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I don't believe that protesting gay marriage does advance the gospel. What do you think?
Jesus taught love. He who is without sin cast the first stone.(1 Corinthians 6:9-11- any one of these gross sins are practiced= one will not enter Gods kingdom( be saved)( its that simple)--
So the only thoughts a Christian would have on the matter, are how can I help my brother or sister realize Gods will, in a loving manor.. Protesting is a worldly thing.
Jesus taught love. He who is without sin cast the first stone.(1 Corinthians 6:9-11- any one of these gross sins are practiced= one will not enter Gods kingdom( be saved)( its that simple)--
So the only thoughts a Christian would have on the matter, are how can I help my brother or sister realize Gods will, in a loving manor.. Protesting is a worldly thing.
Judging IN the Congregation is necessary.
KJV 1 Corinthians 5:1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. ... 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
13 But them that are without God judgeth. Thereforeput away from among yourselves that wicked person.
KJV 1 Corinthians 5:1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. ... 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
13 But them that are without God judgeth. Thereforeput away from among yourselves that wicked person.
That's the type of biblical nonsense that I recognized as such when I was 15 or so.
Wheat from chaff people...wheat from chaff.
Some of you are chewing some pretty coarse, mealy bread. (And trying to pretend it's a warm-from-the-oven croissant.)
Anybody who's tasted the fulsome flavour of truth can never go back.
Does allowing adultery, rape, murder, incest, etc them advance the Gospel? I suppose if we overlook sin and tell people that anything goes, they might just want to join the club!
Read the Book of Acts. There are examples after examples of cases where immoral people were told they were immoral and they got ticked off as a result. Does that mean we shouldn't protest their behavior? Or maybe it's not just about signing people up for the club and getting big numbers. Maybe it's about people being confronted with their sin, repenting of it, and receiving forgiveness.
That's exactly what turns sinners against Christians. Christ says no one will come by Him unless the Father call him first. Instead of pointing out a sinner's faults, invite him to attend your church. Welcome him when he arrives and sit with him during the service. Perhaps the sermon will prick his heart and the Holy Spirit will convict him. If not, ask him to come back. I'm so mule-headed myself if you scold me I will stay away from you.
Instead of pointing out a sinner's faults, invite him to attend your church. Welcome him when he arrives and sit with him during the service.
Winner, winner,
pot luck dinner.
Not crazy about referring to people as "sinners" but this is SO much better than the holier than thou tactic of calling people out and "correcting" them.
Last edited by DewDropInn; 07-09-2014 at 08:00 PM..
Judging IN the Congregation is necessary.
KJV 1 Corinthians 5:1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. ... 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
13 But them that are without God judgeth. Thereforeput away from among yourselves that wicked person.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_human_being
That's exactly what turns sinners against Christians. Christ says no one will come by Him unless the Father call him first. Instead of pointing out a sinner's faults, invite him to attend your church. Welcome him when he arrives and sit with him during the service. Perhaps the sermon will prick his heart and the Holy Spirit will convict him. If not, ask him to come back. I'm so mule-headed myself if you scold me I will stay away from you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DewDropInn
Winner, winner,
pot luck dinner.
Not crazy about referring to people as "sinners" but this is SO much better than the holier than thou tactic of calling people out and "correcting" them.
The above are two perfect examples of the difference a Gospel of agape love makes in the treatment of others. THB is indeed a human being of the best type. We can only treat each other with love, period. We have no authority to coerce, punish, condemn or otherwise harass anyone. MEN instituted those practices for their own vile purposes. God does NOT need us to enforce ANYTHING on anyone BUT OURSELVES.
The Holy Bible teaches morality and living upright perfectly.. 2 things the Gay crowd hates with a passion.
Is Genocide of all men, children, non-virgin women moral? Is kidnapping virgins, allowing men (presumably to the ugly men with lots of back hair) to marry them by having relations with the kidnapped virgins moral? Is slavery moral? Is Misogyny Moral? Is holding children and grandchildren accountable for the actions of the parent Moral? These are just a few of the things the bible not only allows but instructs followers to do, and is just a few of the things that Christians seem to hate with a passion when pointed out to them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber
That is pro-gay opinion, but it does not make is fact. You did not answer my question. What is the point of arranging a vote where only one outcome is accepted? It sure seems like it is done purely for the show.
It is truly sad that you 1. Do not seem to understand at all the purpose of the Executive, Legislative, or Judicial Branch and their purposes in our form of government. 2. You do not understand the Freedoms afforded and Guaranteed to all people in the United States by our Constitution. 3. Do not realize that the exact same arguments were challenged when the courts overturned discrimination against people.
