way your own good or excellence can increase is if the good or excellence in another decreases.
You might say socialism, communism, liberals complaints and class warfare, Afrocentric history, and feminism with feminists conception of everything from sociological theses to feminist history, are all rooted in and motivated out of envy.
Whether jealousy or envy is the prime motivator of a person wanting to obtain X, depends on the individual, and the primary indicator may be if the person thinks Y person's good or personal excellence must decrease.
A "gold digger" must be defined though. Americans of both sexes disproportionately consume more of the earth's resources than any other nationality of people on earth. Americans were the first nationality of people to develop a true consumerist culture. Other nations that are "developed" have that today too, and some "developing nations" like Brazil have a growing consumerist population/society. Some of the shallowest, materialistic people on earth I've read about are young Chinese in bustling cities of China. Hands down they desire to consume more--and of the latest everything--than I do. I think a minority of them have been known to sell organs to have money to upgrade to the latest gadgets.
Hip Hop--which I grew up in--originally neither started off "gangsta" nor materialistic. Today about 99% of that culture is thoroughly materialistic. And yes, that means the women in that subculture are thoroughly materialistic. Envy I would argue... is a major driving force of violence and murder in the Hip Hop world. Greed, envy, and revenge.
well good try but we are saying slightly different things. there is clearly a difference between a man who lives within his means and a man who is "financially secure and stable". if that were the case, why don't women just describe as you stated above. or are we using code words?
be honest, is a man more attractive if he has greater wealth?
take the same joe with and without wealth, i'm certain almost all women will take joe with wealth.
just like guys, take the same "nice personality" jane with and without her looks, and you know the answer to that one.... what's the shame in admitted that?
I'll be honest - I actually never gave any thought to whether or not the guys I dated were financially secure and stable. I met my husband when I was 25. The guy I was with before that was a guitar player who lived with his parents. The guy before that was my high school/college sweet heart. I dated other guys but that was while I was in college. Money was never an issue. My husband is successful - but when we met - we were on tour together and he was making a little more than I was. But would I have stayed with him if he had a gambling problem, if he spent money willy nilly, or hated what he did? Probably not. And honestly, if I had wanted to date someone who had a lot of money - I would have. I worked at an upscale gym and was constantly getting asked out by very wealthy men.
So, it seems you are of the camp that most women are basically gold diggers as well - otherwise you wouldn't have brought all this up to begin with, I'm assuming.
any lets be honest here, many many women won't date a guy unless he is financially stable or secure. cal lit what you want (ambition, character, potential, whatever), these women are measuring his worth as a man by his financial resources. can you blame them? certainly not if they have the looks, body, and personality to be worth their weight in gold.
I think that there are men and women alike who play this game. Shallow, useless women use their bodies for money, and shallow, useless men use their money to get a body. They both wind up unhappy.
Gold digging is a relative term from a monetary standpoint. When I look up the definition it doesn't say "above 45,000 or only millionaires".
A GD is simply a woman who goes after a man simply for his economic status and the lifestyle it will help her live. It doesn't matter whether he's making 250 million a year or 10,000 a year. It also doesn't really matter how much money she makes either. A woman who makes 150,000 but is going after the millionaire for those reasons is still a goldigger even tho she can more then well take care of her self.
The whole "well she has money so she can't POSSIBLY be a gold digger" idea is one of the big misconceptions
I'll be honest - I actually never gave any thought to whether or not the guys I dated were financially secure and stable. I met my husband when I was 25. The guy I was with before that was a guitar player who lived with his parents. The guy before that was my high school/college sweet heart. I dated other guys but that was while I was in college. Money was never an issue. My husband is successful - but when we met - we were on tour together and he was making a little more than I was. But would I have stayed with him if he had a gambling problem, if he spent money willy nilly, or hated what he did? Probably not. And honestly, if I had wanted to date someone who had a lot of money - I would have. I worked at an upscale gym and was constantly getting asked out by very wealthy men.
So, it seems you are of the camp that most women are basically gold diggers as well - otherwise you wouldn't have brought all this up to begin with, I'm assuming.
did you read my prior post with the definition of gold digger?
and using my definition, your assumption is incorrect and that is not my beliefs.
do i believe women consider a man's financial status and resources when evaluating him for a long term mate?
abolutely, no doubt about it. and really boggles my mind how evasive women are on this issues. like it's shameful or unlady like to admit it.
every guy i know grows up with the societal message that being a successful man allows you to have a greater selection in choice in the women you date and marry. every guy.
just like every women i know grows up with the societal message that being physically attractive allows you to have a greater selection in choice the the men you date and marry. every woman.
sure there are variants, this is a "generalization", not some women, blah blah blah. all you have to do is observe popular media and the message is there right in front of you. no kidding.
most men who have deep pockets can sense a gold digger a mile away, but they would never complain, because they know exactly what they're after, and is more than willing to give. in general, its really no different than prostitution.
Exactly. And if they're not interested, they know how to avoid them just like any of us steer clear of the ones in whom we're not interested.
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