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I am so happy that I found this site. I first saw it yesterday with the posting from Craven Clan and responded that I was in her same boat. We are wanting to move to the west to be closer to my husband's family and my step daughters (his from his 1st marriage) who live in Denver (another option for us). I am hoping the reponses from this post can help me and others who may be in the "same boat" Bare with me- this is long, but I know this will help with the responses being geard towards info I am seeking. Here is my deal:
** I was born and raised in Ft. Lauderdale, Fl (live there now, but have lived all over in big and little cities ie: Birmingham, Al. Detroit, MI (Grand Blanc), Tampa, Fl, Pittsburgh, Pa etc. ). My family is Irish Catholic, but don't have a huge religoius backing. My dad owned very famous Irish Pubs here in Florida. Growing up in that business has allowed me to be able to be extremly outgoing and be able to fit in with all types of crowds. I love socializing and being involved. As my husbands says, I can entertain anyone- even a leaf. HaHa
** My husband's family is Mormon. His grandparents live in SLC, but his parents (divorced) live in Hurricane and Green River. Its his grandparents that are very dedicated to the church. I haven't fully grasped the Mormon ways, but I am open minded. Though- no offense- have no desire in converting. My husband is no longer practicing- since he got divorced. So between the 2 of us- we have had no religious upbringing for our 2 kids who are 4 and 1 years old. Though I am very curious b/c- no matter where we moved to - the LDS finds us and knocks on our door. How do they know?? However, everyone has been nothing but kind and gracious to us and just act as if they were our next door neighbors.
** We are wanting to relocate to the west and the St. George area is a huge possibility for us. We like this area b/c we are that much closer to his family. Being on the east coast has caused us to not be able to spend much time with them.
** Even though this area is a lot smaller than Ft. Lauderdale, I love the beauty of it and the family oriented area that it can provide for us. I don't need or won't miss the hussle and bussle of South Florida.
Here is what I'd like to get feedback on:
** We currently rent a 2/2 condo/1100 sq feet directly looking at the Atlantic Ocean for the ridiculous price of $1600.00/month. Its called Location Location Location. Cost of living is astronomical down in South Florida. I saw that we could rent a very nice home w/ a lot more room in the St. George area for that or less(we'd want to rent first). However, in order for us to afford that in Florida- my hubby and I make a combined $120,000.00/year. Now my husband does work for a Big Box retailer as a Store Director who just so happens has a store in St. George. He is trying to find out what his salary would be there. Hopefully it will be close. I am a Property Manager for a luxury hi rise condo here on the beach. And my career background also includes luxury resorts such as the Ritz Carlton and Walt Disney World Resorts. I was quite surprised that St. George has possible opportunites for me such as the new Sand Hollow Resort. Though not sure of salary comparisons. I am currently contacting them. Please provide other known possibilities. I am also very interested in working with Home Devlopers. Know any good ones that I can also contact?
**Next would be school factors. Who can comment on young family oriented communities with great Elementary schools and pre schools. I have no idea of the difference b/w Santa Clara to Ivens to other close by areas etc. The more detailed the better. Since reading these posts- I see the whole debate of the non LDS vs. non LDS. This has no concern to me- I feel it is all what you make of it and how you stay involved. No offense-
** If we can get the jobs and the school and right communities nailed down we would be thrilled. Everything else will fall into place.
Thanks so much for all your time and feedback. and like I said- hopefully this will help others who are thinking about relocating.
Location: Small town Texas, from Southern California
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We are in the same boat, i am just a little closer to where we are going to relocate than you guys!! W elooked in St. George because it is still close to California, all our family is here. We also go to the river A LOT, and we did not want to give that up, from St. George we would only be about 3 hours from Laughlin, we are 4-5 now. My husband was in Florida not htat long ago, he did not care for the humidity!! You won't get that in St. George, it is desert, it will get hot though....
Schools, go to great schools.net, i have looked there a lot, in the past, not lately. Not til we go there more, and i know what schools are for the areas we are looking to live. We may rent first too, ONLY if i can find something close or in the neighborhoods we have looked before. We actually found one around Christmas, it was 3300 sq. ft, for $2500, sounds a little high, but was in River Hollow. It would be awesome if it was available when we are ready.
Good that you are checking into employment....sounds like that might work for you.
What i don't understand is, if Utah does not pay much, how do the people afford to live there, and go out to eat and stuff?? DOes anyone know what the minimum wage is and how it corolates with the high cost of housing??
Maybe we can keep in touch, there are a lot of good threads, about everything under the sun on here...when we make our trips, i will update you!!!
