Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Probably the smart kids at TJ don't get teased about it either, but that's outside the mainstream, and your experience may be also.
What I'm suggesting is that this is playing into a stereotype. Smart black kids get ragged on. Well, so do smart kids who aren't black. It's not an exclusive province. It helps to keep that perspective. Maybe what you want to say is that history has driven blacks to a deeper sense of community identity and reliance than others, so a black being ragged on by a black inflicts a deeper hurt than a white being ragged on by a white. Maybe there's some sense to that. Maybe not. But the notion that blacks have an otherwise different burden to bear if they happen to be born smart from what other folks do may be something of a fuzzy construct, and the notion that blacks as a group are inherently hostile toward the appearance of smart people in their midst definitely is.
But here's where the excuse you're giving for blacks who tease their smarter counterpart falls. In the black community, the sense of "unity to fight the (white) man" is shoved down the throats of everyone. However, the reality is that it's a hypocritical facade, and being smart is one of the quickest ways of knowing that.
Non-black communities, while they don't stress that "community connection," they also don't punish their counterparts as much for being "smart" as they do being nerdy and anti-social, like EdwardA said. Unfortunately, American society in general makes intelligence correlative with nerdiness. For every Dr. Gregory Houses, there's 10x as much Sheldon Coopers on TV. However, whites who are smart and are "nerds" have at the least other nerds to connect with, along with more support from their family. Also, they have a smoother path to a future of being "an MIT/Caltech/Berkeley grad with a nice tech job with Asian GFs and spouses." Sounds stereotypical, but it's a nice incentive, and is easier to attain for white nerds than black nerds; somewhat because of exterior racial prejudice, but more due to the pressure of their own ENTIRE COMMUNITY. Compare that to the few jocks, cheerleaders, and MTV-imaged popular kids the white nerds face at school (which only lasts until the end of high school. Afterwards, it's mostly smooth sailing if he isn't too socially awkward).
And lets not even go into how intelligence is stressed and embraced in nearly all of the various Asian communities. I won't even go into stories what some of the nerdiest Asian guys were doing with their Asian female "study buddies" during their "study breaks." No wonder why countries like Japan, S. Korea, and even China are technologically ahead of the US.
Last edited by Do a Barrel Roll; 09-19-2011 at 09:57 PM..
Smart kids have pretty traditionally taken it in the neck from their peers without much regard to other factors. Everybody has the same story to tell. Just the details change.
But when it's black-on-black teasing about "acting white," it goes much deeper than someone teasing someone for being a nerd. There is such hate and disdain from those who do it. It's a "crabs in the barrel" mentality. They are so enraged to see someone doing better than they are, so they try to knock people who are doing well down. And one would think it'd stop and people would grow out of that, but it doesn't. I still have people give me grief because I don't sound like I belong in a rap video, or because I like things that don't necessarily constitute as "black," and because I care.
Years ago when I lived in DC proper, I was frustrated with the trash in my neighborhood, so I went to clean it up. People waiting at a bus stop thought it was so funny that I cared to clean up the trash. One guy in his car said, "Girl, you need help?" but he was in the left lane and only offered to help because he was hitting on me. I can't get over the ignorant mentality of people.
Now I live in the suburbs and there's hardly an issue with trash and people care about the environment, but there's still no connection. When I lived in DC, I was around people of my race but felt divided because of different beliefs, and now I live around people who are a similar class but we're divided by race. There's no real connection or balance here.
As unsympathetic IndiaLimaDelta may sound in the ears of many black-born Americans, he's speaking the whole truth.
Its not neccesarily about being unsympathetic but for me it was kinda annoying hearing "critiques" from an outsider when it comes to black issues. Even though I'm all about getting different perspectives. I'm not annoyed enough to touch further on it though. So moving on...
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Fairfaxian
Even though I've since moved away from PG and DC, I still have to deal with their judgmental BS because I still have to commute to DC to work and deal with the "black community." Hell, look at most of the comments I receive when I post in the DC threads.
I've said it before but I'll say it again. I understand that you got the business growing up but you're an adult. You have to let it go. There are plenty of non-ghetto black people and generally all around cool of all races in the DC area. While I don't commute into DC, I have found that with age ignoring people who wanna be ugly about Terrence being Terrence is so much easier.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Fairfaxian
Particularly, it takes patience and sympathy out of you, and any story where you hear blacks talk about facing racism, you can't help but to want to ask them "what have you done to other blacks who culturally don't reflect how you are?" If you've treated anyone, and I mean any ONE with scorn for not being black enough, you don't have the right to complain about any prejudice you receive!
