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I think you will agree that a lot of my thinking is idealistic and more hopeful than realistic. I am aware of that.
I did not teach my daughters to get along. I taught them about their personal agencies. How they were on one level individuals but part of a community on another. In that community there would always be people who were not to be trusted, to be watched and dealt with harshly if need be.
And my thinking (as unconventional as it might sound) is actually realistic, because I was digging into this subject for quite some time.
So if you like what you see in Islamic countries in terms of the "social achievements," you have to get to business and start enforcing Catholicism in your society, starting from your own household. There is no way around it.
Because what you see ( and like) in Islamic countries, was not achieved with the help of the "personal agencies" and "personal examples."
It was achieved by the means of theology - public lashing, public executions, stoning and so on.
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Once again though I will say rightly that the Muslim world is no worse than any other. We're just Great Apes that fell out of a tree at the end of the day.
In the big picture I see nothing changing.
Except for you can't back this up with anything particular, other than your own thoughts.
Me - I present plenty of poofs to back up my statements.
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If the 2 great tribes cannot leave one another alone then humanity will continue the path it is on.
This is not a new thing.
That's how it's seen from the US yet again.
In reality, Tadjiks (the second biggest ethnic group in Afganinstan) are simply not all that "tribal" as you'd like to believe.
This is their capital, Dushanbe, back in Soviet times when Tadjikistan was under the Russians.
So what you see in Afghanistan, is not in essence a "tribal disagreement," but a conflict between Arabic culture that penetrated the region during the early Islamic conquests and enforced by certain tribes, and the original cultures of the region.
And this conflict is brewing all over the territories of the former "Greater Persia," that "sectarian violence" in Iraq including.
The Arab conquest of Persia back in history ( and the subsequent islamization of it) is the ultimate source of it all.
...and now - speaking of the devil.
This is already Dagestan, (region next to Chechnya,) in Russian Federation.
What you see at the beginning of this video taken in one of the remote districts, is the deputy director, checking whether the girls are wearing the headscarves at the entrance to school.
No headscarf - the girl is not allowed to attend the lessons.
Sure enough, the report has been sent to the Dagestan's authorities, protesting the event.
Since Dagestan is part of the Russian Federation, the deputy director was forced to resign.
Because the government in Moscow, ( although leaving the decisions to the regional authorities according to their "cultural specifics,") still provides them with the GUIDELINES to what is reasonable, school uniforms including. ( They suppose to be "business-like" attire, and to be of a "secular nature.")
Therefore if girls want to attend schools in Islamic headgear, it's fine, but in no way it can be pushed as a requirement.
( And that's what you see at 1:58 - it's a "mixed bag" among the Dagestani girls in schools.)
Some schools in "Russia proper" however, saw the issue differently, and prohibited the wearing of any Islamic headgear by girls.
Which immediately brought an anger from some Islamic zealots; ( at 2:31) "How dare, you don't respect them as people? You don't respect their religion, their children? My wife is Russian so I am not anti-Russian, but don't you understand, that you Russians DIVIDE US?!"
This particular question ( regarding hijab wearing) has been addressed even to Putin personally back in 2013. (At 3:03.)
Putin said that he saw nothing good in wearing the hijabs in schools.
"There are of course some "national specialties in some of our republics, but what you've said here, is not the "national specialty," but demonstration of certain perception of religion. In our country, in its muslim regions, there was never such tradition."
He-he.
I can see he was choosing words very, very carefully, in order to not have complications with *Ramzan Kadyrov* dear of the near-by Chechnya.
Overall Islam OF COURSE will always try to make the inroads back to the areas it held sway back in history, starting with baby steps, like in that remote district of Dagestan.
Russians are well aware of it, and what part that *innocent hijab" plays in it all.
The Europeans figured it out with time as well, after the Russians. The wearing of hijab in public schools became prohibited in a number of European countries by now.
In former Soviet "stans,", where the penetration of radical Islam is still a danger, ( Turkmenistan, Tadjikistan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan) wearing of hijab is prohibited in the public offices/agencies as well.
In Kazakhstan the fine for the wearing of hijab in the public office is 50 minimal salaries.
Because what you see ( and like) in Islamic countries, was not achieved with the help of the "personal agencies" and "personal examples."
It was achieved by the means of theology - public lashing, public executions, stoning and so on.[quote]
Watch out. I'm all for public canings, chopping off fingers and branding rapists with a large red R on their foreheads. Drug dealers should be shot on the spot too. Need I go on? And it's not that I like things like that nor do I like Islam or any religion.
