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The first few centuries of Catholicism were all about helping the poor, chastity, and the ascetic lifestyle. You are talking about the corruption that set in centuries later.
...
What is your basis for believing that?
To be honest, I think the basis of the attraction for catholicism and christianity is a purely selfish one -- the promise of heaven and eternal life.
But once again, you are taking us off topic. Start your own thread.
All religions are a collection of myths. But, Christianity was able to put forth a better message.
here is an example of what you call "a better message" that was put forth by one of the revered leaders of Crstnty, Martin Luther, who led the Protestant reformation. this "message" was embraced by the Nazis and used to promote and justify the Holocaust and murder of 12 million people.
stop whitewashing history.
your posts repeatedly promote the propaganda, dishonesty, and outright denial of the historic record regarding the "non-violence of Crstnty" and "a better message." those views expressed in your posts, with regards to "respect due" put you in the same category as Holoocaust deniers.
Martin Luther one of the most significant figures in Christian history, leader of the Protestant Reformation wrote this on "What shall we Christians do with this rejected and condemned people, the Jews." Note the hatred, violence, incitement to violence and brutal mindset identical to Hitler.
"First, to set fire to their synagogues or schools … This is to be done in honor of our Lord and of Christendom, so that God might see that we are Christians …"
"Second, I advise that their houses also be razed and destroyed."
"Third, I advise that all their prayer books and Talmudic writings, in which such idolatry, lies, cursing, and blasphemy are taught, be taken from them."
"Fourth, I advise that their rabbis be forbidden to teach henceforth on pain of loss of life and limb …"
"Fifth, I advise that safe-conduct on the highways be abolished completely for the Jews. For they have no business in the countryside …"
"Sixth, I advise that usury be prohibited to them, and that all cash and treasure of silver and gold be taken from them …"
"Seventh, I recommend putting a flail, an ax, a hoe, a spade, a distaff, or a spindle into the hands of young, strong Jews and Jewesses and letting them earn their bread in the sweat of their brow … But if we are afraid that they might harm us or our wives, children, servants, cattle, etc., … then let us emulate the common sense of other nations such as France, Spain, Bohemia, etc., … then eject them forever from the country …"
"The prevailing view among historians is that Luther's anti-Jewish rhetoric contributed significantly to the development of antisemitism in Germany, and in the 1930s and 1940s provided an ideal foundation for the Nazi Party's attacks on Jews. Reinhold Lewin writes that "whoever wrote against the Jews for whatever reason believed he had the right to justify himself by triumphantly referring to Luther." According to Michael, just about every anti-Jewish book printed in the Third Reich contained references to and quotations from Luther. Diarmaid MacCulloch argues that Luther's 1543 pamphlet On the Jews and Their Lies was a "blueprint" for the Kristallnacht. Shortly after the Kristallnacht, Martin Sasse, Bishop of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in Thuringia, published a compendium of Martin Luther's writings; Sasse "applauded the burning of the synagogues" and the coincidence of the day, writing in the introduction, "On November 10, 1938, on Luther's birthday, the synagogues are burning in Germany." The German people, he urged, ought to heed these words "of the greatest anti-Semite of his time, the warner of his people against the Jews."
"Christopher J. Probst, in his book Demonizing the Jews: Luther and the Protestant Church in Nazi Germany (2012), shows that a large number of German Protestant clergy and theologians during the Nazi Third Reich used Luther's hostile publications towards the Jews and their Jewish religion to justify at least in part the anti-Semitic policies of the National Socialists. Published In 1940, Heinrich Himmler wrote admiringly of Luther's writings and sermons on the Jews. The city of Nuremberg presented a first edition of On the Jews and their Lies to Julius Streicher, editor of the Nazi newspaper Der Stürmer; the newspaper described it as the most radically antisemitic tract ever published. It was publicly exhibited in a glass case at the Nuremberg rallies and quoted in a 54-page explanation of the Aryan Law by Dr. E.H. Schulz and Dr. R. Frercks. On December 17, 1941, seven Lutheran regional church confederations issued a statement agreeing with the policy of forcing Jews to wear the yellow badge, "since after his bitter experience Luther had [strongly] suggested preventive measures against the Jews and their expulsion from German territory."
"Luther’s thinking on the Jewish people had a direct impact on history: The Nazis amplified Luther’s anti-Semitism from the earliest days of the National Socialist movement. It helped in the creation of the heavily Nazified and racist faction of Deutsche Christen, or German Christians, within the German Lutheran church, but perhaps more significantly, partly enabled the culture of anti-Semitism that made the Holocaust possible. One especially repugnant case is that of Martin Sasse, the Bishop of the Evangelical Church of Thuringia during Kristallnacht in 1938. He feted the pogroms and the mass destruction of synagogues and Jewish businesses, and even tied it explicitly to Luther himself; just days after what was in effect the beginning of the organized slaughter of the Jews, he distributed a pamphlet entitled Martin Luther on the Jews: Away with Them! in which he claimed the Nazis were acting as Christians in their violent anti-Semitism, and that this was precisely what Luther would have wanted."
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 04-25-2021 at 10:23 AM..
here is an example of what you call "a better message" that was put forth by one of the revered leaders of Crstnty, Martin Luther, who led the Protestant reformation. this "message" was embraced by the Nazis and used to promote and justify the Holocaust and murder of 12 million people.
stop whitewashing history.
your posts repeatedly promote the propaganda of the "non-violence of Crstnty" and "a better message." those views, regarding "respect due" are in the same mindset as Holoocaust deniers.
