Feel like I'm always the "Practice Girl"! Need Feedback & Advice! (boyfriend, long-term)
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To the OP, when you say you're attractive, are men telling you that often, you're friends, or is it your own opinion? I ask b/c many women do something foolish like "cut their hair", and then female friends will say it looks "chic". But guess what, men don't give as damm about Chic!
Are the nails manicured, is the hair long, are the feet looking good, hows the bodyfat, acne issues? A lot of effort- especiallly when your are middle age- goes into being attractive.
Also, being very outspoken isn't a very attractive trait to most men. That's why I actively seek to avoid the "strong black women". No thanks! Men don't like to think that you feel u are smarter than them, even if u are.
I'd say those are some pretty insecure men.
I'll add that the easily intimidated wussies you mention are in no way, shape, or form "most" men.
Wow, I actually expected some sympathy or empathy here for my dilemma, for feeling like I'm never the "closer", always the "middle reliever", not all these attacks & hostile criticism! Just want to point out that when I chided Coolhand68, it was because he stated some conclusions about me that were not true (he actually accused me of these things) -- that I don't have any friends & that I'm not around people that much. Seems like he misinterpreted what I said about not having any close female friends in my life right now. And yes, I prefer to get a female point of view about this situation because other females might have been thru similar situations with men before.
Find it amazing how so many here have problems with how I described myself. I used the word "attractive" in a very generic way, but never claimed to be this raving beauty or that I'm perfect! Just generally attractive for my age. In fact, all my life I've never felt that my looks were my strong point, have had lots of insecurities about my looks. There's been many times when I've felt very unattractive compared to most other women. But I recognize that realistically that's not true, I'm reasonably attractive. I'm also very active for my age, usually play singles tennis about 5 days a week, do a lot of running on the court. It's true that I also battle some extra weight most of the time, but not bad for being in my 50s. And I try to remain upbeat and confident, especially when meeting new people, because supposedly, when you act confident, you appear more attractive.
I mentioned being outspoken because wanted to emphasize that most people don't view me as a doormat, pushover type of woman. Yet I always feel that men tend to view me this way, as someone who's just ready to be taken for granted, convenient for the time being, but not special enough for the long run.
Believe me, the guy I met yesterday was OK looking, average-looking but certainly not movie-star handsome, which was fine with me. (he's also in his 50s, a few years older than me.) He was also not in perfect shape either, trying to exercise more and get into better shape. Again, that was fine with me, I identify more with people who are not perfect-looking themselves, I like to be around people who are trying to be healthier, eat healthier, exercise more, etc. I thought that conversation between us came easy, we had a lot to talk about, it was all very pleasant and relaxed. And it was a beautiful day, great weather, wonderful setting. Hey, I love playing tennis, it brings out the best in me, we were both smiling a lot. He's the one who brought up maybe getting together for some other things, going to movies, getting something to eat, etc. That's why I was so surprised that the next day his email stated he "would definitely be interested in playing (tennis with) the lady" I told him about (actually I just mentioned her briefly, that I had been playing tennis for a while w/this woman who was around my age)-- it was like, what am I, some kind of matchmaker? Someone you look beyond, looking off into the distance for someone better?
Starting to think the answer is that I should get into a life of crime, maybe robbing stores-- It's like I'm the Invisible Woman, no one would notice what I'm doing, remember me or be able to identify me later!
Wow, I actually expected some sympathy or empathy here for my dilemma, for feeling like I'm never the "closer", always the "middle reliever", not all these attacks & hostile criticism! Just want to point out that when I chided Coolhand68, it was because he stated some conclusions about me that were not true (he actually accused me of these things) -- that I don't have any friends & that I'm not around people that much. Seems like he misinterpreted what I said about not having any close female friends in my life right now. And yes, I prefer to get a female point of view about this situation because other females might have been thru similar situations with men before.
Find it amazing how so many here have problems with how I described myself. I used the word "attractive" in a very generic way, but never claimed to be this raving beauty or that I'm perfect! Just generally attractive for my age. In fact, all my life I've never felt that my looks were my strong point, have had lots of insecurities about my looks. There's been many times when I've felt very unattractive compared to most other women. But I recognize that realistically that's not true, I'm reasonably attractive. I'm also very active for my age, usually play singles tennis about 5 days a week, do a lot of running on the court. It's true that I also battle some extra weight most of the time, but not bad for being in my 50s. And I try to remain upbeat and confident, especially when meeting new people, because supposedly, when you act confident, you appear more attractive.