I totally disagree. Why would you want a fellow black person to be subjected to racism? Sounds a little self-loathing almost self-racist if there is such a thing. I got the business growing up too but geez Louise you take it to such a different level.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
Probably the smart kids at TJ don't get teased about it either, but that's outside the mainstream, and your experience may be also.
What I'm suggesting is that this is playing into a stereotype. Smart black kids get ragged on. Well, so do smart kids who aren't black. It's not an exclusive province. It helps to keep that perspective. Maybe what you want to say is that history has driven blacks to a deeper sense of community identity and reliance than others, so a black being ragged on by a black inflicts a deeper hurt than a white being ragged on by a white. Maybe there's some sense to that. Maybe not. But the notion that blacks have an otherwise different burden to bear if they happen to be born smart from what other folks do may be something of a fuzzy construct, and the notion that blacks as a group are inherently hostile toward the appearance of smart people in their midst definitely is.
You're taking it to another extreme. Yes kids of all stripes get teased for being different but black folks take it to different level. Pretending that its no big deal is kinda harmful for all concerned. I'm sorry but "post-racial" simply does not exist.
I know first hand that a black child, particularly in rougher neighborhoods, pays high social consequences for excelling in school and for being different much higher than other groups. Talking "white" is the biggest no-no it seems.
You have a point about the "deep sense of community". I think the higher social consequnces for bieng different stems from that but its taken to nth degree in these days and times. There just seems to be these unwritten "rules" to being black in America that other ethnicities don't have.
Quote:
Originally Posted by breakingfree
But when it's black-on-black teasing about "acting white," it goes much deeper than someone teasing someone for being a nerd. There is such hate and disdain from those who do it. It's a "crabs in the barrel" mentality. They are so enraged to see someone doing better than they are, so they try to knock people who are doing well down. And one would think it'd stop and people would grow out of that, but it doesn't. I still have people give me grief because I don't sound like I belong in a rap video, or because I like things that don't necessarily constitute as "black," and because I care.
Now I live in the suburbs and there's hardly an issue with trash and people care about the environment, but there's still no connection. When I lived in DC, I was around people of my race but felt divided because of different beliefs, and now I live around people who are a similar class but we're divided by race. There's no real connection or balance here.
I agree it definitely goes a lot deeper. Yep I've definitely been told that "I talk white". Living in Virginia makes it easier to disassociate from those that would say that. I've never gotten that "traitor" attitude from fellow black folks living in VA. DC and Maryland? Yeah a few have given me the business but the number is still much lower than when I was growing up in Georgia.
Last edited by terrence81; 09-20-2011 at 12:11 PM..
This is some bull****. I talk White, act White, like a lot of White things, and live in a Black neighborhood. I have even been accused of having a White wife when I mentioned I'm married and my wife isn't around at the time. I want a real experience; if I were going to live in the DC area why not live in the city itself why run to Northern Virginia. If you have a complex about not being "Black" in the traditional sense face your fears instead of living around a bunch of White folks, if that is your reason for living in NoVa.
Perhaps it is different up there, but I believe in being unapologetic about who you are. America is going through a real dumbed down, sheeple phase, but that is America in general, not a Black thing. People act like White nerds don't get talked about or don't have self-esteem issues. We need more smart, nerd like, Black people around thugged out, ghetto, Black people in order to maintain some sense of balance and order in the community. The problem is that Black people just don't know anything about each other, so if you have any sense about you and you wear an actual suit and tie, instead of jeans and a t-shirt, there is a problem because people automatically assume that you think that you are better than they are. So they automatically have issues with you before you even speak, but how often do we really interact with them?
It really isn't a White or Black issue, it is a socioeconomic issue. Just how far can you get away from it? Then you run into that situation where White people like you because you aren't like the rest of them. You're different, you're safe; to me that is just as offensive. It is a matter of time before you are laughing at jokes that aren't funny, or tip toeing around Whites to fit in. Yes it hurt as a kid, so my mom had me go to schools out in the suburbs where I was the only Black person, and that hurt too. Used to see Black girls there and thought they were cute, and they were only interested in White boys. Being young and Black hurts, period, but that is just the way it is doesn't matter what you do you can't get away from it.
