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Old 11-08-2007, 03:29 AM
 
Location: Mississippi
6,712 posts, read 13,460,010 times
Reputation: 4317

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I finally made it up to NYC this past weekend. My wife and I went to the World Trade Centers. My first thought upon seeing Ground Zero was subtle amazement.

My first thought walking into the memorial building brought it into perspective for me. On one wall are photocopies of the actual missing posters of many of the people.

On another wall, behind a glass case, are pictures of the people that died. Well, about half of them. It was then that I realized, looking into all those bright shining faces who had so much taken away from them that God must certainly not exist.

I can understand perhaps the difference in good and evil in a childish concept of mischief vs. good. But, is it so necessary to take away almost 3000 people in one fell swoop? Is it entirely necessary to allow things like that to occur? Was it necessary for each one of those families to experience the tragedies that they did? All for what? What was God's purpose for that?

Was it to get people closer to him? Was it to allow people to see him better? To ask him questions? To allow people to commit atrocities like that in HIS name? No, I say. No!

There is no such thing as God. Something like that was not necessary. Sometimes you don't realize the true tragedy until you can experience it in some small way. If there is a God, than I want no part of him for he is as wicked as the men who flew those airplanes into the building for allowing it to happen.
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Old 11-08-2007, 04:18 AM
 
2,482 posts, read 8,733,071 times
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Glad you found your path of faith ( or lack there of ), now let others find their's and let them be
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Old 11-08-2007, 07:49 AM
 
Location: Maine
22,920 posts, read 28,273,802 times
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Bad things happening neither proves nor disproves the existence of God. A bit crude, but Stephen King's argument makes a good point:

Quote:
People blather to me and they say, “How can there be a God if He allows the Holocaust or World War II to happen?” or “How can there be a God who lets Chad Green die of leukemia?” But hey! We just happen to have this ionospheric screen that keeps out killing radiation. And we just happen never to have been hit by a meteor big enough to destroy this planet, even though space is full of that ****, like dandruff on a guy with psoriasis. So to me the idea of saying, “There can be no God because God allowed 6 million Jews to be killed by the Nazis” is like saying “There can be no God because God let somebody fart in an elevator.” The cosmos is just too big.

--- From Bare Bones: Conversations on Terror with Stephen King, pp. 140-141
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:19 AM
 
11,558 posts, read 12,054,189 times
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Default What or Who is God?

I have a belief in a spiritual power, but what or who is it? I cannot fathom a person sitting on a throne in the sky...that just doesn't ring true.

And I do not accept a "Father" in the sky who will allow anyone to be abused or have bad things happen just because he is testing us, or that it will make us a better person. If our earthly father/parent treated us that way he would be arrested and hopefully put in prison for child abuse!

I will not just "accept" the thoughts and beliefs of others at face value or out of a guilt-trip scenario (believe or go to Hell!)...or, when I ask questions I am told: "Well, if you believe and it's true, then all the better....if you don't believe and what I'm telling you is true...you know where that will leave you!" That is not a valid answer.

I just have a lot of questions and do not appreciate being told that I have no right to ask because that is blasphemy - or being told I'm going to hell if I don't believe and just "accept".

There are many religions and each will tell you that their's is the only path to take. So who's right and who's wrong?

We all need to respect other's beliefs, and we all should expect the same in return.

Is there an afterlife? You got me. None of us still living have ever truly seen any proof. We will find out after we die. But then, I am told that after you die (Christian belief) you will not remember what happened on earth (???), and that you will be reunited with loved ones (what about the ones you had arguments with?), and you have a perfect body and will sit around all day in a city of gold....um, sounds nice, but for eternity?

What about those who claim to have experienced near-death episodes....truth or fiction? Since it hasn't happened to me, I have no idea. Scientists claim those episodes are just brain cells running amuck. I have heard about children who experienced near-death events and said they were greeted by a deceased relative whom they had never known about...now, that is something to think about. But, I have not heard this directly from the child involved, it came from an adult who made the claim (just made up?).

And claims about people who are dying and tell others they see a bright light at the end of a tunnel. Scientists again claim it's the brain cells dying off???

This whole thing is a very interesting subject and one that I find fascinating.
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:20 AM
 
3,086 posts, read 6,272,535 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GCSTroop View Post
I Am Now Certain God Doesn't Exist
GCS, you were already "certain" before you went... and I'm sure that many of the victim's families take comfort in their certainty of God's existence.
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:22 AM
 
Location: Oxford, England
13,026 posts, read 24,628,555 times
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Welcome to the club ! Believe me you are not the only one. We might not be as vocal as believers but Atheism is pretty big.
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:23 AM
 
Location: Seattle
7,541 posts, read 17,235,568 times
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Quote:
The cosmos is just too big.
But that rings completely opposite to the personalistic God of the Christian viewpoint. If anything, that points to a more deistic worldview, one in complete opposition to the jealous, vengeful God of the Old Testament and the compassionate, involved manifestation in the New.
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:25 AM
Status: "Happy 2024" (set 10 hours ago)
 
Location: Texas
8,672 posts, read 22,269,800 times
Reputation: 21369
Quote:
Originally Posted by cg81 View Post
GCS, you were already "certain" before you went... and I'm sure that many of the victim's families take comfort in their certainty of God's existence.
That's exactly what I thought too. Our worldview, whatever it is, often colors our interpretation of an event.
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:45 AM
 
3,695 posts, read 11,372,565 times
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God didn't allow it to happen - we did. It was our own failure, not His.
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:47 AM
 
Location: Seattle
7,541 posts, read 17,235,568 times
Reputation: 4853
Nobody failed at anything. The people who did this were evil and poisoned by extremist religious thought. How can that be failure on anyone's part?
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