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I'd say the overall weirdness to be honest with you. Some of it has to do with the violence.. some of it has to do with the law..
stoning.. women marrying their husbands brother when the husband dies.. etc etc.
Also.. the creation bit... the floods.. Basically.. a non-biased person would probably read the OT and say.. "That is one spiteful God.."
To put it in simpler terms..
Ever had an elder in your family who said things that made you cringe in today's society.. My grandmother was like that. My grandmother wasn't a racist but she sometimes said things that just made me cringe and I hoped she didn't say those things in public with me around. I still loved her.. but thought she was misguided at times..
For myself, Alpha, since I do mostly follow christianity and the teachings of Christ, and have a strong faith in Father, Son and Spirit, and that I am at peace with that...I would say that yes for myself..if I were to reject what I feel is truth then I doubt an eternal life in heaven for myself..I am not an Islam scholar, but I know there are many crazy cults within it same as christianity..and most other religions..Sometimes I do go after cults, who claim christianity, for their brainwashing of the people, but only because I am familiar with them from personal experience..
I'd say the overall weirdness to be honest with you. Some of it has to do with the violence.. some of it has to do with the law..
stoning.. women marrying their husbands brother when the husband dies.. etc etc.
Also.. the creation bit... the floods.. Basically.. a non-biased person would probably read the OT and say.. "That is one spiteful God.."
To put it in simpler terms..
Ever had an elder in your family who said things that made you cringe in today's society.. My grandmother was like that. My grandmother wasn't a racist but she sometimes said things that just made me cringe and I hoped she didn't say those things in public with me around. I still loved her.. but thought she was misguided at times..
Like I told your wife in that thread she had a few weeks back, I used to really struggle with the OT too.
Maybe in the next few days I'll have a chance to start a thread on the OT.
It helped me to really just view the OT in light of Christ and how thankful I am for salvation. Without Him, we would be bearing God's wrath for our sin like many did in the Old Testament.
Some of it is a bit hard to deal with but I feel like approaching it with humbleness and honesty and asking God to show me how to handle it has really helped me. Basically, the entire Bible is pointing at Christ. Salvation. The Messiah.
Thank God all we have to get is Him. If you don't 'get' the OT, it's not a salvation issue. Having said that, I also wouldn't recommend a Christian trying to discredit or bash the OT, I think that does much more harm than good. But that's just me.
Going with what Alpha said about the OT, I believe it gives us an insight of how God feels about and or treats Sin. Thank goodness for the Mercy and Grace that the Lord gave us through Jesus.
Like I told your wife in that thread she had a few weeks back, I used to really struggle with the OT too.
Maybe in the next few days I'll have a chance to start a thread on the OT.
It helped me to really just view the OT in light of Christ and how thankful I am for salvation. Without Him, we would be bearing God's wrath for our sin like many did in the Old Testament.
Some of it is a bit hard to deal with but I feel like approaching it with humbleness and honesty and asking God to show me how to handle it has really helped me. Basically, the entire Bible is pointing at Christ. Salvation. The Messiah.
Thank God all we have to get is Him. If you don't 'get' the OT, it's not a salvation issue. Having said that, I also wouldn't recommend a Christian trying to discredit or bash the OT, I think that does much more harm than good. But that's just me.
I don't discredit as much as I don't fully understand it and hence don't take it literally. I think many out there think that in order for their faith to be strong they have to accept that everything that happened in the bible happened literally word for word (thus the whole evolution vs creation stuff that is inevitably tied to whether or not creation should be taught in schools).
I just think the OT and the literal translation thereof leads people to a place of exclusion. They get bound by the scripture to a perch overlooking the other "less good" people all the while congratulating themselves on a job well done. I prefer not to be exclusive and I'm happy with that decision.
Bigthirsty, i use to agree with that point of view. I say I use to because, a certain part of scripture and close friend of mine brought it to my attention.
Jesus says that he is the word, and word is Him. to doubt some parts of scripture, would in some essence doubt God, wouldnt it?
I dont believe you should take it literally but you should take it as the truth, for instance, when God created the world in seven days, doesnt necessarliy mean that those seven days were in weekly time format. If that makes since, i dont know really how to explain it while typing. Guess im trying to say that the next day didnt necessarily mean it happen 24 hours after the first day and so forth.
I agree with what Alpha said about the ot not being an issue about salvation..Not to make an issue of it, (in this thread) but I just do not believe that the old testament stories actually happened..I think they are stories told by righteous people in story form and relating to what the ancients believed about multi Gods and their legends regarding the creation, beginning of good and evil, etc..IMO the tellers of the ot stories were showing and teaching the listeners of our creator as he revealed himself to them..The four Gospels tell me about salvation..
Before I believed anything, I had a laundry list of questions I would ask everytime I was confronted with the name Jesus or anything to do with the Bible. I would ask anything from: Why arent the dinosours in the bible? to How can a good God, send people to Hell?...
Even though we can only answer so many questions before the individual has to take it upon themselves to build a relationship with the Lord. I feel that it would be good idea to start a thread that will try to answer some of those questions.
This thread is For those who are seeking the truth or that just would like to know what Christians have to say about this or that...
The best way to get answers are to ask questions...
the arrogance. simple. you have found yourtruth and insist that it is the only way. why is this so difficult for you to understand? do you understand what arrogance is? a wolf in sheeps clothing is still a wolf.
one more time:
The ultimate truth is so simple. It is nothing more than being in the pristine state. This is all that need be said.
All religions have come into existence because people want something elaborate and attractive and puzzling. Each religion is complex, and each sect in each religion has its own adherents and antagonists. For example, an ordinary Christian will not be satisfied unless he is told that God is somewhere in the far-off heavens, not to be reached by us unaided. "Christ alone knew Him and Christ alone can guide us." "Worship Christ and be saved." If he is told the simple truth, that "the kingdom of heaven is within you," he is not satisfied and will read complex and far-fetched meanings into such statements.
Only mature minds can grasp the simple truth in all its nakedness.
-RAMANA MAHARSHI-
1. What RoaminRed said. The whole "We're right and if you don't agree, you're a Satanist" type stuff. It doesn't annoy me (it always makes me laugh), but it's a problem I see with Christianity. The intolerance is unbelievable.
2. Denying things that have tons of evidence to prove them (evolution, dinosaurs, 4.5 billion year old earth) yet, Christians call us the ones to "deny things we don't understand". Seeing as most Christians don't have the same understanding of science that many atheists have, that statement applies to them.
3. Insisting that atheists can't be moral people because they think belief in a God is required for that. It is one of the most ridiculous assumptions in the history of drawing conclusions with no evidence.
4. Saying that your beliefs are based on logic. Most theists have not studied logical reasoning and probably don't have a clue how it works. If there is one thing in this world that is illogical, it is the belief in a God.
5. Saying you will "pray for us". You don't pray for somebody because they don't like the same football team as you. You don't pray for somebody because they don't like the same clothes as you. Prayers are usually said for people who are sick, mentally ill, or going through hard times. Atheists don't fit that criteria. You're insisting something is wrong with us when we're just normal people like (almost) everybody else. We are not sick, not mentally ill, not misguided, not stupid, and not all in hard times. Living in hard times happens to all kinds of people, regardless of faith/lack of faith. Also, saying that we are unhappy because we look at things the way they are. Many of us just don't feel the need to see things with a positive spin, so we tell it like it is. Theists say we are negative because of this, but we are just to the point. We also CAN be happy people without religion.
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