I'm black and I just moved to Herndon, south of Dulles Toll road. I love it here. I am a Govt employee and received full relocation. My family is still in the Atlanta area until we figure out whether to sell or rent our house next spring, and until my son finishes his first year of HS.
I spent a little over a week in the Hyatt Reston Town Center while getting my apartment together. I have notices a few things black guys normally put up with, like white women switching their purses to the other arm while walking on the same sidewalk, some people opting to wait on another elevator etc but it's their problem not mine. I also noticed there are not allot of black people in this area. I've had dinner at BRB, M&S Grill, American Tap Room, countless Kabob places, Ned Devine's, Kitbar, and Houlihan's to name a few. The only place I noticed another black person was at Houlihan's. I also watched football at American Tap Room and Ned Devine's and I had a great time at each place.
Today I found a "black" barber shop (because there is a difference in cutting our hair) and one of the barber's asked me why I moved here instead of in Maryland. He said Maryland is where the money making black people live. I told him I moved to this part of town because it is only 6 miles away from my office.
I plan on spending the next 6-7 months figuring out which part of town I want to buy a home. Whether or not there are any other black families in the area will not affect my decision.
I'm black and I just moved to Herndon, south of Dulles Toll road. I love it here. I am a Govt employee and received full relocation. My family is still in the Atlanta area until we figure out whether to sell or rent our house next spring, and until my son finishes his first year of HS.
I spent a little over a week in the Hyatt Reston Town Center while getting my apartment together. I have notices a few things black guys normally put up with, like white women switching their purses to the other arm while walking on the same sidewalk, some people opting to wait on another elevator etc but it's their problem not mine. I also noticed there are not allot of black people in this area. I've had dinner at BRB, M&S Grill, American Tap Room, countless Kabob places, Ned Devine's, Kitbar, and Houlihan's to name a few. The only place I noticed another black person was at Houlihan's. I also watched football at American Tap Room and Ned Devine's and I had a great time at each place.
Today I found a "black" barber shop (because there is a difference in cutting our hair) and one of the barber's asked me why I moved here instead of in Maryland. He said Maryland is where the money making black people live. I told him I moved to this part of town because it is only 6 miles away from my office.
I plan on spending the next 6-7 months figuring out which part of town I want to buy a home. Whether or not there are any other black families in the area will not affect my decision.
Welcome to VA. I'm from Georgia too Columbus to be exact. Yeah I've gotten the "why" question before as well. Job was in Virginia made no sense to live in Maryland. If you're working in the Dulles area it definitely doesn't make sense for you to move across the water. You're in the part of town that seems to have fewer of "us". There's more black folks in Alexandria, Manassas, and Woodbridge it seems. I used to live not too far from Herndon in Oakton and the lack of black faces took some getting used to actually. No big deal until its time to get a haircut but how often do you get a haircut compared to how often you commute to work.
Wow, this was a very enlightening thread. Glad I took the time to read it, and thankful for everyone's comments on it. My husband and I are white and our daughter is biracial (black/white); yes, we adopted. We will be moving to the east coast in the near future, and are trying to decide between the NOVA area and the Columbia, MD area. We really, really believe its vital for our daughter to live in a diverse area. But the lack of AA's in NOVA makes me wonder if its "black enough". It honestly never really occurred to me that my daughter could experience prejudice from her own race. I mean, I have been so busy protecting her from crazy white people that I never really thought living near a large population of educated black people could be a problem for her. I don't know what its like to be black, and I am afraid by her having white parents that my daughter will stick out... like she's "trying to be white". So, my question... where would you move if you were me? Maryland or NOVA? I'm not expecting some racial harmony in which my family will be embraced. We just want to raise our daughter to have a healthy identity, and even though she's biracial, the world will always see her as black. Any advice on Maryland vs. NOVA based on what you know? Thanks so much. This is such a sensitive topic, and I'm still learning...
This is some bull****. I talk White, act White, like a lot of White things, and live in a Black neighborhood. I have even been accused of having a White wife when I mentioned I'm married and my wife isn't around at the time. I want a real experience; if I were going to live in the DC area why not live in the city itself why run to Northern Virginia. If you have a complex about not being "Black" in the traditional sense face your fears instead of living around a bunch of White folks, if that is your reason for living in NoVa.
