Denali National Park Road Lottery Thread (amusement park, hotels, campground)

[ShipOfFools42]

If the road is there anyway, just charge for permits on a day-to-day basis and let a certain number of people drive it every day. That would eliminate the bumper to bumper traffic, and since it's easy enough to figure out that I figured it out, it makes me think there's some other reason. Also, doing the permit thing would generate revenue for the Park whenever the road is open. Seems reasonable to me.

[blueflames50]

wow did you read that one wrong...not snarky at all and very serious...guess I should have put a smiley face after the smack the forehead icon...! Just like Yellowstone...too many cars and people there is no control for the environment....the buses keep people contained, limit auto breakdowns and accidents. People will break rules, regulations and leave trash and such if not contained....just hike and look at many other national parks and recreation areas ....I was being serious not snarky...lighten up.!
here read it for yourself! you could have search and found this info
Denali National Park and Preserve - Denali Park Road Vehicle Management Plan and EIS (U.S. National Park Service)

more on the master plan an how it has evolved over time...http://www.southdenali.alaska.gov/denalihistory.htm

Edit..an by the way if you took a ride out Petersville Rd this summer compared to years before you would see why this plan is in place....there are so many camps of people trying to prospect for gold it wasn't funny this year....sad to see the 4 wheels ripping up/down, making their own trails off the designating roadway....I can foresee that road being controlled too. this is talked about in the second listing I gave you.

Originally Posted by ShipOfFools42

I was asking if someone actually knows some specific reason why they don't let people through. Wasn't asking for snarky sarcasm from a fellow cheechako. It's a National Park, and they put a road through it anyway, I just think you should be able to drive through a place that your tax dollars pay for in the first place. It doesn't make any sense to say that cars would ruin the pristine environment, because they run tour buses through there all the time. The "pristine environment" around the road itself is already "ruined". The taxpayers keep the park open, but they can't even go drive through it? I think that's lame. It's just a personal opinion.

If the road is there anyway, just charge for permits on a day-to-day basis and let a certain number of people drive it every day. That would eliminate the bumper to bumper traffic, and since it's easy enough to figure out that I figured it out, it makes me think there's some other reason. Also, doing the permit thing would generate revenue for the Park whenever the road is open. Seems reasonable to me.

[starlite9]

Originally Posted by NikkiV

Not to be difficult, but you do realize that $120,000.00 doesn't even begin to cover the added employee costs associated with the Road Lottery. That doesn't even begin to acount for the volunteers.

There are tons of people out there making sure traffic flows smoothly. That's not even including the crews that provide gas for people that ran out; tows and flat tire assistance for those that were less than prepared. Trust me, it's not a revenue generator for the Park Service.

Well the National Parks are suppose to be run by the Govenment and not run for profit to start with, although that is changing.

Having said that, the volunteers are just that, the park service employees are paid whether the park is open or not, the costs are fixed. So throwing extra money on the mix just goes to the federal pot, the park gets to keep none of it, would be nice if it did!

But they make more than the $120,000.00 on Lottery fees, once you win you
Pay another $40.00 for the permit, so that is another $64,000.00 on top of that.

All this is done at the end of the season and really doesn't incurre any additional costs to the Park outside it's normal operation Budget.

So it is a boost to someone!

[starlite9]

Originally Posted by ShipOfFools42

Kinda sucks they won't let you drive it without winning a lottery, if you ask me. Is there some specific reason for that?

It use to be a five dollar bus ticket to ride back twenty years ago, then they subcontracted it out and now costs a lot to ride the buses.

Still see a lot of critters, but most of the buses are less than comfortable! There are a few though that are nice.

You can however book a night for about $600.00+- back at one of the lodges and you can drive your car back to the lodge. Bit expensive, but makes for a nice trip, most of the traffic then is buses.

By the way, the animals in the Park are pretty oblivious to cars/buses and such. It isn't like when you see an animal on the highway and they run off!

[ShipOfFools42]

Blue, we cleared this up in a PM, but just for the record, yes, the head-smack icon said to me, "Your question is really stupid." That's basically what that icon means is that someone has said something dumb. Personally, I think allowing a certain number of vehicles per day and charging an entry fee would be a fine way to allow people to drive the Park road and not degrade the conditions in the park as far as wildlife, wilderness feel, and all that. I understand concerns about unsupervised people littering and such, but I'd like to think that the majority of people would not be littering, and I'm sure there are resources they could use to periodically go through and clean up any trash, because chances are it would be along the road corridor if it would be anywhere. That is, unless people were allowed to park their cars and walk off into the bush, which would create more problems.