Minimum is $5.15 and a lot of jobs pay exactly minimum. If you are lucky you may fall into the 7 to 8 range. High wages are $10 with the really profesional types getting mabye that rare $15 an hour. those jobs are scarce and getting scarcer witht he down turn in the housing market. All the communities are within 4 or 5 miles of each other. They sort of sprawl together. Since my kids are older I can't talk about the schools other than colleges. Everything is just minutes from everything else. People here can't afford the cost of housing for the normal run of the mill person/family. Either they bought before the jump in prices, or they are hurting with the adjustable rate mortgages. Those that did left to go to where it was cheaper to live and there were higher paying jobs. Hurricane has lower utlities since they have a independent city run power plant. Green Valley spa/resort is also in St. George. the Exec. chef lives on the left side of me. I could find out if there are any good jobs avialable, but knowing what everyone here gets paid, I doubt they are going to pay much more than that. Most families have both spouses working at least one if not two jobs each. You either come with a big monitary cushion to rely on, or bring your own work with you. The jobs are rare that pay much over minimum.
Location: Small town Texas, from Southern California
445 posts, read 1,811,095 times
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Hey Blondie, this is off topic, but is that exec chef, the one that won on Hell's Kitchen?? i watch that show off and on, and i think that is the resoert that won last year.
Where do you live? Just curious....
You would also know about the liquor laws, i heard they are strict, we are not big drinkers, i was just curious.
Minimum is $5.15 and a lot of jobs pay exactly minimum. If you are lucky you may fall into the 7 to 8 range. High wages are $10 with the really profesional types getting mabye that rare $15 an hour.
I agree that wages are low in Utah, but it is my opinion that you are overstating how bad it is. I did some wage surveys for a bank earlier this spring. Entry-level bank tellers in St. George were getting $9-10 per hour. Fast Food workers were getting about $8. A state legislator presented some findings that in the entire state of Utah, less than 15,000 workers (out of over a million) actually make minimum wage. I think the problem is there is little upside – people max out at $45,000 or $50,000 in a lot of cases.
No not over stating it at all. If there are bank tellers naking that much it is rare. Come on down and you will see. $8 an hour for fast food is unheard of. Washington Utah right by Best Buy at that intersection on the northeast corner you will see the crossed palm trees of the failed attempt of In-N-Out Burger to move in. common Knowledge that they failed on the attempt because they wanted to pay $10 an hour. In the records of the city council meeting where it was rejected, (You can look this up) you will see it was stated that paying above the average of $6 an hour was outlandish for fast food workers, and thus would pose a serious threat to the local economy. what it actually was the old boy system of those who own the current fast food places didn't want to lose their good workers to a place that would pay substantially higher. A good friend of mine in Cedar City is a bank teller working for Wells Fargo. She makes a whopping $7 an hour and has been there for 3 years. No raises. She is full time as well. None of the other tellers make more than she does. She stays in Cedar because the other banks in the system don't pay any better. My Son works for a company that pays decent wages. Surprise it is a state run company. he makes $10 an hour and the competition for those jobs is keen. There are people that commute down to Washington for work at the local WalMart since they pay their check out people $8.50 an hour. Yet they have a Wal Mart in Cedar too. the local distribution center for Wal Mart pays differently for the shift you have. Normal shifts get $10 an hour. Swing shift gets $11 an hour. Night shift or graveyard gets almost $13 an hour. that is one of the highest paying employers in this end of the state. That is printed on their brochure when you apply for work. Again easily checked. My neighbor to the left of me moved before the chef moved in. He was an electrician that came from the Los Angeles area. He was making nearly $30 an hour in LA. He moved here and was cut down to spotty jobs making $13 an hour. He tried to sell his home for what he paid, which was over inflated. He couldn't get a nibble. So the chef rents it for $1100 a month. It is a 1100 square foot crappily made house. A professor at Dixie State College with tenure left the multi media department and took a job at boulevard furniture doing their layouts and such for ads. He did this because making $10.50 an hour paid more than what he made as a college professor. Another friend is in the hemotology department at the hospital in St. George. She makes $9 an hour. Another friend works at a Physical Therapist at the same hospital. He makes 38K a year and is consider on the top of the wage scale for non doctor related work at the hospital. Walmart, The hospital, government jobs, and Dixie State College are the top employers in the area. The wages suck to put it in a nice term. All of us who live down here know this. These figures are verifiable. I tend to trust the actual people making the wages rather than some study. One of my college classes was about statistics. We were required to read a book titled "How to lie with statistics" The Employment security office in St. George, you can ask Mr. Lawton what the wages are for the various jobs, and find out what the real levels are. I give you his name since he is a good resource for anyone really wanting to know the facts. He is the father of another neighbor of mine.
I often say I live between heaven and hell. To the west of me is Purgatory flats where the local jail is located, and to the east is Zion National Park. I'm in Washington County. I moved back 2 years ago after having lived all over the country. I use to live in Cedar City 27 years ago. I remember the area when Cedar was larger than St. George, and people down here went to Cedar to do their big shopping. St. George boomed on the real estate, construction wave. Most not all businesses are based around real estate/construction oriented types of businesses. They are mostly hurting with the down turn in the market. In a couple of years there will be some good bargins again. Just make sure you have the house well inspected by someone outside of the normal inspectors in the area. Too many houses where shoddily built in a hurry. Wiring is substandard, and insulation not fully placed. Not all the houses are like that, but there are some. I say that to make sure that while doing the research you are informed.
