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I would agree with Philadelphia. Great bones, awesome transit, somewhat "affordable" compared to NYC, Boston, DC. Just some rough areas hold it back a bit.
As for smaller cities, I'd say a rust belt city like Milwaukee. Rarely on the national scene, but great bones, affordable, lively and super close to Chicago.
I hadn't heard that about New Orleans. It's pretty dense in many areas.
There are many people on this website that will say it's suburban outside of the core neighorboods around downtown.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duderino
Yes, for sure. I suppose there's some folks out there I suppose that are living under a rock and don't recognize Philadelphia as major urban core, but I'm guessing they are few and far between as the city has gotten much more exposure as it has revitalized over the past 20 years.
You picked some good candidates. I'd also add Baltimore, Cincinnati, and St. Louis.
Even before the exposure, Philadelphia was always a major urban center. Like, ever since the country was founded Philly has been a major urban center.
Quote:
Originally Posted by samuelphilip
When I think of urbanity and urban living, I tend to include if the city is can be lived car free. Philly is a city where all of your needs, not just daily ones can be done without a car. Does Tacoma fulfill that criteria?
We're talking about underrated urbanity, in the North American context, I don't think being able to do everything without a car is fair for this thread because then it becomes a thread about the most urban cities, and we have enough Boston vs Chicago type threads. Let the smaller cities get some attention.
St. Louis and Cincinnati are good suggestions as well. Buffalo might fit as well?
I think out of the top 15 Philly is definitely underrated. I always heard negative things about Philly and even when I told people I was visiting there, people generally responded with "What is there to do in Philly besides eat a cheesesteak". It definitely has a negative reputation and even though it deserves some harsh criticism me and my wife enjoyed our visit.
I also think St. Louis would be a underrated city for it's urbanity. I will say though Philly is a city I wouldn't mind visiting again because of it's vibrant urbanity but St. Louis on the other hand was urban but it lacked the vibrancy Philly had and for that I wouldn't be in a rush to go back.
Although transit and subway could be better, I would say it has a lot of walkable areas and great neighborhoods.
Urban transit could always be better, even in NYC... that said, mass transit in Philly is pretty darn good, esp by American standards, which makes it excellent imho. Case in point: a few years ago our office, of over 80 people polled on the question: how do you get to work? Aside from the 5 people who lived in Center City and walked, over 90% took some form of rail transit in to work each. IIRC, of the others, a few took the bus and one woman in Delaware County drove in and parked early and at a distance from the job each day; she did so b/c of irregular hours caring for her disabled Mom and having to pick up her kids from daycare.
Maybe not underrated but definitely overshadowed is the massive multi-County contiguous urban stretch of North Jersey which covers Southern Passaic + Eastern Essex + Northeastern Union + Southern Bergen + all of Hudson. This area (minus the empty space of the Meadowlands) covers about 187 sq miles and with 2.4 million residents would be the 4th largest city in the US if it were 1 contiguous City, with a density of around 12.7k/sq mile, giving urban North Jersey a similar density to Chicago, Miami, DC, Philadelphia, & Boston. Obviously this area is overshadowed by the megacity next door but IMO it doesn’t get enough credit and recognition for being one of the largest stretches of contiguous urban development in the country. Nj gets a lot of grief for being a giant suburb, and while there are tons of leafy suburban areas surrounding this urban area, the cities in this area are some of the most urban small cities you’ll find. Jersey City, Hoboken, Passaic, Paterson, Newark, Elizabeth, Fort Lee, Montclair, and Hackensack all function as smaller hubs to the way larger urban core. The area is one of the largest transportation hubs in the US, with 2 airports, EWR & Teterboro, and the 7th busiest train station in the US. Newark and Jersey City both have their own light rail, as well as PATH service to NYC, and the entire region is served by NJ Transit rail, plus there are several jitneys and NJ Transit buses which run all across the area so overall the public transportation infrastructure in North Jersey is better than that of almost every other major city, although it could be further improved. And this is an area that has been consistently experiencing rapid development. Obviously it wouldn’t be as massive of an urban area if north Jersey didn’t directly border NYC, but at the same time, the fact is there are very few big cities in the country that are as urban as North Jersey.