Finally, for everyone that hates that the court overturned it, why are you trying to shoot yourself or perhaps your children in the foot. What if your child lived in an area that becomes a majority of a different religion, perhaps the scary Muslims. What if they made a law that you had to have a beard and that your daughters had to wear Burqas. There are definitely parts of the U.S. Where Islam is growing and could easily take over a small county or city government. Are you saying they should have the right to enact laws like this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneFormula
If homosexuality was not a wicked practice and lifestyle, why then is it challenged by so many people over so many hundreds of years? MUST BE something wrong about it, yes?
Kinda like that bad dog in the neighborhood, EVERYBODY hates it because they KNOW it's dangerous and can maul somebody...same with homosexuality,, EVERYBODY knows it's wrong (even gays) but they want to play with fire anyway...
Please explain why... someone would have homosexual sex if they knew it was wrong and hated it. What advantage would someone have to be literally hated by people like you if they truly hated it and disliked it themselves. When did you choose to become straight? Are you wanting to play with fire but can't... was that the point you were trying to make, because I don' see anything in your post but fear. Do you believe that more people would become gay if gay marriage was allowed? Are you in fear of yourself or others?
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What most (not all, I thank T_H_B for adding a sane Christian point of view) Christians do not get is that protesting against gay marriage does not at all advance the gospel for several reasons.
- What are you actually protesting. Because most of the arguments here are protesting against Homosexuality, and are not reasons for protesting gay marriage. People who are attracted to the same sex are going to do the same things heterosexual people do when they are in their own homes. So are you truly protesting homosexuality or gay marriage.
- If you are going to use the argument that the Bible states that 1 woman and 1 man should define marriage, then we may need to redefine the term marriage because in the U.S. It means a whole lot more. It is a contract, that provides for benefits, both mandatory and optional, such as health care, spousal support, raising children, death benefits, etc. By protesting gay marriage, you aren't gong to change the fact that they will live together or have sex, but denying health insurance, who gets to raise an adopted child if one partner dies... the state or the other parent the child has known for up to 17 years. Who makes the decisions in terms of treatment if one becomes ill, who is responsible for it. Thee are the consequences for protesting gay marriage. And this is why the church comes out as not promoting a gospel which most Christians tend to identify as love for one another.
Many gay rights advocates considered the Pope's message of tolerance towards gay priests and Christians to be quite revolutionary, despite what some have argued to the contrary. However, according to historian John Boswell and his seminal book Same-Sex Unions in Premodern Europe, the Christian church has already performed same-sex unions. Granted, it was some centuries ago during the Dark Ages. Nevertheless, io9 reports that:
"There were dozens of records of church ceremonies where two men were joined in unions that used the same rituals as heterosexual marriages. (He found almost no records of lesbian unions, which is probably an artifact of a culture which kept more records about the lives of men generally.)"
The Catholic historian's book was published in 1994, shortly before his death. As io9 noted, "given the Church's present-day views on gay marriage, these detractors argued, Boswell's history seemed like wishful thinking." Now, the book is being re-released as an e-book, and finding itself in the spotlight once again. It chronicles much of Boswell's research the he conducted throughout the 1970's and 80's, sifting through legal and church records from throughout the late Roman Empire and Early Christian church.
So why doesn't the Church recognize same-sex unions anymore? Any why are the documents chronicling these same-sex unions just now surfacing centuries later?
"One easy answer is that — as Boswell argues — the Church reframed the idea of marriage in the 13th century to be for the purposes of procreation. And this slammed the door on gay marriage. Church scholars and officials worked hard to suppress the history of these marriages in order to justify their new definition.
These unions took place in era during which Europe was still transitioning from its last years of the Roman Empire. Thus, these unions most likely reflected the kind of same-sex relationships that existed in Rome decades before. Documents would often refer to the two men as "brothers" rather than "husbands". Annalee Newitz, author of the io9 piece, also noted that "marriages over a millennium ago were not based specifically on procreation, but more based on wealth sharing for security, which is also a specific part of traditional marriage. That said, the documents still present evidence that the Early Christian church performed marriage ceremonies between two men.
One legal scholar even "wrote a law journal article explaining that Boswell's book could even be used as evidence for the legality of gay marriage, since it shows evidence that definitions of marriage have changed over time." Most of the individuals who cite religion as their chief objection to marriage equality cite the belief that the Church's current definition supports the same, "natural", divinely inspired definition that it has always had. Boswell's work certainly presents evidence that contradicts that.
Unfortunately, Boswell is no longer around to defend his work. If he was, though, there is no doubt that he would have one or two things to say about the current legal state of same-sex marriage. One can only hope that the release of his work in this much more accessible and cost-effective might allow more people to get their hands on it.
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