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Yea Boston’s neighborhoods are almost all mixed use except for 1/2 extremely Su Ian pockets of Hyde Park.
This is because Boston’s neighborhoods are more like boroughs. Each “borough” was founded and settled in the 1600s seeing peak development from 1880-1920. So they each had to develop their own town halls and commercial districts organically. They weren’t Carter to the automobile. Most places like Charlestown, Roxbury, West Roxbury , Dorchester were annexed into Boston in the mid 1800s, Hyde Park was last to join in 1912. Cambridge and Brookline refused annexation.
Do the city is dotted with “squares” that usually aren’t actually square but rather are shopping hubs of some sort. A lot of functional stuff and not many abandoned storefronts in Boston. But the outer areas do lack for sit down restaurants and entertainment.
Having been all over ward 7 and 8 they are certainly heavily residential compared to Toxbury and Dorchester-even Hyde Park or Roslindale. They’re more orderly and greener but the commercial parts as are are really dead and there are more black addicts in DC than Boston and they like to chill on commercial thoroughfares like Good Hope Road, Benning Road etc. which drags the vibe down. In Boston this is much more limited. In general Ward 7/8 are less variable than a comparable area in Boston-ethnically and development wise. It feels like they’re easier to organize politically as a result. It’s also more approachable for a transplant with its grid, predictability, black ethnoculture. Boston is a lot more granular and doesn’t really have anywhere as cheap as wards 7-8.
This type of stuff and the ethnic diversity is part of what makes Boston’s basic functionality and culture feel pretty close to New York’s...and it’s what drives up RE costs
Last edited by BostonBornMassMade; 01-07-2021 at 04:13 AM..
Yea Boston’s neighborhoods are almost all mixed use except for 1/2 extremely Su Ian pockets of Hyde Park.
This is because Boston’s neighborhoods are more like boroughs. Each “borough” was founded and settled in the 1600s seeing peak development from 1880-1920. So they each had to develop their own town halls and commercial districts organically. They weren’t Carter to the automobile. Most places like Charlestown, Roxbury, West Roxbury , Dorchester were annexed into Boston in the mid 1800s, Hyde Park was last to join in 1912. Cambridge and Brookline refused annexation.
Do the city is dotted with “squares” that usually aren’t actually square but rather are shopping hubs of some sort. A lot of functional stuff and not many abandoned storefronts in Boston. But the outer areas do lack for sit down restaurants and entertainment.
Having been all over ward 7 and 8 they are certainly heavily residential compared to Toxbury and Dorchester-even Hyde Park or Roslindale. They’re more orderly and greener but the commercial parts as are are really dead and there are more black addicts in DC than Boston and they like to chill on commercial thoroughfares like Good Hope Road, Benning Road etc. which drags the vibe down. In Boston this is much more limited. In general Ward 7/8 are less variable than a comparable area in Boston-ethnically and development wise. It feels like they’re easier to organize politically as a result. It’s also more approachable for a transplant with its grid, predictability, black ethnoculture. Boston is a lot more granular and doesn’t really have anywhere as cheap as wards 7-8.
This type of stuff and the ethnic diversity is part of what makes Boston’s basic functionality and culture feel pretty close to New York’s...and it’s what drives up RE costs
Yeah, other than Historic Anacostia and a small strip in Congress Heights, Ward 7 and Ward 8 don’t have commercial strips like those above. They are definitely needed though. It looks like Boston should have no problem having tons of African American restaurants, lounges, etc. based on all those corridors. I wonder how different Ward 7 and Ward 8 would be if it did have that urban form?
The development in Ward 7 and Ward 8 is obviously on a completely different scale than anything in those neighborhoods around Boston. All of the buildings are between 9-12 stories with office/residential above retail. The feel will be different, but I still like those corridors and squares in Boston. Very nice!
Is Marvins black owned? Never been during the day lol, so I’ve only seen it as a club/lounge not in restaurant form but it’s definitely a sit down spot.
Here some of the work being done in Boston to open things up for minority restauranteurs:
Yeah, other than Historic Anacostia and a small strip in Congress Heights, Ward 7 and Ward 8 don’t have commercial strips like those above. They are definitely needed though. It looks like Boston should have no problem having tons of African American restaurants, lounges, etc. based on all those corridors. I wonder how different Ward 7 and Ward 8 would be if it did have that urban form?
The development in Ward 7 and Ward 8 is obviously on a completely different scale than anything in those neighborhoods around Boston. All of the buildings are between 9-12 stories with office/residential above retail. The feel will be different, but I still like those corridors and squares in Boston. Very nice!