I mentioned being outspoken because wanted to emphasize that most people don't view me as a doormat, pushover type of woman. Yet I always feel that men tend to view me this way, as someone who's just ready to be taken for granted, convenient for the time being, but not special enough for the long run.
Believe me, the guy I met yesterday was OK looking, average-looking but certainly not movie-star handsome, which was fine with me. (he's also in his 50s, a few years older than me.) He was also not in perfect shape either, trying to exercise more and get into better shape. Again, that was fine with me, I identify more with people who are not perfect-looking themselves, I like to be around people who are trying to be healthier, eat healthier, exercise more, etc. I thought that conversation between us came easy, we had a lot to talk about, it was all very pleasant and relaxed. And it was a beautiful day, great weather, wonderful setting. Hey, I love playing tennis, it brings out the best in me, we were both smiling a lot. He's the one who brought up maybe getting together for some other things, going to movies, getting something to eat, etc. That's why I was so surprised that the next day his email stated he "would definitely be interested in playing (tennis with) the lady" I told him about (actually I just mentioned her briefly, that I had been playing tennis for a while w/this woman who was around my age)-- it was like, what am I, some kind of matchmaker? Someone you look beyond, looking off into the distance for someone better?
Starting to think the answer is that I should get into a life of crime, maybe robbing stores-- It's like I'm the Invisible Woman, no one would notice what I'm doing, remember me or be able to identify me later!
Naw.. seriously you do not have to do that.. personally speaking I think you are overreacting and seriously talking yourself out of something that could be good for you.. you never know. He may be attempting (as someone else said) to ensure that he has an open spot in your calender so that he can continue playing with you even though you generally play with your friend (who happens to be away right now).
I believe your putting more into what he said then there really is.. Now dont get me wrong.. I could be wrong.. but hey.. calm down a level or three and see what happens... if it is in fact someone using you to get to someone else.. well hey.. switch from using tennis racquets to baseball bats...
Find it amazing how so many here have problems with how I described myself. I used the word "attractive" in a very generic way, but never claimed to be this raving beauty or that I'm perfect! Just generally attractive for my age. In fact, all my life I've never felt that my looks were my strong point, have had lots of insecurities about my looks. There's been many times when I've felt very unattractive compared to most other women. But I recognize that realistically that's not true, I'm reasonably attractive. I'm also very active for my age, usually play singles tennis about 5 days a week, do a lot of running on the court. It's true that I also battle some extra weight most of the time, but not bad for being in my 50s. !
Well when you said 50 and attractive, I thought u looked something like these ladies. Ad anyway, nobody's perfect GORGEOUS GRANNIES
Wow, I actually expected some sympathy or empathy here for my dilemma, for feeling like I'm never the "closer", always the "middle reliever", not all these attacks & hostile criticism! Just want to point out that when I chided Coolhand68, it was because he stated some conclusions about me that were not true (he actually accused me of these things) -- that I don't have any friends & that I'm not around people that much. Seems like he misinterpreted what I said about not having any close female friends in my life right now. And yes, I prefer to get a female point of view about this situation because other females might have been thru similar situations with men before.
(snip)
Starting to think the answer is that I should get into a life of crime, maybe robbing stores-- It's like I'm the Invisible Woman, no one would notice what I'm doing, remember me or be able to identify me later!
Said the woman who completely ignored the response in which a certain feathered friend expressed empathy, but who's counting?
I think you misread the guy's words completely. He was simply being social by saying he'd be interested in playing tennis with your friend, nothing more, since you found him on Craigslist to play tennis with, not Match.com to romance with.
Big difference. And he is well aware of it.
Had you and he met on Match.com or some other DATING site, then yes, it would've seemed strange he would say that. But you did not seek him out for a date, from HIS perspective, but for a game of tennis.
You don't go to the grocery store looking for shoes. Don't go to Craiglist looking for a boyfriend. Go to a dating site. That spells out your intentions 100% clearly. No man is going to make the mistake of saying yes to a tennis game unless they ARE INTERESTED in you.
This doesn't mean you can't meet men and fall in love outside of dating sites. But if a man doesn't show interest in you after he has met you, then he IS NOT INTO YOU PERIOD. It's that loud and clear.
Anything other than asking you out for a date is a BIG LOUD "NO, I'M NOT INTERESTED IN YOU!!!"
