Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Transit oriented development is generally what you will see in older American Cities like NYC, Boston, Philadelphia, Chicago, San Francisco, and also in urban areas in basically every other country in the world except for America.
New urbanism's focus is more upon creating traditionally built suburban towns. However there are some new urbanist designs which resemble the higher density atmosphere of a city.
Here is a Photo tour of Kentlands, Maryland. This is one of the oldest and most famous New Urbanist developments built over the past two decades: Kentlands Photo Tour Montgomery County Maryland (broken link)
I laughed at the Marin County thing. Marin County is a cocoon, Orange County is a cocoon. They're different, but only in ways that matter to endless NorCal-SoCal rivalries. If I wanted to ignore reality, I'd consider both. (Or just one, because as we 'all know,' they are 'so different').
New Urbanism is the faux main street look. The 'easiest' way of placating New Urbanists in 1970s/1980s suburbs is to tear down the enclosed shopping malls and build open-air 'shopping streets.' Some of these are better done than others, but the private rent-a-cops are all the same.
I laughed at the Marin County thing. Marin County is a cocoon, Orange County is a cocoon. They're different, but only in ways that matter to endless NorCal-SoCal rivalries. If I wanted to ignore reality, I'd consider both. (Or just one, because as we 'all know,' they are 'so different').
New Urbanism is the faux main street look. The 'easiest' way of placating New Urbanists in 1970s/1980s suburbs is to tear down the enclosed shopping malls and build open-air 'shopping streets.' Some of these are better done than others, but the private rent-a-cops are all the same.
This is spoken from a true midwest tourist. Anyone who knows anything about orange county knows its NOT a 'cocoon'. I suggest you visiting santa ana, anahiem, ie north orange county before you state anything more misinformed.
The Wikipedia article on New Urbanism was interesting and offered a variety of opinions on the topic. However, in practice, there seems to be no standard definition. New Urbanism seems to be whatever the developer wants it to be.
I have long said I thought New Urbanism was trying to evoke the image of a New England or Midwestern farm town, and that is certainly borne out in this statement from Wikepedia:
Quote:
Most of the dwellings are within a five-minute walk of the center, an average of roughly 1/4 mile or 1,320 feet.
Obviously, this cannot be a very large development if all the dwellings have to be this close to the center of town. Yet, the development is supposed to contain everything one needs to live life: house, shopping, work, church, medical/dental services, etc. What if you can't find a job in the development? What if you don't like the dr, dentist, whatever? What if the church is not of your religion?
This is spoken from a true midwest tourist. Anyone who knows anything about orange county knows its NOT a 'cocoon'. I suggest you visiting santa ana, anahiem, ie north orange county before you state anything more misinformed.
The O.C. likes to separate itself from L.A. County, even though it's the next county and it is just the SE part of the L.A. Basin.
To answer your question, you simply hop in your car and drive somewhere else. Personally thats what I do where I live if I can't find something within walking distance. The whole idea isn't to completley eliminate car use, but just to reduce it to a large degree. This is done by building housing more densely, having mixed use buildings and limiting the ammount of parking avaiable (there are few to no parking lots for stores within 1-2 miles of where I live). As a result it simply makes more sense and saves time to walk to places instead of hopping in the car.
Think about it. Most of your trips during the day (besides to and from work) are to the grocery store, convenience store, to your kid's school, and other small trips like that. If you eliminate driving for small trips like that you're cutting out a huge chunk of the driving you're doing during your day.
Also with transit oriented development you basically have a traditionally developed town or city with public transit access near the center. So with that type of development you would simply be able to hop on the train/light rail and go to work.
Oh and I think New Urbanism does reflect the old fashioned way of building up a town. It is simply that towns built way back when were built to human scale, so they were inherently walkable. With the advent of the car developers began to spread everything out, and as a result nothing is walkable in most suburbs today.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pittnurse70
The Wikipedia article on New Urbanism was interesting and offered a variety of opinions on the topic. However, in practice, there seems to be no standard definition. New Urbanism seems to be whatever the developer wants it to be.
I have long said I thought New Urbanism was trying to evoke the image of a New England or Midwestern farm town, and that is certainly borne out in this statement from Wikepedia: Obviously, this cannot be a very large development if all the dwellings have to be this close to the center of town. Yet, the development is supposed to contain everything one needs to live life: house, shopping, work, church, medical/dental services, etc. What if you can't find a job in the development? What if you don't like the dr, dentist, whatever? What if the church is not of your religion?
To answer your question, you simply hop in your car and drive somewhere else.
Well, that's what I thought, but it's sort of defeating the purpose of "New Urbanism" if people are going to continue to drive most everywhere.
Quote:
nothing is walkable in most suburbs today
.
This is simply not true. That is the premise of the "bad suburb" attitude to begin with. Most burbs that I am familiar with have lots of walkable places.
No it doesn't defeat the purpose because walking becomes easier and more practical than driving in New Urbanist areas. So, personally, for 80% of the stuff I need in my daily routine I can just walk there and I ACTUALLY DO WALK THERE, which I think is different from your example of the suburbs.
Even with a suburb where there might be something within walking distance nobody actually does walk to stores to do anything (mind you, a walk from one end of the parking lot to the store does not count as walking in my book). Walking in the suburbs is a form of exercise or recreation and is not a means to accomplish anything practical (getting groceries, going to church, visiting friends, getting your kids from school). In fact in most suburbs I think people would stare at your strangely if you were to haul a couple of bags of groceries down the street in your arms, instead of using your car.
I honestly don't understand where you're coming from. I have lots of relatives out in the burbs and they don't walk anywhere.
Need to pick up a gallon of milk? Hop in the car and drive to the 7-11. Want take-out food? Hop in the car and drive to the pizza/chinese place. Need some groceries? Hop in your car and drive to the Stop&Shop. Want to go to the bar for some drinks? Hop in your car and drive there.
If you live in a new urbanist or a more urban area people simply walk to do these activities. The car doesn't factor in unless you need to make some big purchase or want to go to some Big Box (Target/Walmart/Home Depot) type store.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pittnurse70
Well, that's what I thought, but it's sort of defeating the purpose of "New Urbanism" if people are going to continue to drive most everywhere.
.
This is simply not true. That is the premise of the "bad suburb" attitude to begin with. Most burbs that I am familiar with have lots of walkable places.
Even with a suburb where there might be something within walking distance nobody actually does walk to stores to do anything (mind you, a walk from one end of the parking lot to the store does not count as walking in my book). Walking in the suburbs is a form of exercise or recreation and is not a means to accomplish anything practical (getting groceries, going to church, visiting friends, getting your kids from school). In fact in most suburbs I think people would stare at your strangely if you were to haul a couple of bags of groceries down the street in your arms, instead of using your car.
I honestly don't understand where you're coming from. I have lots of relatives out in the burbs and they don't walk anywhere.
Maybe we're not talking about the same thing, I dunno. I live in a suburb and see many people walking all the time. People walk to the grocery store frequently here. I don't usually, b/c I live at the top of a hill (maybe something else you don't deal with in the Bronx). The kids in this neighborhood do not get bussed, many walk or ride bikes to the elementary school. The older ones often take the public bus to the middle school (my own DD and her friend did that). My kids rode their bikes to the rec center, the library, etc in spite of the hill. (There is no way to get anywhere from our house w/o going down hill, which means uphill on the way home.) I live within walking distance of a church (Mormon), and many of its members walk. I am not a Mormon, I have to drive to mine.
In any event, I don't think morality enters into where one chooses to live.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
