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Two of my most treasured states! This one is definitely a "too close to call," thus I won't vote.
MA has the edge on original settlement and the American Revolution as compared to PA (although PA of course played a critical role); PA arguably has more post-revolutionary significance compared to MA (with MA obviously being highly significant).
Too many firsts and significant historic sites/structures to count in each state, that's for sure.
I agree. Both the most historic states, and both have contributed an indispensable amount of culture, history, inventions, knowledge, etc. to American history.
A majority of this thread is nitpicking, I hope people keep it civil.
The GA vs PA thread went off the rails due to GA posters on an ego trip, I at least hope MA posters realize how equally important Philadelphia and Pennsylvania were compared to Boston and Massachusetts.
The GA vs PA thread went off the rails due to GA posters on an ego trip, I at least hope MA posters realize how equally important Philadelphia and Pennsylvania were compared to Boston and Massachusetts.
And yes, I forgot Lowell is known for being the birthplace of the Industrial Revolution
And that's why Massachusetts should "win" that category. I think people are reading it as "industrialization" rather than "industrial revolution," the latter of which is all about setting setting the country on the course of industrialization rather than industrializing the most.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpomp
Wouldn't the industrial revolution go to Pennsylvania considering Philadelphia was essential workshop of the world during that time?, and you can't forget Pittsburgh.
This was a designation (applying to Philadelphia specifically) that came about in the 20th Century, more than a century after the Industrial Revolution began in Britain.
Quote:
Although the first use of the label “Workshop of the World†cannot be precisely determined, by the first decade of the twentieth century, the phrase was regularly attached to Philadelphia in journals and books and in the pronouncements of business and civic leaders. However, the success and prosperity that marked Philadelphia industry crested in the 1920s when declines occurred in textile and garment manufacture and in shipbuilding—although new production of radios and electrical appliances sustained employment.
Just to follow up on some interesting Pennsylvania firsts. I know a couple have been debated, but I've tried to be specific:
- First US stock exchange (Philadelphia, 1790)
- First US medical school (UPenn, est. 1765)
- First US theater (Walnut St. theater, est. 1809)
- First public hospital (Pennsylvania Hospital, Phila., est 1752)
- First US Mint (Philadelphia, est. 1792)
- First US toll road (PA Turnpike, est. 1794)
- First US art museum and school (PAFA, est. 1805)
- First US pharmacy school (Philadelphia, est. 1821)
- First Republican convention (Philadelphia, 1856)
- First World's Fair in the US (Philadelphia, 1876)
- First US zoo (Philadelphia, est. 1859)
- First state law to abolish slavery (1780)
- First suspension bridge (Uniontown, 1801)
- First state with an elected African-American female state rep (1938)
- First organized gay rights protest (Philadelphia, 1965)
- First US public water system (Bethlehem, 1755)
- First movie theater (Pittsburgh, 1905)
- First drive-in gas station (Pittsburgh, 1913)
Significant discoveries:
- Polio vaccine (Pittsburgh, 1955)
- First successfully drilled oil well (Titusville, 1859)
Just to follow up on some interesting Pennsylvania firsts. I know a couple have been debated, but I've tried to be specific:
- First US stock exchange (Philadelphia, 1790)
- First US medical school (UPenn, est. 1765)
- First US theater (Walnut St. theater, est. 1809)
- First public hospital (Pennsylvania Hospital, Phila., est 1752)
- First US Mint (Philadelphia, est. 1792)
- First US toll road (PA Turnpike, est. 1794)
- First US art museum and school (PAFA, est. 1805)
- First US pharmacy school (Philadelphia, est. 1821)
- First Republican convention (Philadelphia, 1856)
- First World's Fair in the US (Philadelphia, 1876)
- First US zoo (Philadelphia, est. 1859)
- First state law to abolish slavery (1780)
- First suspension bridge (Uniontown, 1801)
- First state with an elected African-American female state rep (1938)
- First organized gay rights protest (Philadelphia, 1965)
- First US public water system (Bethlehem, 1755)
- First movie theater (Pittsburgh, 1905)
- First drive-in gas station (Pittsburgh, 1913)
Significant discoveries:
- Polio vaccine (Pittsburgh, 1955)
- First successfully drilled oil well (Titusville, 1859)
I think that "first toll road" would be the Lancaster Turnpike.
However, the Pennsylvania Turnpike (1940) is generally regarded as the nation's first superhighway.
I would also call the revolution a draw. More of the action took place in Massachusetts, but Philadelphia was essentially the colonies capital and most important governmental city during that time period, especially the years immediately prior to the Revolution. It rivaled London in terms of power and influence during those years.
I've heard people say this before and I wonder what basis exists for saying it.
Quote:
From approximately three-quarters of a million people in 1760, London continued a strong pattern of growth through the last four decades of the eighteenth century. In 1801, when the first reliable modern census was taken, greater London recorded 1,096,784 souls; rising to a little over 1.4 million inhabitants by 1815. No single decade in this period witnessed less than robust population growth.
By contrast, Philadelphia and its surrounding areas had only 87,000 people in 1810. No American metropolitan area even had 1 million people until 1860 (NYC).
No American city rivaled London (or Paris) in power and influence at any time during the 18th century. Not even close. Industrialization came to America relatively late; Britain (and by extension London) was already the world's industrial powerhouse by the mid to late 1700s. American colonists purchased all of their goods from Britain.
Not to mention the American colonies were not that significant in the grand scheme of things. What gets lost in teaching the American Revolution in American schools was that Britain was waging war against multiple European powers, including a war right after the Revolution against this guy they called Napoleon who some say made some "meh" contributions to world history. We were not at the top of their priority list, and if we had been, they could have ended the Revolution in a month. There was no way any city in some backwater colonies could rival any European capital.
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