U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Urban Planning
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-11-2013, 05:50 PM
 
Location: roaming gnome
12,391 posts, read 24,619,923 times
Reputation: 5672

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Holy Cats!

What's wrong with "block after block of single family homes"? Some of those bungalows in Chicago are on 25 foot wide lots. That's hardly "suburban" in character, by most anyone's definition.

I'm not arguing any of the above; my main argument is if it's in the city limits, it's the city. Period. That definition has its limitations, but it's simple and easy to implement. You're entitiled to your opinion, but you are not required to post on here.
No worries, yes this is suburban to me. I don't care if it is in Chicago city limits. Most anyone I don't care about, but most people from major older cities would call it suburban. Suburban doesn't mean it is a "subdivision." And many of these areas *were* suburbs, until annexed by the city. Later developments around the country especially the sunbelt was modeled after this "Suburban" style. I am totally fine calling it something else, I care less about the names, but to say there isn't a different in the first pic in the second..well, not sure what to say to that.

http://goo.gl/maps/gKWTx

http://goo.gl/maps/LL9LB
What much of Chicago by the lake and red line looks like.

Most people talk about there being two different Chicagos... the Northside, and the Southside... to me, the two different Chicago's are the Chicago within a few miles of of the lake running north and south, and then much of the rest of the city. I'd rather be in Evanston (an actual suburb) than areas like the first picture.
Evanston...
http://goo.gl/maps/wXq7D

Last edited by grapico; 08-11-2013 at 06:06 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-11-2013, 06:17 PM
 
Location: Youngstown, Oh.
4,900 posts, read 7,676,794 times
Reputation: 4518
Quote:
Originally Posted by grapico View Post
No worries, yes this is suburban to me. I don't care if it is in Chicago city limits. Most anyone I don't care about, but most people from major older cities would call it suburban. Suburban doesn't mean it is a "subdivision." And many of these areas *were* suburbs, until annexed by the city. Later developments around the country especially the sunbelt was modeled after this "Suburban" style. I am totally fine calling it something else, I care less about the names, but to say there isn't a different in the first pic in the second..well, not sure what to say to that.

http://goo.gl/maps/gKWTx

http://goo.gl/maps/LL9LB
What much of Chicago by the lake and red line looks like.

Most people talk about there being two different Chicagos... the Northside, and the Southside... to me, the two different Chicago's are the Chicago within a few miles of of the lake running north and south, and then much of the rest of the city. I'd rather be in Evanston (an actual suburb) than areas like the first picture.
Evanston...
http://goo.gl/maps/wXq7D
Just a few blocks away from your example from Evanston, there is this: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=evans...,,0,17.35&z=15
which is a lot more "suburban" than any of the examples you posted from within the city of Chicago.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-12-2013, 12:14 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
45,992 posts, read 42,130,556 times
Reputation: 14811
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I'm not arguing any of the above; my main argument is if it's in the city limits, it's the city. Period. That definition has its limitations, but it's simple and easy to implement. You're entitiled to your opinion, but you are not required to post on here.
You're switching words. Obviously a place in a city limits it's in the city, the question is whether a place is urban.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-12-2013, 09:29 AM
 
Location: roaming gnome
12,391 posts, read 24,619,923 times
Reputation: 5672
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR_C View Post
Just a few blocks away from your example from Evanston, there is this: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=evans...,,0,17.35&z=15
which is a lot more "suburban" than any of the examples you posted from within the city of Chicago.
While this is true, have you explored Evanston much? They have a pretty good downtown core that is cohesive, has multiple El and Metra stops and not setup like a 4 res block 1 boulevard "commercial" street usually filled with auto shops type setup. There is a pretty good size walkable core with lots of pedestrian activity and good amenities.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-13-2013, 07:34 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,085 posts, read 102,830,251 times
Reputation: 33152
Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
You're switching words. Obviously a place in a city limits it's in the city, the question is whether a place is urban.
I should have said it differently. Outside the city limits is "suburban". Inside city limits is "urban".

This constant wordsmithing about what is "urban" is kind of silly.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-13-2013, 08:16 AM
 
Location: "Daytonnati"
4,245 posts, read 6,000,788 times
Reputation: 2967
Urban is sort of euphimism for "minority", which usually means black (pc term: african american) &/or latino, but more black, I think. As in "urban radio", 'Urban League", etc.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-13-2013, 09:06 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
45,992 posts, read 42,130,556 times
Reputation: 14811
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I should have said it differently. Outside the city limits is "suburban". Inside city limits is "urban".
Ok, though if that's what you're going to use it would be clearer just to say "in city" or "out of city limits". The census, btw, as I posted earlier does not used that definition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Note I asked if it were urban not "in the city" (I mentioned later that that particular home was within city limit). I didn't use them to mean the same thing. And they're not according to the census. The census definition of urban ignores political boundaries.

Urban vs. rural is assigned at the Census Block level. Census blocks are the smallest geographic units that the Census Bureau recognizes in its geographic scheme. All other geographic areas used in census products can be defined as a collection of (usually, but not always, contiguous) census blocks. Any other kind of geographic area -- a city, county, school district, ZIP code, etc. -- will not necessarily be classified as completely urban or rural. For example, Jackson county, Mo is the core county of the Kansas City metropolitan area and would seem to be obviously an "urban county". But according to the 2000 census there were over 26,000 persons (4%) in Jackson county who were living in census blocks classified as rural. Even within the city limits of Kansas City, Mo 1.3% of the population was classified as living in a rural setting. If you look at the breakout based on land area instead of population you find that 43.3% of the land area of the city of Kansas City is classified as rural!


from

Ten Things to Know about Urban vs Rural

Suburban is not defined by the US census, but logically following the above definition sub-urban sounds like an in between. Perhaps signifies the part the urban defined by the US census more similar (lower) density to rural or just on the outer edge, in a relative sense. Yes, that's arguable, but urban clearly does not connect with city limits.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-13-2013, 10:31 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,085 posts, read 102,830,251 times
Reputation: 33152
Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Ok, though if that's what you're going to use it would be clearer just to say "in city" or "out of city limits". The census, btw, as I posted earlier does not used that definition.
Yeah, I don't quite get that about the CB. I've known of a people to farm inside the city limits of small cities, but I don't think that's happening in KC.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-13-2013, 10:34 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
45,992 posts, read 42,130,556 times
Reputation: 14811
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Yeah, I don't quite get that about the CB. I've known of a people to farm inside the city limits of small cities, but I don't think that's happening in KC.
Rural doesn't necessarily mean farm, just low enough density, which is why part of Kansas City counted as rural.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-13-2013, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Youngstown, Oh.
4,900 posts, read 7,676,794 times
Reputation: 4518
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I should have said it differently. Outside the city limits is "suburban". Inside city limits is "urban".

This constant wordsmithing about what is "urban" is kind of silly.
Despite being within city limits, this is not urban:
https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&l...2,94.21,,0,2.2

(Because Google finally expanded their coverage of some Ohio cities, I'll probably post a lot of these, in the future. )

For anyone interested, this is a section of Youngstown that was never developed, although infrastructure was laid out during the 50s, in anticipation of further development.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Urban Planning
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top