Full Preterism and Hyper Preterism is contrary to UR completely (disciple, worship)

[sciotamicks]

Originally Posted by rodgertutt

You claim that the people who die without getting a "chance" to start trusting in Jesus ceace to exist.

There have been billions of them.

Looks like bad luck to me that they are not among the comparatively few who get a "chance."

How is it that you don't see it as luck?

UR theology is not based on luck like yours appears to be.
Instead it's based on God's determination to save everyone.
And this will occur because of
THE TRUE BASIS OF REDEMPTION – A.P. Adams
The True Basis Of Redemption by A. P. Adams

Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth [is] mine:

But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvelous light:

Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.

For this [is] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people.

For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel

[Ironmaw1776]

Originally Posted by sciotamicks

Can you repost them and cross analyze?

If you mean to ask if i can take a few words from different verses and interpose them within the context of other verses in order to make the bible say what i want ... Sure i can.

But that is not what i asked you. I asked you if you could provide a verse or verses that say that one must be baptized before they physically die in order to be saved ...

Can you or not?

[sciotamicks]

Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776

If you mean to ask if i can take a few words from different verses and interpose them within the context of other verses in order to make the bible say what i want ... Sure i can.

But that is not what i asked you. I asked you if you could provide a verse or verses that say that one must be baptized before they physically die in order to be saved ...

Can you or not?

No...I asked you to repost the verses I posted a few pages back and offer a rebuttal. I posted those such verses....now counter please.

[rodgertutt]

Originally Posted by sciotamicks

Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth [is] mine:

But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvelous light:

Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.

For this [is] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people.

For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel

I have no idea what the above has to do with your claim that under your theology a person is not unlucky if they don't get a "chance" to trust in Jesus before they die. Sure looks like bad luck to me.

UR theology isn't based on whether or not we get a "chance" to trust in Jesus. It's based on the assurance that sooner or later everyone WILL trust in Him and be saved.
ABSOLUTE ASSURANCE IN JESUS CHRIST (not tentmaker)
absolute assurance in jesus christ

[ans57]

Originally Posted by katjonjj

Jer. 31:31w-34

So Jesus saved ALL men which began the New Covenant of Salvation for ALL men.
"everyone will die for his own sin;"
“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
No longer will a man teach his neighbor,
or a man his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
“For I will forgive their wickednessand will remember their sins no more.”



The new covenant... that is what we are in now. Love God and Love your neighbor as yourself.



Anyway.. thought I'd get that out there because to me the relationship between preterism and universalism is so perfect. God wanted to save all men and he did.. in the first century.

You forgot to include "after those days..." Jer. 31:33

Here's another passage from Isaiah 25:7-9
7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over "all" people, and the veil that is spread over all nations.

8 He shall swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off ALL faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off "all the earth": for the LORD hath spoken it.

9 And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.

This was resonated in Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

Blessings...

[Ironmaw1776]

Originally Posted by sciotamicks

No...I asked you to repost the verses I posted a few pages back and offer a rebuttal. I posted those such verses....now counter please.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with [him] through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.


I suppose you were referring to the passage above ...

There is nothing to rebut ... Nowhere in the scriptures above does it say that one must be baptized before one dies in order to be saved, or anything remotely similar to that.

[rodgertutt]

Originally Posted by katjonjj
Jer. 31:31w-34
So Jesus saved ALL men which began the New Covenant of Salvation for ALL men.
"everyone will die for his own sin;"
“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
No longer will a man teach his neighbor,
or a man his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
“For I will forgive their wickednessand will remember their sins no more.”
The new covenant... that is what we are in now. Love God and Love your neighbor as yourself.

Anyway.. thought I'd get that out there because to me the relationship between preterism and universalism is so perfect. God wanted to save all men and He did.. in the first century.

Originally Posted by ans57

You forgot to include "after those days..." Jer. 31:33

Here's another passage from Isaiah 25:7-9
7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over "all" people, and the veil that is spread over all nations.

8 He shall swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off ALL faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off "all the earth": for the LORD hath spoken it.

9 And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.

This was resonated in Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. Blessings...

You mean to say the subject title of this thread is wrong after all.
Oh no, not that!!

[Jerwade]

Originally Posted by rodgertutt

You mean to say the subject title of this thread is wrong after all.
Oh no, not that!!

For it is written.

[sciotamicks]

Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart (kardia - literally the organ itself) that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. - presently the life you are living and breathing

But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with [him] through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
.

Ironmaw, when are you going to get it? Jesus and the apostles never even remotely dreamed of baptism occurring post biological death or even entertained the idea of it. When they spoke of life and death, they spoke of it in the here and now.....raised to life, without dying biologically. The grammar is littered with this kind of syntax and hermeneutic.

Your theory of apokastasis falls very short....an argument from silence.

[sciotamicks]

Originally Posted by rodgertutt

Anyway.. thought I'd get that out there because to me the relationship between preterism and universalism is so perfect. God wanted to save all men and He did.. in the first century.

You mean to say the subject title of this thread is wrong after all.
Oh no, not that!!

Here's a thought rodgertutt......the Bible never even implies salvation of the unregenerate or reprobate after biological death. In all actuality, the passages that are used to support PU (preterist universalism), for the "wicked" are none other than those "in covenant" with God, that are backsliders. Professing Christians as we call them today. Back then, they were called Judaizers. Second death has nothing to do with those "outside" of covenant. Neither does the "wicked" "idolaters" "sorcerers" or any other term used to personify someone wicked in nature. These were labels that were given to the Jews solely, that filtered themselves through the early church of the first century, and slipped those weak in faith back into their old garments. Most, if not at all times, when Gentiles were discussed in the OT and NT, they were symbolized as various animals and fish.
Rise, kill and eat...Peter.

Study hard.