So #1, Do not pine away for him or even waste time thinking about him. He is also not interested in your friend. He is just playing tennis.
#2, Stop focusing on if a man might be interested in you, and START focusing on what YOU are doing and thinking, that does not involve a man. Are you making yourself happy? What are you doing right now to put a smile on your own face? Are you in love with your life?
We seek whatever we seek (relationships, food, travel, careers, money, possessions) in order to feel good. So our goal is to feel good, whether or not we get there via the things I listed. But if we can FEEL GOOD and bypass those things, we achieve the goal, don't we?
So feel good regardless, and when you are enjoying your life, you will come across as confident and beautiful, and believe me, you will attract men. By that time, you won't even care about it!
Avienne, sorry I didn't acknowledge your responses earlier, I appreciate that you seemed like the only responder who seemed to know what I was getting at, who was emphathetic. But my writing about being the "Invisible Woman" referred to the fact that men seem to discount me as a potential special person in their life, they seem to look thru me and around me for a "better", more "special" woman. (So maybe I should turn to a life of crime since people, especially men, don't notice me, it's like I'm invisible!)
Aqua0, I know that this guy and I met thru an "activities" ad on Craigslist, not a dating ad. But he was the one who brought up maybe doing other things together like going to a movie!
Quote:
He was simply being social by saying he'd be interested in playing tennis with your friend
Quote:
Had you and he met on Match.com or some other DATING site, then yes, it would've seemed strange he would say that. But you did not seek him out for a date, from HIS perspective, but for a game of tennis.
I'd like to point out that even if playing tennis was all we met for and all we planned to do together, it was still very strange for him to say he'd "definitely be interested in playing" the lady I've played tennis with before-- and the way he wrote it implied that I had suggested he do this, which is simply not true at all, I just briefly mentioned her. We don't play doubles tennis, just singles, so it was almost like bad tennis "etiquette."
And it's also like saying, Well, it's OK playing tennis with you, but I'd rather try to play tennis against someone else, why don't I just steal away someone you already play tennis with?! (My male roommate-- a male platonic friend I've known & played tennis with for years, he and I play tennis every weekend-- looked at this guy's email and his first reaction was that yes, it was a very strange, almost inappropriate thing for him to say to me considering the circumstances.) Maybe I should just say to this guy, Hey, place your own ad for tennis partners and make the effort like I did, don't take away tennis players from me! It's almost like he doubly insulted me!
I am a 34 year old female. I say this because I am not going to pretend to be an expert on the dating issues of the baby boomer population.
My PERSONAL opinion is that perhaps your bad experiences have made you jaded, when in fact these men moving on from you has nothing to do with you at all. Are you dating men who are not emotionally available? Do you think you give off an aura of anger, as you have had some bad experiences? Sometimes we don't even know we come across in an offputting way.
As for this new gentleman you met to play tennis with, we don't really know his intentions, as YOU JUST MET HIM. Give it some time. If nothing else, you have met another friend. Friends are good. Friends sometimes have single, handsome friends.
While I don't know what your cohort experiences in the dating world, I do know what it feels like to be a rejected woman, to see a man stop dating me and move on to someone less educated, less beautiful, fatter. After it happens a few times, it can make a woman wonder if we have a giant wart everyone else but us can see. I found that my "wart" was the men I was dating.
Make sure when you become involved with someone what their circumstances are. People can be funny. This guy's wife was killed 4 years ago. Maybe he isn't ready. Maybe he is a mental wreck. Maybe he is looking to replace his wife with someone very similar. Who knows? Time will tell.
I am a 34 year old female. I say this because I am not going to pretend to be an expert on the dating issues of the baby boomer population.
My PERSONAL opinion is that perhaps your bad experiences have made you jaded, when in fact these men moving on from you has nothing to do with you at all. Are you dating men who are not emotionally available? Do you think you give off an aura of anger, as you have had some bad experiences? Sometimes we don't even know we come across in an offputting way.
As for this new gentleman you met to play tennis with, we don't really know his intentions, as YOU JUST MET HIM. Give it some time. If nothing else, you have met another friend. Friends are good. Friends sometimes have single, handsome friends.
While I don't know what your cohort experiences in the dating world, I do know what it feels like to be a rejected woman, to see a man stop dating me and move on to someone less educated, less beautiful, fatter. After it happens a few times, it can make a woman wonder if we have a giant wart everyone else but us can see. I found that my "wart" was the men I was dating.
