[arctichomesteader]

Originally Posted by Anon_vt1

You can't "Jersey" Vermont because Vermont is not nearly close enough to New York City. You're pretty much describing my impressions of New York City, of which Northern New Jersey is simply an extension. Newark's dumpish tendencies are no worse or no better than Harlem's.

It took me years to figure out that those bumper stickers had nothing to do reality. People in the middle of Iowa don't fret about becoming another Chicago. Heck, most of Illinois doesn't worry about it. Why Vermont is worried about a massive population overspill from a local, large, and wildly successful city when there's clearly none to be had, I'll leave to someone smarter than me.

And as a side note, I would image the residents of Southern New Jersey might take offense to your descriptions of their state. It's pretty clear from even a casual interstate trip how unevenly the population is distributed. Southern New Jersey still has the whispers of "The Garden State".

Given the number of people from NY and NJ living here, or buying second homes, or vacationing...there's good reason behind those fears. It's happening as we speak.

Even the least crowded counties in NJ make Burlington look like Vermont.

[Anon_vt1]

Originally Posted by arctichomesteader

Given the number of people from NY and NJ living here, or buying second homes, or vacationing...there's good reason behind those fears. It's happening as we speak.

Even the least crowded counties in NJ make Burlington look like Vermont.

I'm still not convinced it's true, not by a long shot. VT has been a NY/NJ relocation destination since the sixties. Howard Dean, Bernie Sanders, and Ben and Jerry are all New Yorkers and it still somehow it still doesn't look like New Jersey. And my maps show that the most heavily urbanized areas in New Jersey are within a reasonable driving distance of NYC or Philly. There's whole parts of New Jersey without even serious Interstates.

But even allowing what you say is true, how would you propose we stop it? Where do we put all these "extra" people from NY and NJ? Should we put a fence around those two areas and tell everyone to stop having kids? Should all that population live in extremely dense housing so VT won't be New Jersey? (And shouldn't upstate NY or upstate NH or ME have the same fears?) And who gets to decide whose "privileged" enough to live in VT?

"Jersey" has been part of the rallying cry that has kept Act 250 in place all these years. But all Act 250 has done has made it so that only people from NY and NJ can afford fix up the aging housing stock. All I can say is that life is a odd. *shrug*

[arctichomesteader]

Originally Posted by Anon_vt1

I'm still not convinced it's true, not by a long shot. VT has been a NY/NJ relocation destination since the sixties. Howard Dean, Bernie Sanders, and Ben and Jerry are all New Yorkers and it still somehow it still doesn't look like New Jersey. And my maps show that the most heavily urbanized areas in New Jersey are within a reasonable driving distance of NYC or Philly. There's whole parts of New Jersey without even serious Interstates.

But even allowing what you say is true, how would you propose we stop it? Where do we put all these "extra" people from NY and NJ? Should we put a fence around those two areas and tell everyone to stop having kids? Should all that population live in extremely dense housing so VT won't be New Jersey? (And shouldn't upstate NY or upstate NH or ME have the same fears?) And who gets to decide whose "privileged" enough to live in VT?

"Jersey" has been part of the rallying cry that has kept Act 250 in place all these years. But all Act 250 has done has made it so that only people from NY and NJ can afford fix up the aging housing stock. All I can say is that life is a odd. *shrug*

Do as Vrest Orton suggested in the 20's...secede and build a fence. Throw the "progressive", nutty scum from those states out. Bring back one town one vote too, to render the fruit and nut cities powerless to achieve their dumbest ideas.

NH and ME have the same concerns...in ME it's called the "volvo line" dividing the real Maine North from the sprawl of MA, NY, NJ transplants South.

[68vette]

Originally Posted by arctichomesteader

Do as Vrest Orton suggested in the 20's...secede and build a fence. Throw the "progressive", nutty scum from those states out. Bring back one town one vote too, to render the fruit and nut cities powerless to achieve their dumbest ideas.

NH and ME have the same concerns...in ME it's called the "volvo line" dividing the real Maine North from the sprawl of MA, NY, NJ transplants South.

My take on it comes with some experience from living in the tri-state area (CT, NY and NJ). The people from these areas that move to VT, NH or ME have several reasons for doing so. One, they are getting tired of living in a congested area. Two, the area has most likely changed since they were younger and the change that has happened is not to their liking. Three, they have visited VT and fell in love with the dream of living in a New England village or as I call it "living in a Norman Rockwell painting". There are obviously other reasons why people move here, but these are usually the top reasons. With the above mentioned, it is easy to understand why many would be in support of act 250. It is odd living in Chittenden County and seeing what happens in towns like Williston. Most of the town is made up of transplants. There is one side that wants things to stay as they are (no or little development) and then another group that wants to change it so that it's a little like home used to be.

