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Well, why don't you demonstrate what a fact is for us, Omega. For instance, you insist the apostles were real but they're only found in the Bible which is a book of fiction..
Th apostles are mentioned in the Bible by 9 different people. That is more evidence than you have that they did not exist. Where is your evidence that the Bible is a book of fiction? Another OPINION for which you have no support. Your lack of evidence us pathetic. Why should anyone believe anything you say?
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Harry Potter is found in 7 fictional books too so that must make him real too, right? If the apostles are real name some historical treatises they are mentioned in. Go on, show us what a fact is.
Amusing you classify something as fiction and think that makes him a real person.
The NT is a historical treatises.
If someone says something your can't prove false, it becomes a FACT. I have 9 men who considered bearing false witness a sin against God, who say there was apostles. All you have is your very biased opinion. You lose this one.
You are my senior by a couple of decades. I am generally respectful to my elders, always have been.
But obdurate ignorance is not worthy of respect.
And that is what you epitomize.
And you present an ignorant and bigoted view of Christians.
You thinking i am obdurate ignorant is just another ignorant remark made by a crude and rude person on the basis I disagree with you and you can't prove anything I say wrong.
You are also rude to all conservative Christisns no matter what their age.
I have read the early Christian fathers. You have not.
I have ran plagiarism tests on the gospels. You have not.
I read the NT in it's original Koine Greek. You can not.
You are so far behind because you are afraid to think for yourself.
DUUH. Reading does not necessarily translate into understanding. Serious study of the "Bible is also necessary to understand it. How much time have you spent in studying the Bible? Not enough is evident.
Also, one must be a Christian to understand much o the Bible. The natural man can't(
Your plagiarism test are not valid because you do not properly understand that subject either,
I read from translators, who know Koine Greek much better than you do.
To say I am afraid to think for myself is a stupid, self-serving remark for which you have no evidence. IMO, you are more afraid to think for yourself than i am. Both of us can't be right and I back up what I say from the Bible, all you do is spout your very biased OPINIONS.
You also have the obligation to provide evidence for extraordinary claims, or we can simply disregard your claims. Nobody has an obligation to explain or prove you to be incorrect, although somebody may take on the challenge from time to time.
Most spiritual truths can't be proved or disproved. I accept by faith alone they are true, you accept by faith alone they are not.
I haven't seen anything yet but Eusebius' favourite old ploy "If you don't get me to admit that I'm wrong, then I'm right'.
This is of course the basic wrongheadedness of ALL theist apologetics - that their claims are true until proven false. And no proof is accepted no matter how good, because they work on Faith, not evidence. This is why reversal of burden of proof is the real battle that has been going on from the beginning.
I have always considered that the burden of proof IS on Bible skeptics, because i believe that it's true that a book that purports to relate facts and events stands as evidence of the apologetics claim 'If you dismiss that, you must dismiss every other book' has some merit. We can't cherry -pick which books we consider and which we ignore.
That's why I reckon Bible - specifically gospel - analysis is the only thing that really matters in the debate. First cause is actually irrelevant. 'We need religion, true or not' for the good it does' is irrelevant. Appeal to numbers, authority, the supposed evils of atheist dictators are all irrelevant. The only thing that matter is whether we can believe the claim that Jesus rose from the dead. If it is demonstrably a claim without credibility, the validity of Christianity collapses, even if Christianity itself doesn't
We have. Obviously your old age and reading comprehension don't go together.
No you haven't., and you can' t give even one example where you have. Your problem, at least one of them is that you think if you believe something it i true. You seem to think biased opinions are evidence. Think again.
How do you know Jesus was never called Immanuel. Everything the people did concerning Jesus is not recorded, and today many Christians refer to Jesus as Immanuel. The prophecy did not set a time limit on when it would happen.
The Bible states that Jesus was called Jesus. He is never given any other name. doesn't it occur to you that, if he had ever been called 'Immanuel' somebody would have mentioned it? And of course in the absence of any evidence that the name was ever applied, we are logically obliged to give your suggestion no credit. What more do you have?
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Originally Posted by omega2xx
Most spiritual truths can't be proved or disproved. I accept by faith alone they are true, you accept by faith alone they are not.
We are both in the same boat with no oars.
No. You are arguing from the irrational position that unprovables either way are equally valid. Logically your claim has no weight until you validate it. Those who don't believe it have no requirement to disprove it, only to assess whatever evidence you put forward. Untill you understand this, you will never (like all those who argue from Faith) will never be able to construct a logically valid argument.
I started, but I got lost. I'll have to start again.
I am obliged to concede the Harry did not ask any specific questions. He challenged your understanding of Greek.
So it's down to the rest of us.
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If the apostles are real name some historical treatises they are mentioned in. Go on, show us what a fact is.
I'll have to start again.