Last edited by GoYanksGiantsNets; 04-26-2022 at 03:05 PM..
I think out of the top 15 Philly is definitely underrated. I always heard negative things about Philly and even when I told people I was visiting there, people generally responded with "What is there to do in Philly besides eat a cheesesteak". It definitely has a negative reputation and even though it deserves some harsh criticism me and my wife enjoyed our visit.
I also think St. Louis would be a underrated city for it's urbanity. I will say though Philly is a city I wouldn't mind visiting again because of it's vibrant urbanity but St. Louis on the other hand was urban but it lacked the vibrancy Philly had and for that I wouldn't be in a rush to go back.
If anything Rustbelt cities get too much credit for how urban they are. St Louis, Cleveland, Milwaukee, get treated like it’s still 1965. Like Cleveland’s RTA ridership in 2019 was 1/3rd of what it was in 1979. Because the metro area sprawled out to hell. It’s rail system is basically a zombie rail system.
West coast cities like San Diego and LA are underrated. LA gets derided as a big suburb but it’s transit commute share is basically right under Philly’s on the list of cities.
Maybe not underrated but definitely overshadowed is the massive multi-County contiguous urban stretch of North Jersey which covers Southern Passaic + Eastern Essex + Northeastern Union + Southern Bergen + all of Hudson. This area (minus the empty space of the Meadowlands) covers about 187 sq miles and with 2.4 million residents would be the 4th largest city in the US if it were 1 contiguous City, with a density of around 12.7k/sq mile, giving urban North Jersey a similar density to Chicago, Miami, DC, Philadelphia, & Boston. Obviously this area is overshadowed by the megacity next door but IMO it doesn’t get enough credit and recognition for being one of the largest stretches of contiguous urban development in the country. Nj gets a lot of grief for being a giant suburb, and while there are tons of leafy suburban areas surrounding this urban area, the cities in this area are some of the most urban small cities you’ll find. Jersey City, Hoboken, Passaic, Paterson, Newark, Elizabeth, Fort Lee, Montclair, and Hackensack all function as smaller hubs to the way larger urban core. The area is one of the largest transportation hubs in the US, with 2 airports, EWR & Teterboro, and the 7th busiest train station in the US. Newark and Jersey City both have their own light rail, as well as PATH service to NYC, and the entire region is served by NJ Transit rail, plus there are several jitneys and NJ Transit buses which run all across the area so overall the public transportation infrastructure in North Jersey is better than that of almost every other major city, although it could be further improved. And this is an area that has been consistently experiencing rapid development. Obviously it wouldn’t be as massive of an urban area if north Jersey didn’t directly border NYC, but at the same time, the fact is there are very few big cities in the country that are as urban as North Jersey.
I agree with this. I think if NJT train frequencies outside peak direction were upped a bit, buses were improved substantially, light rail extended a bit, and the fare system better unified, it'd be more urban than anything in the US not NYC proper in short time.
Portland, for example, is denser than it's average population density suggests. About 450k of its residents (70% of total population) live in a land area less than 50 square miles. It also has very good biking infrastructure, which is reflected in its high bike commute percentage.
All have pretty good public transit systems by American standards.
Newark. A ton of buses with frequencies 10 minutes or less on weekdays, city subway(light rail) with decent weekday headways, NJT rail lines into 2 stations, PATH. Not a ton of walkable areas outside the Ironbound due to wide streets/small sidewalks and a crapload of parking lots but they do exist. Jersey City is right up there too, although a bit too car friendly around Newport and towards Kearny.
St. Paul and Madison aren't talked about much for some reason.
On what planet is Philly underrated?
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