Martin Luther one of the most significant figures in Christian history, leader of the Protestant Reformation wrote this on "What shall we Christians do with this rejected and condemned people, the Jews." Note the hatred, violence, incitement to violence and brutal mindset identical to Hitler.
"First, to set fire to their synagogues or schools … This is to be done in honor of our Lord and of Christendom, so that God might see that we are Christians …"
"Second, I advise that their houses also be razed and destroyed."
"Third, I advise that all their prayer books and Talmudic writings, in which such idolatry, lies, cursing, and blasphemy are taught, be taken from them."
"Fourth, I advise that their rabbis be forbidden to teach henceforth on pain of loss of life and limb …"
"Fifth, I advise that safe-conduct on the highways be abolished completely for the Jews. For they have no business in the countryside …"
"Sixth, I advise that usury be prohibited to them, and that all cash and treasure of silver and gold be taken from them …"
"Seventh, I recommend putting a flail, an ax, a hoe, a spade, a distaff, or a spindle into the hands of young, strong Jews and Jewesses and letting them earn their bread in the sweat of their brow … But if we are afraid that they might harm us or our wives, children, servants, cattle, etc., … then let us emulate the common sense of other nations such as France, Spain, Bohemia, etc., … then eject them forever from the country …"
The prevailing view[32] among historians is that Luther's anti-Jewish rhetoric contributed significantly to the development of antisemitism in Germany,[33] and in the 1930s and 1940s provided an ideal foundation for the Nazi Party's attacks on Jews.[34] Reinhold Lewin writes that "whoever wrote against the Jews for whatever reason believed he had the right to justify himself by triumphantly referring to Luther." According to Michael, just about every anti-Jewish book printed in the Third Reich contained references to and quotations from Luther. Diarmaid MacCulloch argues that Luther's 1543 pamphlet On the Jews and Their Lies was a "blueprint" for the Kristallnacht.[35] Shortly after the Kristallnacht, Martin Sasse, Bishop of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in Thuringia, published a compendium of Martin Luther's writings; Sasse "applauded the burning of the synagogues" and the coincidence of the day, writing in the introduction, "On November 10, 1938, on Luther's birthday, the synagogues are burning in Germany." The German people, he urged, ought to heed these words "of the greatest anti-Semite of his time, the warner of his people against the Jews."[36]
Christopher J. Probst, in his book Demonizing the Jews: Luther and the Protestant Church in Nazi Germany (2012), shows that a large number of German Protestant clergy and theologians during the Nazi Third Reich used Luther's hostile publications towards the Jews and their Jewish religion to justify at least in part the anti-Semitic policies of the National Socialists.[37] Published In 1940, Heinrich Himmler wrote admiringly of Luther's writings and sermons on the Jews.[38] The city of Nuremberg presented a first edition of On the Jews and their Lies to Julius Streicher, editor of the Nazi newspaper Der Stürmer, on his birthday in 1937; the newspaper described it as the most radically antisemitic tract ever published.[39] It was publicly exhibited in a glass case at the Nuremberg rallies and quoted in a 54-page explanation of the Aryan Law by Dr. E.H. Schulz and Dr. R. Frercks.[40] On December 17, 1941, seven Lutheran regional church confederations issued a statement agreeing with the policy of forcing Jews to wear the yellow badge, "since after his bitter experience Luther had [strongly] suggested preventive measures against the Jews and their expulsion from German territory."
Luther’s thinking on the Jewish people had a direct impact on history: The Nazis amplified Luther’s anti-Semitism from the earliest days of the National Socialist movement. It helped in the creation of the heavily Nazified and racist faction of Deutsche Christen, or German Christians, within the German Lutheran church, but perhaps more significantly, partly enabled the culture of anti-Semitism that made the Holocaust possible.
One especially repugnant case is that of Martin Sasse, the Bishop of the Evangelical Church of Thuringia during Kristallnacht in 1938. He feted the pogroms and the mass destruction of synagogues and Jewish businesses, and even tied it explicitly to Luther himself; just days after what was in effect the beginning of the organized slaughter of the Jews, he distributed a pamphlet entitled Martin Luther on the Jews: Away with Them! in which he claimed the Nazis were acting as Christians in their violent anti-Semitism, and that this was precisely what Luther would have wanted.
I often criticize you (and deservedly so). But here I admire how clearly you are putting forth some reality on this particular topic.
Are you talking about the modern notion of romantic marriage that’s only a couple hundred years old? Before then, marriage was largely a business transaction (and for some people it remains as such).
In the past marriage was the only protection a woman had. Today women have reach equality and hence may not necessarily need marriage. So it makes sense that marriage is on the decline. I hope things work out for you, 30 years is a long time.
I was just kidding about my marriage. I'm sure we're good to go at least TWO more years. Not just one...
Today women have reached equality? Not sure we're quite there yet either.
All this chatter about women's rights is interesting, but perhaps we should try to get back to the topic of this thread: What "due respect" is owed religion and religionists?
Not sure it's even interesting. Much of it seems a little odd to me...
I respect religion and whatever anyone wants to believe. Long as they please stay in their lane. If not, I lose respect for them. Unfortunately, religion at the more macro political level tends to veer considerably into the lane of others, so at that higher level of influence and/or in those cases, I'm not too inclined to honor the religion with respect either.
I've been around here for ~13 years and I've never heard anybody mention animalism before. What kind of churches do they have?
I think in that religion they're called farms.
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