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Old 09-20-2011, 10:48 AM
 
Location: 8 million + strong
87 posts, read 71,571 times
Reputation: 17

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoWitnesses View Post
I found this below excerpt online about Mithra and Paul's theology. I stumbled on it by accident when I was researching the book burning at Alexandria just now.

I may not be on much the next few days or weeks. I will be a bit busy, but I'll try to be back soon!

Here is the excerpt:
"I don't find it strange anymore that there is a four thousand year-old legend among the Zoroastrians; the legend of Mithra. He is supposed to have been born of a virgin on December 25th. Mithra was considered as the "lamb of god." He atoned for the sins of people by dying. Then he resurrected on the third day! There is strong reason to believe that Saint Paul fabricated the belief system of Christianity from the Zoroastrian mythology. In order to hide Paul's plagiarism . . . the Christians burned the library of Alexandria in 390 A.D. Books in that library kept Mithra's original story of which the Pauline Doctrine is an almost exact carbon copy. (George Sarton - Introduction to the History of Science) <<

>> No honest Christian scholar can deny that Saint Paul forged the belief system of Christianity from the four thousand year old Persian legend of Mithra. In order to hide Paul's plagiarism, the Church burned the library of Alexandria in 389 since that library preserved Mithra's original legend of which the Pauline doctrine is a carbon copy. (Kersey Graves - Christianity Before Christ) <<

Hello TwoWitnesses and All

It's great to see a scholarly men side with the Romans who allegedly hated Christians and saw them as the enemy. Too think 'they' the scholars do not have an agenda is too trusting of us. Maybe because they reflect our values more than say a 'enemy' does.

Who are these 'Christians'?

Any why were Persian documents and artifacts stored in Alexandria Egypt which was at the time under Roman authority.

The Roman empires had a series of battles and wars with the Persians of the Middle East. Therefore the Persians too were considered the 'enemy'.

So were these 'Christians' 'Persians' in reality who wanted back what Rome had taken from them because of breaking of 'treaties' they the Romans made with Persia.

Anyway all is fair in war, right? I said all. Not taking sides.

Any why did Roman officials wanted to possess Persian belief systems especially not in Rome but in Alexandria, Egypt? Was there a power in Alexandria, Egypt that supercede Roman authority in Rome, Italy?

Today we see our pleasant 'Roman' selves predicting a battle with Iran (Persia). Are we just trying to fulfill the desires of our 'fathers'?

There will always be history hidden to the eyes of the reader. But whose eyes.

Say what you want about Paul but we all know Paul had Roman citizenship (biblically) and maybe he was a "spy" too. His court cases he alledgedly went through treated him like a 'spy' against the Roman empire. Biblically and historically 'Christians' at that time were the least of least problems for the Roman empire. Their numbers could not match the power of the Roman empire.

That's my thoughts on the matter.

Thanks.
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Prattville, Alabama
4,883 posts, read 5,116,625 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
My attempt at proselytizing.


That is the very reason we believe Allaah(swt) sent the Qur'an to Muhammad(PBUH). We believe the Qur'an is the same message Jesus(as) taught as the Injil.

But, no matter what I say, I do pray you search and satisfy yourself you find/have found the true teachings of Jesus(as).

We both can agree the teachings of Jesus(as) are not to be found in the NT.
Not true...some of his teachings can still be found in the NT...but it does take considerable discernment to mine through all the minutia in order to find them.
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:25 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 12,506,822 times
Reputation: 7377
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristyGrl View Post
Not true...some of his teachings can still be found in the NT...but it does take considerable discernment to mine through all the minutia in order to find them.
My constant and often repeated error. When a person implies all or none of anything. somebody will find an exception.

I agree some of, if not all, of the quotes attributed to Jesus(as) in John Mark, Matthew and Luke are the actual teachings of Jesus(as)

I am quite convinced the "Sermon on the Mount" is a true teaching. There are others. Have to avoid throwing the baby out with the bath water. But it is hard to find a filter that will sort everything, it takes work and work is a 4 letter word.

Easier for me to go to the Qur'an where the sorting has already been done.
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Old 09-20-2011, 01:21 PM
 
Location: FROM Dixie, but IN SoCal
3,491 posts, read 5,292,510 times
Reputation: 3737
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
... We both can agree the teachings of Jesus(as) are not to be found in the NT.
Hello Woodrow, my friend!

The above eloquently explains why I describe myself as "one who follows the teachings of Christ as he understands them."