I would thank you not to be putting words in my mouth.
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Except for you can't back this up with anything particular, other than your own thoughts.
Me - I present plenty of poofs to back up my statements.
I've seen nothing from you that would convince me that Islam is worse than any other religion and Muslims are worse people than any others. That goes for their extremists too. A suicide bomber doesn't hesitate to kill innocents, true. I will point you to the bombing of North Korea where millions of innocents died. I suggest you look into some of the atrocities in Americas past. Believe me, its right up there with the Nazis.
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That's how it's seen from the US yet again.
In reality, Tadjiks (the second biggest ethnic group in Afganinstan) are simply not all that "tribal" as you'd like to believe.
This is their capital, Dushanbe, back in Soviet times when Tadjikistan was under the Russians.
So what you see in Afghanistan, is not in essence a "tribal disagreement," but a conflict between Arabic culture that penetrated the region during the early Islamic conquests and enforced by certain tribes, and the original cultures of the region.
And this conflict is brewing all over the territories of the former "Greater Persia," that "sectarian violence" in Iraq including.
The Arab conquest of Persia back in history ( and the subsequent islamization of it) is the ultimate source of it all.
I have read a little of the history. i think you are accurate and I think there are going to be problems because of this.
Some schools in "Russia proper" however, saw the issue differently, and prohibited the wearing of any Islamic headgear by girls.
Which immediately brought an anger from some Islamic zealots; ( at 2:31) "How dare, you don't respect them as people? You don't respect their religion, their children? My wife is Russian so I am not anti-Russian, but don't you understand, that you Russians DIVIDE US?!"
This particular question ( regarding hijab wearing) has been addressed even to Putin personally back in 2013. (At 3:03.)
Putin said that he saw nothing good in wearing the hijabs in schools.
I do not agree with this. If a girl wants to wear a hijab to school she should be allowed to. I see them every single day worn openly in public. Where I would draw a line is when the girls cease to come to school for whatever reason.
I think the whole post is simply an expression of your own brand of radicalism shining through and what the Europeans did, the same. You hate the religion so much it clouds your brains mechanisms of logic.
Watch out. I'm all for public canings, chopping off fingers and branding rapists with a large red R on their foreheads. Drug dealers should be shot on the spot too. Need I go on? And it's not that I like things like that nor do I like Islam or any religion.
I would thank you not to be putting words in my mouth.
I am not sure what words I was putting in your mouth exactly, but talking about the public executions, lashing and stoning, I was referring first of all to the treatment of women for "adulteries" ( real or perceived,) since you indicated that you liked to see what came out of it all.
I don't remember "branding rapists with a large letter R" at all in Islam for a number of reasons, and your love of idea of "chopping fingers" for theft ( because that's what it used for under the Sharia law) makes me cringe to be honest. ( You'd be cringing too I suspect, when zeroing in on this aspect.)
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I've seen nothing from you that would convince me that Islam is worse than any other religion and Muslims are worse people than any others.
I've provided the proofs, but that doesn't mean that they'd make you automatically change your opinion.
That I understand.
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That goes for their extremists too. A suicide bomber doesn't hesitate to kill innocents, true. I will point you to the bombing of North Korea where millions of innocents died. I suggest you look into some of the atrocities in Americas past. Believe me, its right up there with the Nazis.
It's not my job to decimate America.
I'll leave it all up to Americans to decide what's good, what's bad and what's ugly.
The part of the world I'm following now, (with Islam advancing on all fronts,) is much older than America itself.
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I have read a little of the history. i think you are accurate and I think there are going to be problems because of this.
At least it might explain much better why Russians are not in a rush to recognize Taliban as the great "stabilizer of Afghanistan" ( as it was widely expected with American departure,) and why they signed the deal with the Indians for now, who are weary of the spread of the radical Islam in the area as well.
There are more fine details coming in as we speak.
I do not agree with this. If a girl wants to wear a hijab to school she should be allowed to. I see them every single day worn openly in public. Where I would draw a line is when the girls cease to come to school for whatever reason.
I think the whole post is simply an expression of your own brand of radicalism shining through and what the Europeans did, the same. You hate the religion so much it clouds your brains mechanisms of logic.
It's the other way around.
My hatred of this religion gives me a clear head to analyze the crafty ways Islam is easing its way in people's lives.
That innocent-looking girl willing to wear hijab to school is indoctrinated from the young age on.
But you wouldn't suspect it as a ticking bomb, until more of these girls will be missing from schools all together.