I love this area. I love the people. I like all people until they give me a reason not to like them. I could care less what religion/skin color/beliefs. I like that the area has become more diverse. I wish it would be even more so. another wish I have is that there would be a good book store come to town like Barnes and Noble, or Borders. I also wish that there was a theater complex that played more than the top big studio movies. unless an independent movie is up for an award it will not make it to this market.
We have every franchise food establishment known. there is a lack of really good resturants. Most are adequate, but not the really good kind. Leeds area has the Cosmoploitan up next to the old Wels Fargo museum building. Flannigans motel in Springdale is another one that has a really good resturant. I got spoiled living in many different places when it came to good resturants. I also miss farmers markets. The produce that comes here is pitiful. It use to be better than it is now. Back when Cedar was a mere 5000 people, you had much better produce than you have today. I'm not talking variety, I'm talking freshness and quality.
For colthes shoppihng, Dillards is the high end in this end of the state. The rest are like Kohls, penny's and sears. You have a few one off small shops like Bella Donna which charge higher prices than if you lived in San Francisco, for the exact same brand. You want bargin basement colthing, you can find it in St. George. You want a higher end and more stylish, go to Vegas or SLC. these are the realities of the area. I live with it becasue I love the area and the people. I chose to make the decision to move back here. I know the trade offs. I live with them. To me it is still better than the crap I put up with living in the east bay near San Francisco.
No this is not California. It's Utah. Californians that move here and expect it to be exactly the same laws, state give me's, and conviences will not find it. It is a different culture, that until recently had no real diversity. the culture will not change to fit the move in's that takes a long time in the relhm of generations. The influx has slowed due to the down turn. Prices are still high here, and there are no real bargins to be found. Just hve your eyes wide open to the reality not some published statistic of what it is like. You still have real estate agents touting this is the #1 place to move to, when the latest issue of money magazine that started it all doesn';t even have it liste din the top 100 or for that matter when you do a little searching on their site, the top 500. The fall from the #1 spot happend in the space of 2 years. Reason, high prices, no good paying jobs, and the market down turn so that people don't have the disposable income to afford the inflated prices.
Ok off my soap box. It is still to me the best place to live. It just depends on your circumstances. Can you afford the area? do you come in with preconceived feelings about Mormons? These are questions that everyone should ask no matter what area you move too. Research out the place. Visit it and know if you like it. Talk to people when you visit.
Oh and lastly I wish there was a good computer store other than Best Buy in town. Being married to an IBM VP and a having a son who is a geek with a multi media degree, I hear constantly how bad the computer stores or availability of good components is here. Vegas is our nearest source.
These figures are verifiable. I tend to trust the actual people making the wages rather than some study. One of my college classes was about statistics. We were required to read a book titled "How to lie with statistics"
Well, shoot, you caught me lying with statistics, since I actually conducted the survey, didn’t just read someone else’s. Actually, it doesn’t matter that much. I think we are in 90% agreement that wages aren’t good.
Thought I offer some stats I just got from the census site. The population of the country is almost 300 million. The population of Utah is aprox. 2.5 million. Of which 71%, or 1.8 million claim to be LDS. Of those who stated there are a total 2,561,000 Mormons nationwide. The per capita income in Utah is $28,168, six from the bottom.
I write this only to raise some questions. If you wanted to run for any municipal, county or state office office in Utah would you think you should either be LDS, agree with the LDS or at least be against everything the LDS church is against? Do the teachings and doctrines of the church, however they're interpreted, find their way into the fabric of the laws of Utah and how their enforced even at the lowest level? Do the LDS Church's views on science, history and other religions find their way into public schools? Is there full adherance in Utah to the First Amendment Rights of free speech and the forbidding of the government to endorse any religion? Could there be animosity and distrust of people who move to Utah who are not LDS?Obviously there is a wide variety of answers depending on who you are.
Boy, look and see around you. There are no female judges, no female attorneys, no female surgeons, no female bishops, no female principals in schools, the school board are all men. The family attorneys are all men. There are cases known that the LDS male attorneys have taken child custody away from the mothers. There is so much hipocrisy in this city that it is a joke! There are hardly female police officers available for domestic cases. Utah makes it very difficult to have women or minority voices to have rights, especially if your non-mormon. Although, that's about to change very soon, cuz there are too many new comers, new ideas, young women with real education needed to be given an chance to work and have a career in utah, otherwise, these important people in our lives will find somewhere else where they will be accepted and receive a high paying salary as oppose staying here in Utah and waiting around. Most of the the LDS young women get married at age 19 and began having children right away. No need for an education, just have lots of babies so that the mormon religion can grow and grow. I have encountered young women just graduated highschool and left to another state so they will not be forced to get married. They want an education and become a lawyer, dentist, nurse a doctor, social worker or run for a position in the govenment but it's very difficult for them and they leave Utah to find their dream come true. Cheers to them!
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Actually, it doesn’t matter that much. I think we are in 90% agreement that wages aren’t good.
