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But you guy's base "all means all" ..........You crack me up
twin.spin, what you wrote does not make any sense and is not even a complete sentence.
Let me fill it in for you since you need some help:
You guy's think that "all" always means "all.'"
And that is not the truth. We have gone to great lengths to prove that "all" is always the "all" of the context. The problem with YOU GUY'S is you take the "alls" which are used in a figurative, hyperbolic sense and import that sense into the verses where "all" is used in an all inclusive, non figurative, literal sense.
Quote:
never means never..."will never share in the inheritance with the free woman's son"
That is correct that Ishmael will NEVER EVER NEVER EVER share in the inheritance of Isaac.
Quote:
The slave son represents those who are trying to be justified by the law...thus the "Mount Sinai in Arabia" ref, that was were the law was given.
I agree. Paul was trying to show the Galatians that they can't mix law with grace. They are incompatible.
Quote:
Romans 4:13
It was not through law that Abraham and his offspring received the promise that he would be heir of the world, but through the righteousness that comes by faith.
Romans 4:14,15
For if those who live by law are heirs, faith has no value and the promise is worthless, because law brings wrath. And where there is no law there is no transgression.
What UR is offering to the slave is a faith with no value and no promise. The slave (those who attempt justification by observing the law) will never inherit (be the heir) eternal life. Never means never.....unbelief is an eternal sin.
That is just not true. What the law could not do in making Israel righteous Christ did. Christ put the old humanity to death in His death. And since Christ ransomed Ishmael and all slaves, Ishmael and all slaves must be freed from slavery of corruption into the glorious freedom of the children of God (Romans 8).
Paul was not saying that Ishmael will never inherit eternal life. Paul was saying Ishmael will not inherit Jacobs allotment in the land of Israel as a co-sharer in that allotment.
Sarah said to Abraham: Gal 4:30 But what is the scripture saying? Cast out this maid and her son, for by no means shall the son of the maid be enjoying the allotment with the son of the free woman."
Saray was not saying Ishmael will never be saved! Good googly moogly! Where do you come up with this stuff? You are as bad as those ETers who say "all" never means "all."
Quote:
Galatians 2:16
"know that a man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified."
Offering UR to the slave is "diabolical reality" "because by observing the law no one will be justified"
No one will be justified...
No one....never means never
Your translation of Galatians 2:16 sucks bad.
Here it is properly translated:
Gal 2:16 having perceived that a man is not being justified by works of law, except alone through the faith of Christ Jesus, we also believe in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by the faith of Christ and not by works of law, seeing that by works of law shall no flesh at all be justified."
The phrase "faith of Christ Jesus" is in the genitive case showing posession by Christ Jesus. Like "God's Son" is genitive and can be written "Son of God." Thus "faith of Christ Jesus" should not be construed to mean "our faith in Christ Jesus" as your Satanic bible has it.
ETers offering to the slave no hope is a Satanic diabolical lie. Why? Because Christ ransomed all, and that "all" happens to be "all mankind" and that "all mankind" is the same "all mankind" we are to pray for and that same "all mankind" is the same "all mankind" which death entered into in Romans 5:12 which is the same "all mankind" which will be justified and made righteous (Romans 5:18,19).
God doesn't save you, he only offers your an opportunity to save yourself.
God doesn't force you to do what you don't want to do, no. He's paid for your ticket, but you don't have to climb on board if you really insist on staying behind. Down to you.
God doesn't force you to do what you don't want to do, no. He's paid for your ticket, but you don't have to climb on board if you really insist on staying behind. Down to you.
I'll remember that when I see you drowning.. I will ask you to save yourself by getting in the boat and then if you don't I will turn my head and leave you there.. even if it is because you haven't the strength to climb in the boat on your own... after all salvation is (according to you) simply providing the means to be saved not actually doing the saving.
Last edited by katjonjj; 03-04-2010 at 11:29 AM..
Reason: spelling
I'll remember that when I see you drowning.. I will ask you to save yourself by getting in the boat and then if you don't I will turn my head and leave you there.. even if it is because you haven't the strength to climb in the boat on your own... after all salvation is (according to you) simply providing the means to be saved not actually doing the saving.
Boat? It's a train. Anyone can get in. In fact, because Jesus draws everyone to him, it's more matter of getting out.
So ALL are saved and get on the train initially but, then they get off of their own accord? Then they are not saved? So Jesus actually saves them but then stops the train to let them off if they refuse him? How does that work?
So ALL are saved and get on the train initially but, then they get off of their own accord? Then they are not saved? So Jesus actually saves them but then stops the train to let them off if they refuse him? How does that work?
I think my analogy was spot on.
Suit yourself! It's very difficult getting into a boat, especially when your clothes are soaked. But faith is not effort- it's effortless, it's inevitable. It's what everyone has when they hear the gospel. But it does not last, with most of us, because we want heaven, but are not prepared to give up our autonomy.
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