And for all: The celebration of Christ's birth on December 25th was an attempt by the 3rd Bishop of Rome to co-opt a number of pre-Christian celebrations, including Juvenalia, Saturnalia and the birth of Mithras (who sprang into this world from a stone, not from a human mother).
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Old 09-20-2011, 01:24 PM
 
5,495 posts, read 4,400,471 times
Reputation: 1802
Speaking of source material where is it for the Mithraic parallels?
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Old 09-20-2011, 01:30 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 12,506,822 times
Reputation: 7377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiloh1 View Post
Speaking of source material where is it for the Mithraic parallels?
Which post is that in reference to?
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Old 09-20-2011, 01:57 PM
 
Location: Sylmar, California
817 posts, read 573,482 times
Reputation: 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristyGrl View Post
Given that the bible had been severly edited by the political powers of that time and given the religious climate of that time towards the Jews, who were losing their religious power over the people they once had...do you honestly believe Jesus actually said that????
I see your point!

I wish it was in the Gospel of Luke or John..because I'd have an easier time dismissing it!


I really want to look at all the excluded Gospels...but it seems that there may not be much available to look at. Maybe those were burned in Alexandria also.

There's a great website called www.sacred-texts.com that might have some of them. The search engine is kind of weird, but if I look hard enough I might find them.

I'm still in the process of reading "Misquoting Jesus" by Ehrman, too. I'll get back to you on the "dogs" quote if I find anything!
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Old 09-20-2011, 02:12 PM
 
5,495 posts, read 4,400,471 times
Reputation: 1802
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Which post is that in reference to?
Any post supporting the Mithraic parallels. Primary source material please!
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Old 09-20-2011, 02:27 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 12,506,822 times
Reputation: 7377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiloh1 View Post
Any post supporting the Mithraic parallels. Primary source material please!
I didn't post anything supporting the Mithraic Parallels, I have no idea were anybody got their source from. Perhaps the OP has it in the first post of this thread.

ADDENDUM: The OP did state the source of the opening post. No where did the OP lead anyone to believe He/She was the author.

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoWitnesses View Post
I found this below excerpt online about Mithra and Paul's theology. I stumbled on it by accident when I was researching the book burning at Alexandria just now.

I may not be on much the next few days or weeks. I will be a bit busy, but I'll try to be back soon!

Here is the excerpt:
"I don't find it strange anymore that there is a four thousand year-old legend among the Zoroastrians; the legend of Mithra. He is supposed to have been born of a virgin on December 25th. Mithra was considered as the "lamb of god." He atoned for the sins of people by dying. Then he resurrected on the third day! There is strong reason to believe that Saint Paul fabricated the belief system of Christianity from the Zoroastrian mythology. In order to hide Paul's plagiarism . . . the Christians burned the library of Alexandria in 390 A.D. Books in that library kept Mithra's original story of which the Pauline Doctrine is an almost exact carbon copy. (George Sarton - Introduction to the History of Science) <<

>> No honest Christian scholar can deny that Saint Paul forged the belief system of Christianity from the four thousand year old Persian legend of Mithra. In order to hide Paul's plagiarism, the Church burned the library of Alexandria in 389 since that library preserved Mithra's original legend of which the Pauline doctrine is a carbon copy. (Kersey Graves - Christianity Before Christ) <<

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Old 09-20-2011, 02:32 PM
 
Location: Sylmar, California
817 posts, read 573,482 times
Reputation: 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pup Eli View Post
Hello TwoWitnesses and All

It's great to see a scholarly men side with the Romans who allegedly hated Christians and saw them as the enemy. Too think 'they' the scholars do not have an agenda is too trusting of us. Maybe because they reflect our values more than say a 'enemy' does.

Who are these 'Christians'?

Any why were Persian documents and artifacts stored in Alexandria Egypt which was at the time under Roman authority.

The Roman empires had a series of battles and wars with the Persians of the Middle East. Therefore the Persians too were considered the 'enemy'.

So were these 'Christians' 'Persians' in reality who wanted back what Rome had taken from them because of breaking of 'treaties' they the Romans made with Persia.

Anyway all is fair in war, right? I said all. Not taking sides.

Any why did Roman officials wanted to possess Persian belief systems especially not in Rome but in Alexandria, Egypt? Was there a power in Alexandria, Egypt that supercede Roman authority in Rome, Italy?

Today we see our pleasant 'Roman' selves predicting a battle with Iran (Persia). Are we just trying to fulfill the desires of our 'fathers'?

There will always be history hidden to the eyes of the reader. But whose eyes.

Say what you want about Paul but we all know Paul had Roman citizenship (biblically) and maybe he was a "spy" too. His court cases he alledgedly went through treated him like a 'spy' against the Roman empire. Biblically and historically 'Christians' at that time were the least of least problems for the Roman empire. Their numbers could not match the power of the Roman empire.

That's my thoughts on the matter.

Thanks.
Great post! I will look into all this!
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