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There we go again, when I point out what other people are doing, I'm accused of being intolerant.....(to steal one of your phrases) Geeeezzz!!!!!
As far as migrations go. No one has a lock on the culture of a geographic region. Just ask the Native Americians on whose land we all now stand. They had a culture, and they were forcibly removed from their land. So I don't believe that anyone can "ignore and exclude" anyone. That is my whole point. Remember the melting pot, isn't that what America (not Roanoke, Charlotte, Northeast, etc.) is supposed to be.
To reference the "Great Northeast Migration" you speak of, people follow opportunity. Many southerners went north during the industrial revolution, now we are more in a technology/ service age, and people are following the money.
I am simply showing what is happening, not only in Charlotte, but everywhere. Everyone needs to stop being so afraid of people who are different from them.
I am sorry. I do not get what you are protesting. I really do not!!!
It seems you are insinuating that we are full of racists here and are intolerant of "anyone who is different." Different from WHAT????
And no - many Southerners did NOT go North. Sorry. You are wrong. The ones who went North were no longer Southerners after a few generations. We are talking about Southerners who have stayed here and whose families have been here for 200 years or more, and that includes blacks and whites.
The South is predominately made up of black and white people who have been living together for hundreds of years. Many of us have intermarried w/ other ethnicities (most often, black, white and native American).
So I don't get what you are saying. You obviously have stereotypical views of Southerners.
But you are from NC, what you know, as a resident, is different from an "outsider" making inquiries. Of course diversity exists, but a person with fears/doubts wants to confirm if they too will feel comfortable in a new southern city because historically the south hasn't been viewed as the hotbed of diversity, but that is changing/has changed.
Yes, sometimes people make statements based on ignorance or fear, but offense shouldn't be taken. I don't think inquiring minds doubt diversity exists but part of educating oneself includes asking questions . I like on this board when posters refer to a previous post on the same subject - a big time saver!
I agree that people need to assimilate into an area where they move and value the history and habits of that place, but again some historical events in the south stick in people's minds - again leading to why the "culture" question keeps popping up. A view visits doesn't give the insight that a resident can give, but a forum of opinions shouldn't make or break a relocation or whatever.
I agree completely. I forget that some are not as well steeped in the violent/ intolerant history of the south. My parents, grand parents, Aunts and Uncles tell me stories of things they experienced that are absolutely infuriating. Their experiences do help to shape my (and other black people's) views on "diversity" and relations between the races.
In the deep south, its still bad. I told the missus, that Charlotte is the only place south of Va. that I would even consider moving to, because of the ingrained predjudice that exists in much of the south.
Lack of culture should be distinguished from lack of cultural offerings. While no one has quite suitably defined Charlotte 'culture' I really would like to see more imagination and less mini-malls; more preservation and less sprawl;more communities (not in the Birkdale Village mold) with easy walking between 'interesting' cafes, bookshops, theatres running independent films, funky music venues, arts/music festivals rather than food festivals; and shops without mass-produced knock-offs. That's just me. Do I complain about Charlotte? I came down here for a job and to live with my fiancee. That outweighed the paucity of cultural offerings that appeal to me. I see Charlotte as stuck in the middle of the bell curve in a lot ways.
Now defenders of the existent cultural offerings will argue that it's out there - but in the current form, it's either lacking - again, for my personal taste - or there isn't enough of it (e.g., one independent film theatre in Ballantyne that doesn't offer nearly enough).
So, if, as one poster wrote, Charlotte can be condensed into 'NASCAR, Banking, and Religion' (one 'native' definition, perhaps), then Charlotte has some sort of 'culture', but just not one that is very interesting to me as civic cultural phenomena.
Just don't reflexively write I should return from where it is I migrated, when cultural offerings were not the reason I moved here.
"So, I have to ask the following blunt question: if a town is made up of mostly southern (some may say redneck) white people, who's roots go back to well before the civil war, who have southern pride, southern heritage, and everything that makes one southern, does that mean it lacks culture? "
You seem completely hung up on the civil war thing. In the context of the OP, it was used only as a point of refernece, in a period of time.
That is a direct quote from the original post. So reading that as Black American, how is that supposed to make me feel.
How about if you were moving to Norfolk, Atlanta, or New Orleans (pre-Katrina) and I said something like "...if a town is made up of mostly southern (some would say ghetto-fabulous) black people, who's roots go back to the civil war, who have black pride, black heritage, and everything that makes one black, does it mean it lacks culture?
So what if you did? I have absolutely no problem with black people. As a matter of fact, I work very closely with someone who is a dirt poor, inner city, "ghetto-fabulous" mom, and we are good friends. But the relationship is built on my tolerance of her culture AND her tolerance of mine.
You see I didn't get from his post that southern was synonymous with anything other than white.
Are you saying black southerners don't have southern pride? That there are no black "rednecks"? Being "redneck" is certainly not exclusive to whites.
As far as a campaign for Obama, I was merely pointing out that his candidacy is making ALL PEOPLE feel included in what is going on. I found a connection in the two.
Lastly, your rant about people asking about diversity. If you belonged to a minority group, you would want to know if the "natives" (I use the term loosely) were friendly to your group of people. Since you aren't in the minority, you don't have to grapple with these issue, and get annoyed when other people look out for their own interests if they are not congruent with your own.
