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The employer doesn't have the right to discriminate and that's what I see is going on. Others have pointed out that it is no different than if a coworker pressured a Christian worker to go out and have a beer with the guys. I've had that happen before and it made me uncomfortable. Did I try to get the person fired? No. I would probably be laughed at for complaining.
There is a huge difference between being asked to go along for a beer and being told your sexual orientation is immoral or wrong. The example would be more if the christian was always told at work they were wrong and immoral for believing in the wrong god. you get uncomfortable from simply being asked out for a beer you are probably more easily offended than these women. When did Christians stop drinking beer?
As far as an employer not being allowed to discriminate why do you claim that the county clerk and the baker should be allowed to discriminate? I admit that the three cases are different but you just said employer cannot discriminate to employees but can to customers.
And once again you make a baseless accusation. You have zero evidence that the HR department, the company owner or either of the women were not Christian and yet you keep accusing them of discrimination against Christians. More ignoring the facts of the case and the 9th commandment. The bias facts we are using against this guy are his own statements. You do not realize just how bias you are against gays or maybe how blind you are t9 the fact that Christians are sometimes in the wrong.
Location: In a little house on the prairie - literally
10,202 posts, read 7,922,771 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
You mean facts tainted by an extreme biased against Christianity. People think it's wrong because well they would personally find it annoying. That completely ignores the moral ethical aspect of the argument which is whether someone deserves to lose their job of 13 years because you didn't like their beliefs. That is cold hearted and frankly disgusting. What if this guy can't feed his family now? All because lesbians were offended.
Maybe your special snowflake should have thought about how to feed his family before he chose not to listen to HR.
Oh. I know!
I bet he could put up a Gofundme page! What an original idea.
There is a huge difference between being asked to go along for a beer and being told your sexual orientation is immoral or wrong. The example would be more if the christian was always told at work they were wrong and immoral for believing in the wrong god. you get uncomfortable from simply being asked out for a beer you are probably more easily offended than these women. When did Christians stop drinking beer?
As far as an employer not being allowed to discriminate why do you claim that the county clerk and the baker should be allowed to discriminate? I admit that the three cases are different but you just said employer cannot discriminate to employees but can to customers.
And once again you make a baseless accusation. You have zero evidence that the HR department, the company owner or either of the women were not Christian and yet you keep accusing them of discrimination against Christians. More ignoring the facts of the case and the 9th commandment. The bias facts we are using against this guy are his own statements. You do not realize just how bias you are against gays or maybe how blind you are t9 the fact that Christians are sometimes in the wrong.
Since you bring up the question, I will get off this topic a bit. You probably will not like me for saying this. As a gay man, I am for discrimination if it is an honest discrimination - They cannot discriminate against anyone if that person is not on the list they put in front of their stores. I would like to see "we reserve the right to refuse service to ......(gay, Buddhists, Wiccans, Jews, pagans, atheists, etc). If businesses are allowed to this, I bet they will lose a lot of customers who are not just in minority groups. A majority of Americans, even the ones I knew from the south, support equality. I bet they will not support discrimination from these businesses.
Last edited by mensaguy; 09-30-2015 at 03:55 AM..
Reason: Red is reserved for Moderator actions.
Atheists seem to think they should have the right to be shielded completely from religion. Don't talk about it, don't pray in public, don't show any sign of your faith unless it is behind closed church doors.
Not met a single person who thinks that actually. I have told you how it is the exact opposite of this, many times, with many examples. But you do like to cling to your narratives without letting facts get in the way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
whether someone deserves to lose their job of 13 years because you didn't like their beliefs.
You have not once established that this is what happened. You have just seen a Christian get fired, you admit you do not have any facts on the case, yet you presume to simply invent reasons and explanations to fit into your ongoing Christian persecution narrative. That is frankly disgusting.
You mean facts tainted by an extreme biased against Christianity. People think it's wrong because well they would personally find it annoying. That completely ignores the moral ethical aspect of the argument which is whether someone deserves to lose their job of 13 years because you didn't like their beliefs. That is cold hearted and frankly disgusting. What if this guy can't feed his family now? All because lesbians were offended.
So what if he can't? He should have thought about that before he told his boss he wouldn't stop harassing people, and then proceeded to do it again. The facts in this case are all from his POV, and in your story. He recommended a movie that any person with even a pea sized brain would know is offensive to gays. She complained about it, and he was told to knock it off. He said he would not knock it off, and in fact would continue doing it whether the boss like it or not. He got another complaint filed, and he got canned.
How do you not get this? It is not hard to understand. He was not fired for being a Christian, or even for speaking about being a Christian. He was fired for harassing his coworkers, and ignoring a direct order from his boss to stop. You seem incapable of seeing the difference. Here let me illustrate the difference for you...
Fired for Speaking About Being a Christian:
Him: Yes, I am a Christian, and I go to X Church.
Boss: You're fired.
Fired for Ignoring Direct Orders/Harassing Employees:
Boss: Stop harassing people dude, it isn't good for productivity.
Him: Nah Bro, I ain't ever stopping.
Boss: Dude, I'm telling you, if you don't stop there will be consequences.
*Later in that week*
Boss: Dude, I told you to stop, you didn't listen. Go home.
Since you bring up the question, I will get off this topic a bit. You probably will not like me for saying this. As a gay man, I am for discrimination if it is an honest discrimination - They cannot discriminate against anyone if that person is not on the list they put in front of their stores. I would like to see "we reserve the right to refuse service to ......(gay, Buddhists, Wiccans, Jews, pagans, atheists, etc). If businesses are allowed to this, I bet they will lose a lot of customers who are not just in minority groups. A majority of Americans, even the ones I knew from the south, support equality. I bet they will not support discrimination from these businesses.
It could go either way. Most people seek social reciprocity above all else, so they will tend to wait and see what the majority do, and go along with it. Anywhere such sentiments are encouraged to "honestly" come out of the closet of shame they are currently in, it may be common enough to gain purchase as at least a minority point of view that is protected so long as it is out in the open.
I tend to share your optimism however that most businesses would not take such an overt stance because the social costs would in most cases exceed the perceived, much less actual, benefits. Also, the money of homosexuals and those who would stand with them is as good as anyone's and I suspect the businessperson part of them would pragmatically override the bigot aspect of themselves. It's one thing to grouse about things you don't like, it's another one to put your money where your mouth is.
Whoa. There it is. Prejudice rearing its ugly head.
Fundamentalists always reveal what they're really thinking. Always. The dark heart of fundamentalism exposed. Human beings don't matter if they're lesbians. Human beings don't matter if they're gay. The nerve of those lesbians to be offended. It's their fault.
The spite and bigotry of fundamentalism always rises to the surface.
The employer doesn't have the right to discriminate and that's what I see is going on. Others have pointed out that it is no different than if a coworker pressured a Christian worker to go out and have a beer with the guys. I've had that happen before and it made me uncomfortable. Did I try to get the person fired? No. I would probably be laughed at for complaining.
Please answer me one simple question without going off the rails on a baseless rant.
Did the fired Christian tell his employer he would not obey the company orders to stop proselytizing coworkers at work , or not?
All I ask is that you give a direct answer to a simple question.
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