Several of the places I showed you are either home to black-owned venues now or will be home to more soon. Notably, MLK Boulevard where Distict7 Tavern an African Americanis now located next to the dollar country, named after our Congressional District, it replaced the shuttered Sonny Walkers and was named in part because Ayanna's advocacy got them their liquor license. But one block north an abandoned brick warehouse is being converted into residential with restaurant space on the ground level. Uphams corner is also getting a restaurant that mixes West African with Southeast Asian (owned by a Ghanaian and Cambodian) in an abandoned 1920s comfort station. Across the street from a furniture store, hardware store, computer store, laundromat, foot locker, bank, metro PCS and right in front of a bus stop.
Yea its nice... its one reason when people are like the Boston MSA is "only 8% black" I kind of roll my eyes because, as you can see- there are several self-contained worlds in the Boston area, you don't have to go much further than where you live to access everything, there are a few malls and major shopping districts downtown too. For the most part when youre in Boston or you're town you don't have to go very far, hence the term "townie". Whereas in DC things are much more "metropolized" and less balkanized. There I found myself nauseous from driving laps around the beltway all the time. If you think that's how life would be in Bosotn you'd be very wrong. Its much more hyperlocalized than more modern metros and frankly segregated with diverse vs non-diverse areas.
The Boston metro is sprawling and low density/rural it includes places in New Hampshire100 miles from here. How would that have any impact on my life if I'm living in Fields Corner or Roslindale? If I'm black, and I'm from Boston, and I'm driving 100 miles from Boston... I'm more likely to be headed to Hartford than Wolfeboro, NH :eyeroll:
When you take the core ~1.8 million inside and continuously inside and along 128.. the city is about 15% black (Boston shudra has an image/table on it somewhere). And keep in mind all these neighborhoods have relatively ample employment and Boston is the nonprofit and hospital king so they're scattered in virtually every corner of the city.
The middle class and successful black Bostonians I knew worked in:
Chestnut Hill (Internal Auditor for Boston College)
Longwood Medical area(Healthcare caseworker)
Dedham (Project overseer for I-95 lane expansion, state job)
Hyde Park (Top Executive withinDYS/ Social Services)
Roxbury (my job is remote and its based in Nubian Square, as is Boston Public School Headquarters)
Cambridge (professors)
Dorchester (Codman Square Health Center)
Norfolk (HR executive)
etc. not really downtown where the finance and tech is. Most local Bostonians are commuting to downtown unless they're in tech or pharma which black Bostonians really aren't.
There are definitely reasons that despite its reputation and all the grief you get from black people outside of Boston that people live there. There is a reason that we moved there in the first place, that many of us stay and that people continue to move there despite the stigma. You can see some of that in the street views.
Yea it's gonna be different in DC. DC is a faster growth city with more of a uniform feel but still cosmopolitan and dense. I think that the commercial aspect will be muted a bit because many of the stores in Boston have deep customer loyalty and are somewhat niche and based on personal relationships and word of mouth. DC is trying to recreate an authentic mixed-use commercial feel but I think that gets harder every year as the internet becomes more powerful. And you also have the fact that many f those new residents will be higher income than the ones you see in those areas of Boston. DC is already a higher-income city and will attract fewer first-gen immigrants and far more high-earning professionals who shop online and value physical experience more than shopping. Eventually, Boston will upzone those 1 story shops. Any 1 story shop in Boston probably had 2-3 stories on top of it beforehand and they were eliminated after the 1930s due to some weird local trend/zoning reform. They've already begun the process: https://www.universalhub.com/2018/ro...proval-add-two https://www.universalhub.com/2020/roslindale-square-getting-its-upper-floors-back
DC is going to be more residential in Ward 7/8 for a long time but it needs any commercial activity. Not a ton of quality shopping easily accessible to them IMO. There's Tanger Outlets and Crystal City but those are relatively farther than we have to travel in Boston and they're not as immersive/big as our nearby malls. The retail shopping in DC is limited compared to Boston...but the restaurant and nightlife scene is much better, especially black nightlife-if anything its open an hour later, its more consistent and a little more refined.
Boston-native Janey has served on the City Council representing Roxbury since 2017, and was elected City Council president in 2019. During her tenure, she has championed causes related to education and social justice. While in office she hatched a deal with the Walsh Administration on an overhaul of how the city awards licenses to businesses in the city’s burgeoning marijuana industry, with an aim toward benefiting communities of color, by creating a Boston Cannabis Board. She has also called for a return to the days when Boston’s school committee was elected, rather than appointed, a proposal that recent polling suggests has support from a majority of Bostonians. She also lent her support to christening Nubian Square, the section of Roxbury once known as Dudley Square. Janey was also one of five city councilors who voted against Mayor Marty Walsh’s budget this year, joining her colleagues in calling for deeper cuts to the city’s police budget amid a wave of protests following the police killing of George Floyd. The budget ultimately passed 8-5.