Basically, my thing is, I don't want to go to a National Park and ride through it on a cramped, crowded tour bus. I wouldn't want to go ANYWHERE on a crowded tour bus. I was just brainstorming some ways that they could allow limited personal vehicle access to the Park Road and not diminish the character of the place.

[blueflames50]

Originally Posted by ShipOfFools42

Blue, we cleared this up in a PM, but just for the record, yes, the head-smack icon said to me, "Your question is really stupid." That's basically what that icon means is that someone has said something dumb. Personally, I think allowing a certain number of vehicles per day and charging an entry fee would be a fine way to allow people to drive the Park road and not degrade the conditions in the park as far as wildlife, wilderness feel, and all that. I understand concerns about unsupervised people littering and such, but I'd like to think that the majority of people would not be littering, and I'm sure there are resources they could use to periodically go through and clean up any trash, because chances are it would be along the road corridor if it would be anywhere. That is, unless people were allowed to park their cars and walk off into the bush, which would create more problems.

Basically, my thing is, I don't want to go to a National Park and ride through it on a cramped, crowded tour bus. I wouldn't want to go ANYWHERE on a crowded tour bus. I was just brainstorming some ways that they could allow limited personal vehicle access to the Park Road and not diminish the character of the place.

again...sorry you took it that way...wasn't meant in that context I will be more careful in the future. an again....look at what is going on in Yellowstone and a couple other national parks with the allowance of a certain number of vehicles...it is not working well for the environment or the park.

[starlite9]

Originally Posted by ShipOfFools42

Blue, we cleared this up in a PM, but just for the record, yes, the head-smack icon said to me, "Your question is really stupid." That's basically what that icon means is that someone has said something dumb. Personally, I think allowing a certain number of vehicles per day and charging an entry fee would be a fine way to allow people to drive the Park road and not degrade the conditions in the park as far as wildlife, wilderness feel, and all that. I understand concerns about unsupervised people littering and such, but I'd like to think that the majority of people would not be littering, and I'm sure there are resources they could use to periodically go through and clean up any trash, because chances are it would be along the road corridor if it would be anywhere. That is, unless people were allowed to park their cars and walk off into the bush, which would create more problems.

Basically, my thing is, I don't want to go to a National Park and ride through it on a cramped, crowded tour bus. I wouldn't want to go ANYWHERE on a crowded tour bus. I was just brainstorming some ways that they could allow limited personal vehicle access to the Park Road and not diminish the character of the place.

They could very easily allow a hundred cars a day drive the road with no adverse affects other than maybe the tour companies lose customers on the buses.

What they should do is extend the road out aroun and come back to the Stampede trail (magic bus fame of into the wild) since the old road base is there to work with. That way all the traffic is one way and it runs smoothly into and out of the Park.

Besides, then all the people that want to see the bus can drive right past it!

[NikkiV]

Originally Posted by starlite9

They could very easily allow a hundred cars a day drive the road with no adverse affects other than maybe the tour companies lose customers on the buses.

What they should do is extend the road out aroun and come back to the Stampede trail (magic bus fame of into the wild) since the old road base is there to work with. That way all the traffic is one way and it runs smoothly into and out of the Park.

Besides, then all the people that want to see the bus can drive right past it!

I actually like this plan. The biggest hazard on that road is the two way traffic, especially when the buses are running. Having to pull over or back up in sections where the road is only wide ebough for one vehicle . . . :::shivers:::

Plus, think of all the SAR dollars we could save by having a drive by option for the magic bus.

Nikki

[starlite9]

Originally Posted by NikkiV

I actually like this plan. The biggest hazard on that road is the two way traffic, especially when the buses are running. Having to pull over or back up in sections where the road is only wide ebough for one vehicle . . . :::shivers:::

Plus, think of all the SAR dollars we could save by having a drive by option for the magic bus.

Nikki

They had talked about the road extention a few years back, but it fell on deaf ears and the enviromental groups were going nuts over it. Seems to me it would solve a lot of the congestion and open the park up for more people!

Would be nice if they allowed snowmachines to go into the park on groomed trails during winter as well! It would employ more people and the park would be more accessible.

I know a guy that has a horse livery up the Stampede Trail (on the way to the bus), he can't go into the park with his horses unless he puts diapers on the horses so they don't crap and leave alien seeds from the hay they ate, even though it comes from Delta.

[starlite9]

Going though the Park, the critters don't pay too much attention to the cars as do the ones found on the highway system. These guys will come right up and look in the window to see what's in your car.
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