Moral obligations for atheists (funeral, statistics, believe, born)
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Music, decorations, the architecture of the building, a good philosophical homily with no preaching, comradery, tradition, history, etc
You are looking for a hole in my words to say something unsavory. Hi right ahead.
Please stop trying to assign motives to me. I am asking because I am curious. If you don't wish to answer, then you can say so, or ignore me.
I too enjoy beautiful music, architecture, and lovely decorations. I can see appreciating those things. However, I can appreciate them just fine without attending any religious services.
Humans crave rituals, even atheists see the benefits. A beautiful Christmas mass is beautiful whether God is real or not. However, all or nothing binary atheists cannot see that.
I've been to a Christmas Mass and several Jewish services although I do not understand Hebrew. I also enjoy Gregorian Chants. You, just like AA and others, seem hell bent on pigeon holing everyone into some arbitrary box in order to make your personal stance seem both the most logical and most balanced. It drags down discussions to a stand still.
People like Julian use the phrase 'echo chamber' to imply the arguments are repeatedly asserted without rational thought, but it would also echo truths such as 2 + 2 = 4.
It is an irrational dismissal used to avoid making a rational response. Normally Christians who's religion is like a cult use this type of argument, and it is amusing that someone attempting to educate us is using the same tactics.
We evolved in tribes that used kinship followed by religion to build cohesion and unity.
We are animals and had religion until just the other day. I am likely among the first non-believer in my family. I suspect most here are are among the first atheists in their families.
We are entering a new era and humans subconsciously look for methods to find cohesion and unity. Some will simply replace their religion with a non-deity cult and move on. Most will do fine and hurt no one, but there is always the danger of tribalism which often leads to violence.
As I have said many times before; atheism is totally benign. However, atheists are no different than others and will subconsciously look for a system to replace the religion they left behind. BTW, this applies to some and not all.
In summary, we are in unknown territory. However, Robert Sapolski has stated that is possible for opposing tribes to form a new tribe if the new tribe presents a new unifying theme. For example imagine the New York Yankees and the Boston Red Sox playing for the USA baseball team in a world championship. They would get along just fine.
That's mostly a very good post. And it brought up a question in my mind:
Let's take an imaginary man named Phil. If someone asked Phil, "Are you a christian?", Phil would say, "Of course". But Phil never goes to church unless it's to a funeral or wedding of obligation. He only prays on those extreme situations like when he finds out his wife has cancer or his son might end up going to prison. Maybe he prays once every five years, and when he does pray it's only about wanting something REALLY BIG. He treats people well and isn't dishonest, but he doesn't lead his life because of calling himself a christian...he's just a nice guy. He does think about the concept of the Golden Rule sometimes. It was a rare day when Phil thought anything at all about god. Very rare.
Now before I go on with my question, let me throw in a caveat here. In my school, when we would register a new student, state and federal law required that the student's parents declare their race. Whatever they said they were, that's what was recorded. There was no questioning that designation. When we are talking about someone that posts on this forum, the rule is similar -- if they say they are a christian, or a Buddhist, or a Hindu...we accept that, it should not be a point of discussion about that individual.
But in this philosophical story about Phil, what is Phil? He doesn't appear to fulfill the bible version of being a christian. Is he a cultural christian (as you describe)? Or what?
Now again, I just made Phil up. His character sketch is not intended to represent anybody on this forum, or even anyone I specifically personally know. He's at most a composite of many people. But we all know people like Phil.
That's mostly a very good post. And it brought up a question in my mind:
Let's take an imaginary man named Phil. If someone asked Phil, "Are you a christian?", Phil would say, "Of course". But Phil never goes to church unless it's to a funeral or wedding of obligation. He only prays on those extreme situations like when he finds out his wife has cancer or his son might end up going to prison. Maybe he prays once every five years, and when he does pray it's only about wanting something REALLY BIG. He treats people well and isn't dishonest, but he doesn't lead his life because of calling himself a christian...he's just a nice guy. He does think about the concept of the Golden Rule sometimes. It was a rare day when Phil thought anything at all about god. Very rare.
Now before I go on with my question, let me throw in a caveat here. In my school, when we would register a new student, state and federal law required that the student's parents declare their race. Whatever they said they were, that's what was recorded. There was no questioning that designation. When we are talking about someone that posts on this forum, the rule is similar -- if they say they are a christian, or a Buddhist, or a Hindu...we accept that, it should not be a point of discussion about that individual.
But in this philosophical story about Phil, what is Phil? He doesn't appear to fulfill the bible version of being a christian. Is he a cultural christian (as you describe)? Or what?
Now again, I just made Phil up. His character sketch is not intended to represent anybody on this forum, or even anyone I specifically personally know. He's at most a composite of many people. But we all know people like Phil.
I don’t see Phil as a cultural Christian if he has no real interest or appreciation of Christianity.
Don't you think there are a lot of Phils out there?
What do you think that means when Christians point to their numbers as meaning something?
Phil is not a Christian or even a “cultural Christian.” I’d have to know more about him to determine his worldview.
There are a lot of non-Christians who rarely enter a church except for weddings and funerals. What does that have to do with the number of Christians?
What are you implying the ‘numbers’ of Christians means?
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