Make sure when you become involved with someone what their circumstances are. People can be funny. This guy's wife was killed 4 years ago. Maybe he isn't ready. Maybe he is a mental wreck. Maybe he is looking to replace his wife with someone very similar. Who knows? Time will tell.
Very well put.. and yeah.. after a few more responses from the OP.. JADED is a very good word for what is probably happening here...
I'm a single female (never married, no kids, early 50s but active & young-looking) who has sadly come to realize that there's been an ongoing negative pattern in the the majority of my romantic/dating relationships: I'm seen as a convenience. As long as I'm "convenient" for a male, it's OK with him. But if he has to put much effort into being with me, it doesn't seem worth it to him and he moves on. This is based on years of dating experience (I'm in my early 50s, still active & young-looking.) I try to be optimistic & open-minded about dating but time & time again it becomes apparent to me that no male thinks of me as that valuable, worth their time & effort.
It's not as if I'm a doormat or a pushover, I'm outspoken & don't let other people push me around. And I think I have a lot to offer someone in a relationship-- I'm attractive, intelligent, creative, good conversationalist, fun, good sense of humor, active, a sports fan, caring, affectionate, passionate, etc. Yet, time and time again, the only men who show any interest in me are those who are in a transitional period in their lives: going thru a divorce, new to an area, etc. It's as if I'm the "practice woman", there for them to practice their social skills on & then move on to the "real" women in their lives. I'm so tired of being the "middle reliever"! Would like to be the "Closer" once and for all!
Just yesterday, I met someone to play tennis from an ad I placed looking for tennis players under "Activities" on Craigslist. This was an ad seeking male or female tennis players, I've met many tennis players this way. Well, turns out this guy was very nice, around my age, good tennis player though not as good as me since he hadn't played for a few years. We got a good workout & had fun playing tennis, everything was going fine, took some breaks where we sat in the shade & talked, got to know more about each other. I thought I made a good impression, conversation came easy & we had quite a few interests in common. He's new to the area, a widower w/ no kids, his wife died 4 yrs ago in a car accident, he's had some health problems & his job allows him to work from home. (He and I are both semi-retired.) He mentioned how he doesn't like always doing things alone, would be nice to have someone to go to a movie or a ballgame or out to eat together. Seemed like he expressed some interest in me & we made plans to play tennis again next week. At the same time, seemed like he might be interested in getting together before that. I left feeling upbeat that things had gone well.
Well, this morning, was shocked to get an email from him stating this: "It was great meeting you for tennis. I would definitely be interested in playing the lady you told me about as well as checking out the racquetball courts sometime" (we had talked about other racquet sports.) My reaction was WTF?? That's what he leads with, using me to find another female tennis player? I had never suggested he play tennis with this other woman, had just briefly mentioned that I sometimes played tennis with another woman my age but she was away for the next few weeks. And that I liked playing tennis against a variety of players anyway, that's why I placed my ad seeking more tennis players for weekdays. (I already have set tennis plans every weekend with my roommate.) I had NEVER mentioned setting him up with this other woman! When I emailed back, I just made a joke about keeping my list of other tennis players a secret and stated I'd see him for tennis next week.
I know I might be over-reacting but this feels like a slap in the face! Again, someone using me to get to know other people! Again, I feel like someone just looks right through me, that I'm not worth spending time with but maybe I know someone better? Guess I'm turning to this forum for feedback, especially from other females, need a female opinion, currently don't have a good female friend to ask. So, am I over-reacting? Also, advice on how to avoid always being put in the role of the "practice girl", the "helpful" friend or pal? I'm not a "demanding spoiled princess" type of female at all-- am I supposed to act that way in order to attract males or get respect from them???
It may be less you and more that that particular man does not want to put too much effort into any woman.
Maybe he is like you and wanted to play with a variety of people as well.
And you were his network to meet them.
Especially since in your post you said you mentioned her briefly.
No description of her than that you play tennis with her.
Unless you said more than that, in which case he might be interested.
If this is the case I can see why you feel as you do.
Just seems like that there is some aspect of you that makes you more of a 'friend' in the guys you are meeting.
Maybe adopting a little conceit may help.
Feeling like you are worthy of any quality gentleman you choose would be a possible good choice.
People can sense things and they may be picking up on the fact that you resign yourself to the 'friend zone'.
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