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Old 12-12-2012, 07:49 PM
 
669 posts, read 1,274,038 times
Reputation: 385

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Poor schools and over all alck of opportunity stemming from years of systematic oppression which leads to a dysfunctional mindset that gets passed on from generation to generation. And when all your peers and family think a certain way plus the way society portrays you is negative then you adapt to your surrounding and become a product of your environment which you or your ppl had no say in creating. An environment where only a few can make it past the huge obstacles of a bad family structure, poor schools, low job opportunities, and the temptations of making fast illegal money.

Social mobility comes from help and opportunity you don't give ppl the same opportunities then don't expect the same outcome as those who get a lot of opportunities. And for the ones who did make it out they are lucky to have gotten that chance and to have made that right decision because one wrong decision or mistake can mean being stuck in destitution for not only you but your entire family for generations because the cycle will just continue.

 
Old 12-16-2012, 02:49 PM
 
3,244 posts, read 5,242,334 times
Reputation: 2551
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshd9124 View Post
years of systematic oppression ... leads to a dysfunctional mindset that gets passed on from generation to generation. And when all your peers and family think a certain way plus the way society portrays you is negative then you adapt to your surrounding and become a product of your environment which you or your ppl had no say in creating.
What a defeatist attitude!
Perhaps in the Deep South, blacks should have this attitude, but people who came north should have the ambition of immigrants, a desire to overcome odds & succeed, and the ability to encourage their children to learn & do better. I grew up in a community of immigrants. My parents & those of many of my schoolmates came to America, some from Dickensian conditions, to not much better here, but nothing was going to stop the majority of them from working, saving, striving & achieving! They also passed these philosophies on to their children. Not all succeeded, but many did, and few blamed the failures of their contemporaries on their depressed childhoods, inability to speak English, prejudice or discrimination. Those existed for them, too, but they went over, around or through them!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8slUhg2mEo
 
Old 12-16-2012, 03:59 PM
 
Location: Elsewhere
88,588 posts, read 84,818,250 times
Reputation: 115120
Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
What folks have to understand is that the histories of those blacks who are descended from slavery is different than those who might have been poor in their ancestral lands, but who were people who ran their own businesses, even if it meant negotiating with some exploitative elites. They understand risk, and trust each other to pool resources. Their sense of self excludes people from outside of their communities.

This is not the experience of the Trans Atlantic black.

AAs, and Caribbean and Latin American blacks do not have a memory of what we might have been in Africa. Our values, etc were grounded in the various forms of slavery and in the post slave eras. We do not have a sense of self that excludes others. Indeed every Sunday most of us go to church to worship a man who is shown in theimage of a northern European, and many wil be quite upset if such an image was replaced by one looking like a subSaharan African.

So it is wishful thinking for any one to think that blacks a s a group will "unite" and pool their resources. Yes some people who happen to be black might do this and might succeed as a result of this, but it is not a recipe for a remedy to the plight of the black poor.

We are not and will never be community based (some will say clannish) like Asians and Jews so it is no point hoping for that day.
Hey one of my coworkers has an image just like that in her office! Plus two others--with black angels and a black nativity. I like them. The real guy probably looked neither African nor European, but it does not matter.

Carry on.
 
Old 12-16-2012, 04:05 PM
 
1,069 posts, read 1,621,838 times
Reputation: 722
Children need good role models, and unfortunately, that is missing in most Latino and Black populations. A great majority of these homes lack a father, with a good -value-system to encourage these young people. And if they have a father, many are not good role models, and are usually unemployed, on welfare, and using alcohol or drugs, or out of the penitentiary.

Mothers maybe working or not, and many of these children are left out to fend for themselves. To RAISE themselves. They are not guided properly, disciplined appropriately, or taught to learn how to compete in life, for what they want. Few parents are involved in their children's education, or demand change.....Many parents want to help their children, but maybe disabled and unable to, therefore the children fall prey to the wrong role models of the neighborhood, i.e: the drug dealer, the gangs, etc.

And the NYC ghettos produce a mentality that is indescribable. Most of those projects are the stomping grounds for drugs, prostitution, and incarcerations. These children do not stand a chance in life. It is a miracle if one or two make it out of the system, successfully.

And the school system: It is very difficult for ONE teacher to try and teach 40 UNDISCIPLINED children, all talking to their friends, or using their telephones, I pods, etc., in the classroom while the teacher is trying to teach them. Parents are the first to complain against the teacher, if he/she attempts to take away their toys, so they can learn.

After a while, these teachers give up hope, and stop teaching them. Then if they are forced to teach, and do not produce results, and are castigated for it, the POWERFUL teachers' union will see that their jobs are secured......

I have seen the same issues being brought up to the forefront for a myriad of years, and nothing has ever changed.....

These children have been failed by the parents and by NYC......children need stability, love, guidance, and discipline, and this is missing from their homes. So, they become UNTEACHABLE, which equals lack of success.

Also, many children may have developmental difficulties that need immediate attention by educators, and if the parents do not speak English well enough to understand that they need to get this help for their children, the children become frustrated, and easily drop out of school, join gangs, etc.