[quickdraw]

Originally Posted by arctichomesteader

Throw the "progressive", nutty scum from those states out.

As soon as you leave your house today, I'm coming over to cut your grass and tidy-up your yard.

[quickdraw]

Originally Posted by arctichomesteader

It's the most crowded, one of (the?) most polluted, is one of the least free states, has some of the highest taxes in the country, one of the most corrupt state governments, most of the people are downright nasty and miserable towards everyone else...NJ is, both literally and figuratively, a dump.

and NJ people can't write quality run-on sentences either

[Aurora369]

Originally Posted by arctichomesteader

It's the most crowded, one of (the?) most polluted, is one of the least free states, has some of the highest taxes in the country, one of the most corrupt state governments, most of the people are downright nasty and miserable towards everyone else...NJ is, both literally and figuratively, a dump. As the bumper stickers say...don't jersey Vermont...

I could not agree with you more. I live in New Jersey, the Jersey shore and my husband and I cannot wait to retire to move the heck out of here. My car insurance, taxes, you name it, everything is high here.

To add on: And, if by some chance we can move to Vermont some day, I hope we will not be greeted as nasty NJ people. I have no intention of coming in to change anything or do anything other than, relaxing and getting some peace and quiet. After working for over 34 years so far, the rat race here is starting to make both me and my husband sick and the commute to work of close to 2 to 2 1/2 hours on a bus is enough to drive anyone completely and utterly nuts.

[LisaMc46]

I was born in NJ and moved to VT 8 years ago when I was in my early 30s.

I would never move back. NEVER. Every time we go back to visit, I say to myself, "Thank God, I left N.J."

Within 10 minutes of driving down the Garden State Parkway I want to go home b/c I feel my whole attitude change as I have to deal with crazy, rude drivers and the never-ending toll plazas.

Other than my family and friends I would have no reason to visit the state. The sprawl is outrageously ugly, the people are rude, the keep-up-with-the-Jones mentality is never ending, and the prices of housing and car insurance alone are enough to prevent most people from ever getting ahead financially.

Sure Vermont has its warts (crazy, leftest politicians, total lack of ethnic diversity, low-paying jobs) but overall it's a wonderful place to live if you're not concerned with material things. My kids play outside all day, we cross-country ski and snowshoe along our road, I never lock my car door b/c car thefts are quite rare unlike NJ where I needed an alarm and a club device. No one cares what you wear or drive or how big your house is. I could go on and on.

I would just rent for at least a year so that you know you want to be here before investing in a home. And, I would definitely prepare to live frugally unless you come with a trust fund or Powerball winnings.

[arctichomesteader]

Originally Posted by quickdraw

and NJ people can't write quality run-on sentences either

Read some 18th and 19th century letters, books, etc., for some real run on sentences.

As soon as you leave your house today, I'm coming over to cut your grass and tidy-up your yard.

Can't. If the barbed wire, bear traps and rattlesnakes don't get any intruders, all the stuff is weighed down with old tractor tires to prevent theft, and I replaced the lawn with poison ivy and brambles.

[arctichomesteader]

Originally Posted by 68vette

My take on it comes with some experience from living in the tri-state area (CT, NY and NJ). The people from these areas that move to VT, NH or ME have several reasons for doing so. One, they are getting tired of living in a congested area. Two, the area has most likely changed since they were younger and the change that has happened is not to their liking. Three, they have visited VT and fell in love with the dream of living in a New England village or as I call it "living in a Norman Rockwell painting". There are obviously other reasons why people move here, but these are usually the top reasons. With the above mentioned, it is easy to understand why many would be in support of act 250. It is odd living in Chittenden County and seeing what happens in towns like Williston. Most of the town is made up of transplants. There is one side that wants things to stay as they are (no or little development) and then another group that wants to change it so that it's a little like home used to be.

I always get a laugh out of the "live in a Rockwell painting" crowd, who move to Chittenden County (but better there than elsewhere in VT I suppose).

For all of Act 250's burdensome regs, we still have sprawl and housing is just more expensive now.

I should get a petition going to put a wall around Chittenden County. That'll stop the sprawl.