Last edited by BostonBornMassMade; 01-07-2021 at 02:03 PM..
Boston-native Janey has served on the City Council representing Roxbury since 2017, and was elected City Council president in 2019. During her tenure, she has championed causes related to education and social justice. While in office she hatched a deal with the Walsh Administration on an overhaul of how the city awards licenses to businesses in the city’s burgeoning marijuana industry, with an aim toward benefiting communities of color, by creating a Boston Cannabis Board. She has also called for a return to the days when Boston’s school committee was elected, rather than appointed, a proposal that recent polling suggests has support from a majority of Bostonians. She also lent her support to christening Nubian Square, the section of Roxbury once known as Dudley Square. Janey was also one of five city councilors who voted against Mayor Marty Walsh’s budget this year, joining her colleagues in calling for deeper cuts to the city’s police budget amid a wave of protests following the police killing of George Floyd. The budget ultimately passed 8-5.
Wow. I would of thought Boston already had a 1st Black mayor decade or so ago. Congrats to her.
Boston-native Janey has served on the City Council representing Roxbury since 2017, and was elected City Council president in 2019. During her tenure, she has championed causes related to education and social justice. While in office she hatched a deal with the Walsh Administration on an overhaul of how the city awards licenses to businesses in the city’s burgeoning marijuana industry, with an aim toward benefiting communities of color, by creating a Boston Cannabis Board. She has also called for a return to the days when Boston’s school committee was elected, rather than appointed, a proposal that recent polling suggests has support from a majority of Bostonians. She also lent her support to christening Nubian Square, the section of Roxbury once known as Dudley Square. Janey was also one of five city councilors who voted against Mayor Marty Walsh’s budget this year, joining her colleagues in calling for deeper cuts to the city’s police budget amid a wave of protests following the police killing of George Floyd. The budget ultimately passed 8-5.
Several of the places I showed you are either home to black-owned venues now or will be home to more soon. Notably, MLK Boulevard where Distict7 Tavern an African Americanis now located next to the dollar country, named after our Congressional District, it replaced the shuttered Sonny Walkers and was named in part because Ayanna's advocacy got them their liquor license. But one block north an abandoned brick warehouse is being converted into residential with restaurant space on the ground level. Uphams corner is also getting a restaurant that mixes West African with Southeast Asian (owned by a Ghanaian and Cambodian) in an abandoned 1920s comfort station. Across the street from a furniture store, hardware store, computer store, laundromat, foot locker, bank, metro PCS and right in front of a bus stop.
Yea its nice... its one reason when people are like the Boston MSA is "only 8% black" I kind of roll my eyes because, as you can see- there are several self-contained worlds in the Boston area, you don't have to go much further than where you live to access everything, there are a few malls and major shopping districts downtown too. For the most part when youre in Boston or you're town you don't have to go very far, hence the term "townie". Whereas in DC things are much more "metropolized" and less balkanized. There I found myself nauseous from driving laps around the beltway all the time. If you think that's how life would be in Bosotn you'd be very wrong. Its much more hyperlocalized than more modern metros and frankly segregated with diverse vs non-diverse areas.
The Boston metro is sprawling and low density/rural it includes places in New Hampshire100 miles from here. How would that have any impact on my life if I'm living in Fields Corner or Roslindale? If I'm black, and I'm from Boston, and I'm driving 100 miles from Boston... I'm more likely to be headed to Hartford than Wolfeboro, NH :eyeroll:
When you take the core ~1.8 million inside and continuously inside and along 128.. the city is about 15% black (Boston shudra has an image/table on it somewhere). And keep in mind all these neighborhoods have relatively ample employment and Boston is the nonprofit and hospital king so they're scattered in virtually every corner of the city.
The middle class and successful black Bostonians I knew worked in:
Chestnut Hill (Internal Auditor for Boston College)
Longwood Medical area(Healthcare caseworker)
Dedham (Project overseer for I-95 lane expansion, state job)
Hyde Park (Top Executive withinDYS/ Social Services)
Roxbury (my job is remote and its based in Nubian Square, as is Boston Public School Headquarters)
Cambridge (professors)
Dorchester (Codman Square Health Center)
Norfolk (HR executive)
etc. not really downtown where the finance and tech is. Most local Bostonians are commuting to downtown unless they're in tech or pharma which black Bostonians really aren't.
There are definitely reasons that despite its reputation and all the grief you get from black people outside of Boston that people live there. There is a reason that we moved there in the first place, that many of us stay and that people continue to move there despite the stigma. You can see some of that in the street views.