I have a list of how to fix the system, starting with the POVERTY factor, but it will take LOTS of money and many changes starting with the parents, the school system, and the State.
 
Old 12-16-2012, 04:09 PM
 
Location: Glendale NY
4,840 posts, read 9,917,376 times
Reputation: 3600
Quote:
Originally Posted by Latina7 View Post
Children need good role models, and unfortunately, that is missing in most Latino and Black populations. A great majority of these homes lack a father, with a good -value-system to encourage these young people. And if they have a father, many are not good role models, and are usually unemployed, on welfare, and using alcohol or drugs, or out of the penitentiary.

Mothers maybe working or not, and many of these children are left out to fend for themselves. To RAISE themselves. They are not guided properly, disciplined appropriately, or taught to learn how to compete in life, for what they want. Few parents are involved in their children's education, or demand change.....Many parents want to help their children, but maybe disabled and unable to, therefore the children fall prey to the wrong role models of the neighborhood, i.e: the drug dealer, the gangs, etc.

And the NYC ghettos produce a mentality that is indescribable. Most of those projects are the stomping grounds for drugs, prostitution, and incarcerations. These children do not stand a chance in life. It is a miracle if one or two make it out of the system, successfully.

And the school system: It is very difficult for ONE teacher to try and teach 40 UNDISCIPLINED children, all talking to their friends, or using their telephones, I pods, etc., in the classroom while the teacher is trying to teach them. Parents are the first to complain against the teacher, if he/she attempts to take away their toys, so they can learn.

After a while, these teachers give up hope, and stop teaching them. Then if they are forced to teach, and do not produce results, and are castigated for it, the POWERFUL teachers' union will see that their jobs are secured......

I have seen the same issues being brought up to the forefront for a myriad of years, and nothing has ever changed.....

These children have been failed by the parents and by NYC......children need stability, love, guidance, and discipline, and this is missing from their homes. So, they become UNTEACHABLE, which equals lack of success.

Also, many children may have developmental difficulties that need immediate attention by educators, and if the parents do not speak English well enough to understand that they need to get this help for their children, the children become frustrated, and easily drop out of school, join gangs, etc.

I have a list of how to fix the system, starting with the POVERTY factor, but it will take LOTS of money and many changes starting with the parents, the school system, and the State.
Great post. I agree with all of this.
 
Old 12-16-2012, 05:08 PM
 
594 posts, read 1,634,648 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Motion View Post
Does anyone have any insight on what's causing too many Black-American and Latino boys to not graduate?


NY Graduation Rates for Black, Hispanic Boys Lowest in Nation | NBC New York
It's because they have cultures that put standing on the corner and looking hard above studying and moving up in the world.

And that's not a racist statement by the way, just ask Bill Cosby.
 
Old 12-16-2012, 05:21 PM
 
1,069 posts, read 1,621,838 times
Reputation: 722
Quote:
Originally Posted by RC1981 View Post
It's because they have cultures that put standing on the corner and looking hard above studying and moving up in the world.

And that's not a racist statement by the way, just ask Bill Cosby.

I have to disagree with you, to a certain extent.... It is a combination of many, many factors.......and the lack of the proper father at home, is the number one issue.
 
Old 12-16-2012, 05:52 PM
 
Location: Anytown, USA
681 posts, read 1,672,376 times
Reputation: 383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Latina7 View Post
I have to disagree with you, to a certain extent.... It is a combination of many, many factors.......and the lack of the proper father at home, is the number one issue.
Then why will the mother choose an "improper father" to father her children, then bring a child in the world only to later find out that life is hard and an upward battle?
 
Old 12-16-2012, 07:43 PM
 
594 posts, read 1,634,648 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Latina7 View Post
I have to disagree with you, to a certain extent.... It is a combination of many, many factors.......and the lack of the proper father at home, is the number one issue.
I'm not sure what having a father has to do with it to be honest, but it is part of the equation. Even in other communities kids from single parent households probably perform worse in school than kids from traditional families, although that certainly isn't written in stone.

Why do you think the father issue is so important? Is it some kind of structure that they lack, or something that's missing from their minds that's always in there bothering them and keeps them from concentrating on things like schoolwork?

But really at the root of it I think it's just misplaced priorities. Their culture tells them that it's cool to be a drug dealer, a thief, a pimp, and that's the way to be successful and live your life. If you study, work, do well in school, then you're "acting white".
 
Old 12-17-2012, 07:09 AM
bg7
 
7,694 posts, read 10,563,106 times
Reputation: 15300
Quote:
Originally Posted by RC1981 View Post
I'm not sure what having a father has to do with it to be honest, but it is part of the equation. Even in other communities kids from single parent households probably perform worse in school than kids from traditional families, although that certainly isn't written in stone.

Why do you think the father issue is so important? Is it some kind of structure that they lack, or something that's missing from their minds that's always in there bothering them and keeps them from concentrating on things like schoolwork?

But really at the root of it I think it's just misplaced priorities. Their culture tells them that it's cool to be a drug dealer, a thief, a pimp, and that's the way to be successful and live your life. If you study, work, do well in school, then you're "acting white".
Us white people call that same behavior "acting asian"
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