Perhaps it is different up there, but I believe in being unapologetic about who you are. America is going through a real dumbed down, sheeple phase, but that is America in general, not a Black thing. People act like White nerds don't get talked about or don't have self-esteem issues. We need more smart, nerd like, Black people around thugged out, ghetto, Black people in order to maintain some sense of balance and order in the community. The problem is that Black people just don't know anything about each other, so if you have any sense about you and you wear an actual suit and tie, instead of jeans and a t-shirt, there is a problem because people automatically assume that you think that you are better than they are. So they automatically have issues with you before you even speak, but how often do we really interact with them?
It really isn't a White or Black issue, it is a socioeconomic issue. Just how far can you get away from it? Then you run into that situation where White people like you because you aren't like the rest of them. You're different, you're safe; to me that is just as offensive. It is a matter of time before you are laughing at jokes that aren't funny, or tip toeing around Whites to fit in. Yes it hurt as a kid, so my mom had me go to schools out in the suburbs where I was the only Black person, and that hurt too. Used to see Black girls there and thought they were cute, and they were only interested in White boys. Being young and Black hurts, period, but that is just the way it is doesn't matter what you do you can't get away from it.
Is it really about living with white people or is it about living with people who are more like minded and have similar goals, who just happen to be white? Besides that, who said I had to live with black people anyway, is there some law saying that I would be wrong living in a place that doesn't include black people? I can't speak for everyone on here, but my reasoning for wanting to live in Virginia has little to do with race as much it is a mentality. Unfortunately PG County and some parts of DC have people who simply do not value the same things that I do. Yes I believe you can argue that it is socioeconomically affected but I seen this same mentality from people with money too so I don't necessarily think that is always true.
I looked at your profile and saw that you are from Chesapeake. The dynamics of race, economics, and education are completely different in the Hampton Roads area. There is no comparison. There are a lot of traditionally black areas like Portsmouth, parts of Chesapeake, parts of Norfolk, parts of Hampton and parts of Newport News. Black people staying around black people tends to be the norm down there and it is possible because it's not a huge metropolitan area, but up here you have jobs that can be placed in different parts of the metropolitan area, a huge variance in education, safety, and culture. It is also much more culturally diverse here as well and being around other ethnic groups is much more accepted here. It is also a greater variance in economics here. There is a much higher concentration of wealthy black here as opposed to down there.
What's my point? There is a greater chance to live down in an area like where you live around people who look like you, act like you, have the same values as you and are in the same economic class as you. Up here you can be black and wealth or you can be black and poor (or in the middle). There's a much higher degree of the latter, which contributes to different values than those who aren't on the same economic level. Unfortunately nowadays, the economics is not having as much of an affect because you are having more and more young people who are from wealthy families (in all races) who simply do not value education and as a result they tend to take on the values to those who are typically in a different economic class. Chances are if I grow up a different environment no matter if we are the same race or not, it is very likely that I will see the world differently than you. That is the reason why there is some black people who just can't live around other black people or they don't feel as accepted. Those same black people who make fun of educated black people are the same ones who were told that education was not important, that they would never be anything and make a career out of working at fast food restaurants, but they may feel like they have made it because that's what their environment has taught them.
Wow, this was a very enlightening thread. Glad I took the time to read it, and thankful for everyone's comments on it. My husband and I are white and our daughter is biracial (black/white); yes, we adopted. We will be moving to the east coast in the near future, and are trying to decide between the NOVA area and the Columbia, MD area. We really, really believe its vital for our daughter to live in a diverse area. But the lack of AA's in NOVA makes me wonder if its "black enough". It honestly never really occurred to me that my daughter could experience prejudice from her own race. I mean, I have been so busy protecting her from crazy white people that I never really thought living near a large population of educated black people could be a problem for her. I don't know what its like to be black, and I am afraid by her having white parents that my daughter will stick out... like she's "trying to be white". So, my question... where would you move if you were me? Maryland or NOVA? I'm not expecting some racial harmony in which my family will be embraced. We just want to raise our daughter to have a healthy identity, and even though she's biracial, the world will always see her as black. Any advice on Maryland vs. NOVA based on what you know? Thanks so much. This is such a sensitive topic, and I'm still learning...