Why would a minority auomatically assume an area is unfriendly to it's ethnicity. This is 2008, not 1968. The faces walkiing to and from the uptown office buildings, in suits and ties are just as likely to be Black or Asian or Hispanic or even female as they are white. As has been expressed many times, in many threads- Charlotte is noyt about black and white- Charlotte is about green.
I haven't been paying much attention to this thread up until now. It's a shame that a simple question as OP put on the table has to be a platform for agendas that belong in sub -forums as Politics, Election Candidates, Black History , and all of the other issues that kind of sneak in here.
How can anyone deny CLT having a culture? Aside from all of the examples put forth already (as in Ani's posts) what about TODAY'S culture or did you overlook that? Is there not a culture that exists in CLT that is part of young people participating in careers with the second largest financial center?
Is there not a "culture" of transplants to this city? ie: new families sharing a culture of a new city, new sub-division, new school, church, restaurants. Is there not a culture in the arts? And on and on to the OP.
If one would read the definition of "culture" that OP placed one might understand better the ways we can answer the question. Might be a lot better than NY vs. CLT or Black race relations with Obama etc.
There are much better subs to place your opinions available.
I am sorry. I do not get what you are protesting. I really do not!!!
It seems you are insinuating that we are full of racists here and are intolerant of "anyone who is different." Different from WHAT????
And no - many Southerners did NOT go North. Sorry. You are wrong. The ones who went North were no longer Southerners after a few generations. We are talking about Southerners who have stayed here and whose families have been here for 200 years or more, and that includes blacks and whites.
The South is predominately made up of black and white people who have been living together for hundreds of years. Many of us have intermarried w/ other ethnicities (most often, black, white and native American).
So I don't get what you are saying. You obviously have stereotypical views of Southerners.
Not sure how you got that from the post. Will try to clarify: You asked: "Different from WHAT????" Different from themselves. Not only racially, but geographically, or whatever other difference they can find.
I don't have a sterotypical view of southerners, although there are sterotypical southerners out there, as there are sterotypical versions of all types of people out there.
To bring it back, the original poster was suggessting that by merely inquiring about diversity, insults southerners in some way. For minority groups, its an important question to see how well recieved you will be in a new place.
Many minorities are attracted to Charlotte, becuase of its repuation for diversity. People ask the question because they want to make sure it isn't a fluke. When Carolina Guy and other posters have such a negative reaction to questions about diversity, it makes new comers think that Charlotte's rep is all just hype. I don't think it is, but thats the way it comes off.
Why is this turning into a racial discussion? I don't think that anyone is disputing the existence of black culture in Charlotte. It runs deep. From barbecue to religion to piedmont blues, this region would not have the depth and richness of character that it has without the African influence.
Further, black culture and white culture in the South have influenced each other to the extent that they share so many of the same qualities that in many instances they are interchangeable and inseparable. That cannot be said for the Northeast, where I come from, where de facto segregation has kept the races apart far better and for far longer than any old Jim Crow law could possibly hope for.
Remember that Soul Food in the North is just food down here.
Lack of culture should be distinguished from lack of cultural offerings. While no one has quite suitably defined Charlotte 'culture' I really would like to see more imagination and less mini-malls; more preservation and less sprawl;more communities (not in the Birkdale Village mold) with easy walking between 'interesting' cafes, bookshops, theatres running independent films, funky music venues, arts/music festivals rather than food festivals; and shops without mass-produced knock-offs. That's just me. Do I complain about Charlotte? I came down here for a job and to live with my fiancee. That outweighed the paucity of cultural offerings that appeal to me. I see Charlotte as stuck in the middle of the bell curve in a lot ways.
Now defenders of the existent cultural offerings will argue that it's out there - but in the current form, it's either lacking - again, for my personal taste - or there isn't enough of it (e.g., one independent film theatre in Ballantyne that doesn't offer nearly enough).
So, if, as one poster wrote, Charlotte can be condensed into 'NASCAR, Banking, and Religion' (one 'native' definition, perhaps), then Charlotte has some sort of 'culture', but just not one that is very interesting to me as civic cultural phenomena.
Just don't reflexively write I should return from where it is I migrated, when cultural offerings were not the reason I moved here.
I don't have time to write everything I wish, but just wanted to say thanks to all of my friends who have explained further my intentions for creating this thread. To roanoke and global, you clearly have not been privy to multitude of threads that have questioned Charlotte's diversity and culture.
The point I was making in reference to the "small white towns" was that in many threads before this one, certain individuals have posted there IS NO CULTURE in these towns, just because they may be in the ethnic or racial minority. My point was to illustrate how ignorant it was.
You two have obviously not been on this board long enough to understand I would never make a racial bigotry or make claims that transplants are not welcome here--from any place!
Just like my friends have clearly pointed out, my intention was to profess that we do indeed have a culture in this area, and just because it is not YOUR culture, doesn't give you the right to dismiss ours.
So leave the politics, racial references, and ignorant rants to yourself.
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. I like on this board when posters refer to a previous post on the same subject - a big time saver!
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