So no, I am no fool and I keep on watching closely the developments in this respect.
My hatred of this religion gives me a clear head to analyze the crafty ways Islam is easing its way in people's lives.
That innocent-looking girl willing to wear hijab to school is indoctrinated from the young age on.
But you wouldn't suspect it as a ticking bomb, until more of these girls will be missing from schools all together.
So no, I am no fool and I keep on watching closely the developments in this respect.
And that's exactly how I feel.
I think the “war” against hijabs is kinda futile since women don’t make any major decisions in the Islamic world. So I don’t see exactly what the point is to put that much pressure on trying to secularise Muslim women while ignoring the men, this will just lead to a deadly outcome where conservative men will lash out on the progressive women. I think so long as they are showing their faces it should be fine. Historically Russians have always worn head scarves too, so I don’t see any major issues. I think the focus should be on the men and breaking the boundary between the sexes such as the promotion of mixed-sex sports which are team based sports where both teams have an equal number of men and women such as a male female pair in tennis.
They're exploring paying India for the rights. They used to pay Pakistan until the middle of the decade to stage terrorism and counterterrorism operations. They were kicked out for recruiting fighters for the Pakistani Taliban (TTP) and other groups.
Pakistan was also a big supplier of fighters to the US efforts in Syria until 2015.
China seems much more worried about terrorism now. These groups are now more spread out and their sponsors have an incentive to ramp up the effort as an insurgency without the US and Afghan military sharing the battlefield with the Taliban.
I think the “war” against hijabs is kinda futile since women don’t make any major decisions in the Islamic world. So I don’t see exactly what the point is to put that much pressure on trying to secularise Muslim women while ignoring the men, this will just lead to a deadly outcome where conservative men will lash out on the progressive women.
It's not about "secularizing muslim women" Grega.
As I already explained before - it's all about MEN.
Obviously they are the ones standing behind this wearing of hijab by women, ( even though some of these silly women think it's their own decision.)
In reality, in Islamic societies these customs are created by men and for men's convenience of course.
So when the Russians discouraged wearing this headgear back in Soviet days, the message was clearly intended for the muslim MEN, that their ways are not accepted any longer. And they are the ones that fume behind the scene until today, when the Europeans sent them the same message.
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I think so long as they are showing their faces it should be fine. Historically Russians have always worn head scarves too, so I don’t see any major issues.
Historically Russian women wear the scarves to church, covering their hair as a sign of modesty, required by the Orthodoxy ( after all the Orthodoxy is close to Catholicism, in spite of the schism of the 1054 and certain ecclesiastical differences.)
Then I've noticed the peasantry ( in Ukraine in particular) wear them while working in the fields, ( I guess it helps to get protected from the sun?) plus the factory workers often use them ( to keep the hair out of the way may be?)
But it's never a case in schools/Universities or other places of work.
So it's a totally different story comparably to muslims, and of course Russians do see it as an issue, because they know what hijabs are all about, and what they manifest.
And this goes against Russian culture/beliefs/religion.
They know what danger radical Islam carries, and it usually trails not far behind the burkas/hijabs.
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I think the focus should be on the men and breaking the boundary between the sexes such as the promotion of mixed-sex sports which are team based sports where both teams have an equal number of men and women such as a male female pair in tennis.
He-he, "promotions" don't work when it comes to Islamic community.
When you deal with the authoritarian system such as Islam, only another authoritarian system can fight it successfully.
So back in Soviet times, Russians were not "promoting" anything - they were simply making muslim women to be in the workforce and out of the house, mingling with men and non-muslims.
And no hijab wearing for girls from the early age on. ( Not to mention military draft for all 18 year old muslim males in the "melting pot" of the Soviet Army.)
This did the trick to subdue Islam.
I already posted the video of Tadjikistan's capital Dushanbe, and this is the capital of the neighboring Uzbekistan - Tashkent back in Soviet days. ( It was completely rebuilt after the major earth quake that totaled the city back in 196(6)? The whole USSR was rebuilding it, so you could see the whole blocks built by different republics, saying "happy wishes from Belorussians" or Ukrainians, or the Moscovites, and so on.
( and here - pay attention, at 0:47 - that's the pre-revolutionary Tashkent, with all of its hijab-wearing. So it used to look much more like Afghanistan, if anything.)
Uzbeks are yet another ethnic group that is not happy with the Taliban/Arab way of life in Afghanistan, as much as Tadjiks.
You can see why.
Last edited by erasure; 09-16-2021 at 01:32 PM..
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