Honestly, you can't go wrong with either place. If I recall correctly, Columbia was built with intergration in mind and has a long history as being excepting to interracial families. NPR had a thing mentioning this but I can't find the link.
Columbia is suburban bliss. I think its more isolated from DC and more of a Baltimore suburb. So if you or your husband have jobs in DC then I'd personally want to live in Virginia. If the job is in Maryland then I'd move to Columbia.
On the other side I think Northern Virginia is great for families. I don't have kids and didn't grow up here but I can't forsee your daughter having a "trying to be white" problem in VA. I just moved to West Springfield and highly recommend it. It too is suburban bliss.
Is it really about living with white people or is it about living with people who are more like minded and have similar goals, who just happen to be white? Besides that, who said I had to live with black people anyway, is there some law saying that I would be wrong living in a place that doesn't include black people? I can't speak for everyone on here, but my reasoning for wanting to live in Virginia has little to do with race as much it is a mentality. Unfortunately PG County and some parts of DC have people who simply do not value the same things that I do. Yes I believe you can argue that it is socioeconomically affected but I seen this same mentality from people with money too so I don't necessarily think that is always true.
I looked at your profile and saw that you are from Chesapeake. The dynamics of race, economics, and education are completely different in the Hampton Roads area. There is no comparison. There are a lot of traditionally black areas like Portsmouth, parts of Chesapeake, parts of Norfolk, parts of Hampton and parts of Newport News. Black people staying around black people tends to be the norm down there and it is possible because it's not a huge metropolitan area, but up here you have jobs that can be placed in different parts of the metropolitan area, a huge variance in education, safety, and culture. It is also much more culturally diverse here as well and being around other ethnic groups is much more accepted here. It is also a greater variance in economics here. There is a much higher concentration of wealthy black here as opposed to down there.
What's my point? There is a greater chance to live down in an area like where you live around people who look like you, act like you, have the same values as you and are in the same economic class as you. Up here you can be black and wealth or you can be black and poor (or in the middle). There's a much higher degree of the latter, which contributes to different values than those who aren't on the same economic level. Unfortunately nowadays, the economics is not having as much of an affect because you are having more and more young people who are from wealthy families (in all races) who simply do not value education and as a result they tend to take on the values to those who are typically in a different economic class. Chances are if I grow up a different environment no matter if we are the same race or not, it is very likely that I will see the world differently than you. That is the reason why there is some black people who just can't live around other black people or they don't feel as accepted. Those same black people who make fun of educated black people are the same ones who were told that education was not important, that they would never be anything and make a career out of working at fast food restaurants, but they may feel like they have made it because that's what their environment has taught them.
I'm actually in Virginia Beach now. But I'm not even from this area, I'm from Akron, OH. I have nothing against living around people that have the same interests than I do, regardless of race.
But speaking about Chesapeake; Hampton Roads can be rather ghetto in times, in all of the cities. Yeah Chesapeake has some middle class Black areas, and some nice Black neighborhoods, but it also has some slums. But are you suggesting that DC itself, the city proper, doesn't have the same type of neighborhoods that Chesapeake does? Even Akron and Cleveland have some upper class Black neighborhoods. Main difference between the "DMV" and Hampton Roads, and other states, is the level of income high Black earners have. A Black professional can easily earn 6 figures around here, back in the Midwest, they would have to own a business to get that type of money coming in. In most areas in this country the majority of Black people you will find in a metropolitan area are poor, that is just the way it is. Supposedly it is different in cities like Atlanta, but my experience, everywhere; DC, New York, Chicago, back home, everywhere I go, you see one well to do Black person, there are probably 2 or 3, or 5 or 10, poor Blacks somewhere.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Columbus to be exact. Yeah I've gotten the "why" question before as well. Job was in Virginia made no sense to live in Maryland. If you're working in the Dulles area it definitely doesn't make sense for you to move across the water. You're in the part of town that seems to have fewer of "us". There's more black folks in Alexandria, Manassas, and Woodbridge it seems. I used to live not too far from Herndon in Oakton and the lack of black faces took some getting used to actually. No big deal until its time to get a haircut but how often do you get a haircut compared to how often you commute to work.