Yea it's gonna be different in DC. DC is a faster growth city with more of a uniform feel but still cosmopolitan and dense. I think that the commercial aspect will be muted a bit because many of the stores in Boston have deep customer loyalty and are somewhat niche and based on personal relationships and word of mouth. DC is trying to recreate an authentic mixed-use commercial feel but I think that gets harder every year as the internet becomes more powerful. And you also have the fact that many f those new residents will be higher income than the ones you see in those areas of Boston. DC is already a higher-income city and will attract fewer first-gen immigrants and far more high-earning professionals who shop online and value physical experience more than shopping. Eventually, Boston will upzone those 1 story shops. Any 1 story shop in Boston probably had 2-3 stories on top of it beforehand and they were eliminated after the 1930s due to some weird local trend/zoning reform. They've already begun the process: https://www.universalhub.com/2018/ro...proval-add-two https://www.universalhub.com/2020/roslindale-square-getting-its-upper-floors-back
DC is going to be more residential in Ward 7/8 for a long time but it needs any commercial activity. Not a ton of quality shopping easily accessible to them IMO. There's Tanger Outlets and Crystal City but those are relatively farther than we have to travel in Boston and they're not as immersive/big as our nearby malls. The retail shopping in DC is limited compared to Boston...but the restaurant and nightlife scene is much better, especially black nightlife-if anything its open an hour later, its more consistent and a little more refined.
Retail all over the nation is moving towards a food and beverage focus. Grocery stores, food halls, sit-down restaurants with bars, and some clothing stores will be the focus. There is nothing in Boston already built outside of downtown Boston or Seaport with the scale of what is being built in downtown Ward 7 in DC so they really aren’t apples to apples.
Are there any subdistrict CBD areas at the scale of the coming Ward 7 downtown in DC with a majority African American middle class population living in the residential housing stock across America? This area will have over 1 million sq. feet of office added to the over 200,000 sq. feet of office already there. That’s 1.2 million sq. feet of office space. It will also add over 3,500 units to the thousands of units already there now. Total housing units will surpass 5,000 units based on what is proposed and already there. The amount of retail is unprecedented for an area way outside the urban core at 364,000 sq. feet which will be added to retail already there along Minnesota Avenue. You have been to this corridor so you know there are substantial infill development opportunities along this corridor in addition to what has already been proposed.
The demographics are still up for debate because we don’t know who will move to this area. I think it will be a middle class black enclave like those seen in Prince George’s county, but we will see. Again, this is definitely an amazing case study.
Last edited by MDAllstar; 01-08-2021 at 05:48 AM..
Retail all over the nation is moving towards a food and beverage focus. Grocery stores, food halls, sit-down restaurants with bars, and some clothing stores will be the focus. There is nothing in Boston already built outside of downtown Boston or Seaport with the scale of what is being built in downtown Ward 7 in DC so they really aren’t apples to apples.
Are there any subdistrict CBD areas at the scale of the coming Ward 7 downtown in DC with a majority African American middle class population living in the residential housing stock across America? This area will have over 1 million sq. feet of office added to the over 200,000 sq. feet of office already there. That’s 1.2 million sq. feet of office space. It will also add over 3,500 units to the thousands of units already there now. Total housing units will surpass 5,000 units based on what is proposed and already there. The amount of retail is unprecedented for an area way outside the urban core at 364,000 sq. feet which will be added to retail already there along Minnesota Avenue. You have been to this corridor so you know there are substantial infill development opportunities along this corridor in addition to what has already been proposed.
The demographics are still up for debate because we don’t know who will move to this area. I think it will be a middle class black enclave like those seen in Prince George’s county, but we will see. Again, this is definitely an amazing case study.
Yea I think it all be a mix of African American and white in roughly equivalent number or. Umbers that reflect DCs current demographics which (44% black 37% white) but it’s going to be higher income people black or white. More so than the people who live in the areas I showed you and white than the existing neighborhoods in ward 7/8. All that office space is also going to generate a very different type of foot traffic. With all that being said I don’t think there are comparative areas that are majority black. The scale of the projects make me nervous because It will be hard to manage the demography and I’m not sure the demand for urbanity is there in the black middle class, there’s certainly some-but boy is that a lot of units. Nubian Ascends has this issue to a lesser degree because everyone involved is black or Latino and it’s all affordable and far fewer units. I worry Black people will hold on to the stigma of those areas more than white urban pioneers.
It’s not a DC thing I just get generally wary of these massive new developments with the blander architecture being plopped into existing areas. The closest thing to this in the northeast would be Dorchester Bay City and Downtown Brooklyn. But they’re definitely not majority black. DC is very special in that regard
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