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Sorry Kat . . . we disagree on this as well. We as a species need to grow up and abandon the "sin is disobedience of God's laws" training wheels. We needed to be given guidelines and examples of the proper exercise of our self-control over our animal nature. But there is a purpose that transcends the obedience aspect. In our case . . . "love God and each other."
So are you saying that the word "sin" should be eliminated from our vocabulary? I'm not quite sure what you're getting at. Also, I didn't just make up my definition or get it from attending a Sunday School class. I used the dictionary definition, which seemed logical to me. I guess I'm just trying to figure out if you see any behaviors as sinful or not.
So are you saying that the word "sin" should be eliminated from our vocabulary? I'm not quite sure what you're getting at. Also, I didn't just make up my definition or get it from attending a Sunday School class. I used the dictionary definition, which seemed logical to me. I guess I'm just trying to figure out if you see any behaviors as sinful or not.
Dictionaries are not important . . . achieving the proper "state of mind" (like the mind of Christ) is.. Behaviors are for carnal and worldly concerns . . . NOT spiritual. There are many many "sinful" behaviors and attitudes . . . and they ALL violate either "love God" or "love each other." NOTHING is sinful that does not violate those two commands of Christ.
achieving the proper "state of mind" (like the mind of Christ) is.. Behaviors are for carnal and worldly concerns . . . NOT spiritual. There are many many "sinful" behaviors and attitudes . . . and they ALL violate either "love God" or "love each other." NOTHING is sinful that does not violate those two commands of Christ.
You remind me so much of a poster I used to know on another forum. I hadn't thought about him in a long time. (He was a nice guy, by the way.)
So, I see what you're saying, but even if I were to agree with your explanation of what it means to be sinful, I don't see how that negates anything I said. Pretty much anything we do to show disrespect or callousness towards God or our fellow human beings is, in my opinion, sinful. I'm not using the word in a strict, legalistic sense, which you seem to think to be the case.
You remind me so much of a poster I used to know on another forum. I hadn't thought about him in a long time. (He was a nice guy, by the way.)
So, I see what you're saying, but even if I were to agree with your explanation of what it means to be sinful, I don't see how that negates anything I said. Pretty much anything we do to show disrespect or callousness towards God or our fellow human beings is, in my opinion, sinful. I'm not using the word in a strict, legalistic sense, which you seem to think to be the case.
When you use or emphasize the "obedience/disobedience" paradigm . . . you are on the immature training wheels spiritual wavelength, IMO. As our children mature . . . they no longer respond to that paradigm . . . they respond out of love.
Do you through the baby out with the bath water?...
Absolutely not....but I've studied and compared both testaments long enough to know that each one TOTALLY AND COMPLETELY contradicts the other. Jesus did not qualify if any way, shape or form as the Jewish Messiah...that is FACT! While biblical authors and Christian apoligists have attempted to manufacture fulfilled prophecies of the Hebrew bible...the Hebrew bible has very specific prophecies regarding the actual Messiah...there are very specific things the Messiah is supposed to accomplish IN HIS LIFETIME....Jesus accomplished none of these. The Hebrew bible says nothing of a completely NEW covenant...is speaks of a RENEWED covenant....a renewal of the covenant they already had.
The New Covenant of the NT is a NEW RELIGION ALTOGETHER...for it in no way even resembles and contradicts everything God told us prior to it. Paul had a vision and made a new religion. If you can show me where the Hebrew bible states the Messiah has to be a blood sacrifice, rise after three days and annul/abolish the law...I'll listen to you. In the Hebrew bible....the prophecies of Messiah say quite the opposite....and even God said that NO MAN CAN REDEEM ANOTHER.
This is Gods plan from the Hebrew bible:
Ezek 18:20-22
The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.
All God requires is that we repent and return to him (This is told over and over and over again in the Hebrew bible)...END OF STORY.
Original sin is a NT invention which is used to set the stage for the need of a special savior, the man/god Jesus. This concept of original sin, taught by the NT, launches the mission of Jesus who is claimed to be the "sin" offering that pays the debt or atones for the sins of all humanity.
Last edited by ChristyGrl; 10-01-2010 at 06:18 AM..
Hence the NT need to make a mere man god. Enter the myth of Jesus the Christ.
Exactly....they are two diametrically opposed gods. When comparing the Hebrew bible (OT) to the NT...they are two diametrically opposed collection of books. Obviously one of them has to be wrong....they do not harmonize in any way, shape or form....so which one is right? Do you believe God or Paul??? Apparently, that was a no brainer for the Jews.
Exactly....they are two diametrically opposed gods. When comparing the Hebrew bible (OT) to the NT...they are two diametrically opposed collection of books. Obviously one of them has to be wrong....they do not harmonize in any way, shape or form....so which one is right? Do you believe God or Paul??? Apparently, that was a no brainer for the Jews.
You are asking the wrong questions . . . what aspects of these inspirations capture the underlying template for the evolution of human understanding of God . . . the cognitive structure that will resonate most strongly within the human psyche. Apply this evolutionary analytic paradigm to ALL the "spiritual fossil records" that you denigrate as plagiarized, Christy and see the bigger picture that unfolds. EVERYTHING is designed to evolve . . . Life IS change.
You are asking the wrong questions . . . what aspects of these inspirations capture the underlying template for the evolution of human understanding of God . . . the cognitive structure that will resonate most strongly within the human psyche. Apply this evolutionary analytic paradigm to ALL the "spiritual fossil records" that you denigrate as plagiarized, Christy and see the bigger picture that unfolds. EVERYTHING is designed to evolve . . . Life IS change.
You're barking up the wrong tree...my beef is with the Fundamentalists and Biblists who take this bible keyrap literally...I'm just attempting to show them how wrong they are...how contradictory the entire thing is.
And...I might add...that while I can understand where you're coming from...we part company when you attempt to use what is written in the bible as your basis...because after extensive study of the bible texts and others, I find, it is all BS and based on BS from start to finish. It is entirely man made...it's mans representation and nothing more. There may be some wise saying contained within it....sayings that were said by other people....but the risen savior I have to accept and believe in is BS and I have no problem stating it as BS. Was there a MAN named Jesus who walked the earth who is behind the Jesus in the bible...who knows....the evidence or lack thereof strongly suggests there was none...I don't know and I don't really care at this point because I do know that the one presented is FALSE. He might have said some really good stuff...do we have his writings....NO WE DON'T....we have the writings of the Roman Church....the writings that were reworked and edited to fit their agenda...these are the FACTS.
I don't deny that there is a SOURCE OF ALL THERE IS/A UNIVERSAL ENERGY/A UNIVERSAL CONSCIOUSNESS...I don't deny that each one of us has a part of that contained within us...and I don't deny that knowing that part is in knowing ourselves...I however, completely and utterly DENY that it's representation cannot be found in that archaic book or any book for that matter...and the more you attempt to use it...the more we part company...just saying.
Last edited by ChristyGrl; 10-01-2010 at 08:45 AM..
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I used the dictionary definition, which seemed logical to me. I guess I'm just trying to figure out if you see any behaviors as sinful or not.
