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Old 02-04-2015, 09:50 PM
 
Location: On the water.
21,741 posts, read 16,369,041 times
Reputation: 19831

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoppySead View Post
Well Tulemutt, I once saw an anti vaxer spread out on a yoga mat at my class. She was like, all yogaee and anti vaxeee at the same time. I slid my mat to the back that day.
Well I stand corrected then. Perhaps yoga mats are given as premiums to anti-vac subscribers. I'll have to be more vigilant in the future.
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Old 02-04-2015, 10:14 PM
 
Location: Hyrule
8,390 posts, read 11,610,711 times
Reputation: 7544
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambient View Post
Gupta gets it right... Not to say that science is perfect and doesn't improve in understanding over time, but I really wonder when multiple heaps of scientific evidence became open to the idea of merit based on "personal belief", much like any religion. You see it with vaccines and climate change, most notably.

"No thanks, no gravity for me today... sorry, I just don't believe in it. I am convinced that it's invisible glue on the road that's keeping my feet down. It's my right, and you have to respect that."

No...we don't. You can believe what you want, but at some point when the evidence is overwhelming, it's our right and even obligation to conclude and call out that you're an idiot - especially when your idiocy threatens the health of others.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta: Vaccines are a matter of fact - CNN.com
Yet, you are scaring everyone over a small percentage of people who in no way can cause a Measles epidemic in America by not vaccinating? Stop it will ya!!

Pick one of these: Top 10 leading causes of death in America
Heart disease: 596,577
Cancer: 576,691
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 142,943
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 128,932
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 126,438
Alzheimer's disease: 84,974
Diabetes: 73,831
Influenza and Pneumonia: 53,826
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 45,591
Intentional self-harm (suicide): 39,518

I vote you pick on the people who don't get the flu and Pneumonia vaccine first since you are a go vaxer go. Or what about drinkers, smokers, or maybe those depressed suicidal people? Oh wait, that's over half the population. lmao.
I might take you more seriously if it's in the top 10.
Ewwww, what about Micky D's?

Go on you, get your signs and continue the fight! You can stand down at the beach where all the rich hippies lay on their yoga mats and shun vaccines. You know, the ones on the rocks shooting their youtube yoga vids.

Or, you could just turn off the news and chill.
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Old 02-04-2015, 10:19 PM
 
Location: Hyrule
8,390 posts, read 11,610,711 times
Reputation: 7544
Job well done Suzy, job well done. I didn't realize you lived in the OC. We are neighbors, awesomeness. Well, everyone has to stand for something. Continue the fight. Carry on, carry on. I guess Disneyland was the tipping point.
Maybe they'll just shoot the kids up at school now like they did when I was in school. They might have to go door to door for the little homeschoolers and drag them from their moms kicking and screaming. Fun, Fun!
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Old 02-04-2015, 10:32 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
37,120 posts, read 41,299,979 times
Reputation: 45184
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoppySead View Post
Job well done Suzy, job well done. I didn't realize you lived in the OC. We are neighbors, awesomeness. Well, everyone has to stand for something. Continue the fight. Carry on, carry on. I guess Disneyland was the tipping point.
Maybe they'll just shoot the kids up at school now like they did when I was in school. They might have to go door to door for the little homeschoolers and drag them from their moms kicking and screaming. Fun, Fun!
Pertussis Epidemic — California, 2014

"Of 6,790 cases with available data, 347 patients had been hospitalized, including 275 (79%) who were aged <12 months, of whom 214 (62% of those hospitalized) were aged <4 months. Among hospitalized infants aged <12 months with complete information, 33% required intensive care; few (24%) had received any doses of diphtheria, tetanus, and acellular pertussis vaccine (DTaP) (Table 2). One death was reported in an infant aged 5 weeks at the time of illness onset. Two additional fatal cases in infants who became ill in 2013 were also reported in early 2014; both were aged <5 weeks at the time of illness onset, and one was hospitalized for more than a year before succumbing to pertussis-related complications."
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Old 02-05-2015, 06:21 AM
 
Location: Hyrule
8,390 posts, read 11,610,711 times
Reputation: 7544
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
Pertussis Epidemic — California, 2014

"Of 6,790 cases with available data, 347 patients had been hospitalized, including 275 (79%) who were aged <12 months, of whom 214 (62% of those hospitalized) were aged <4 months. Among hospitalized infants aged <12 months with complete information, 33% required intensive care; few (24%) had received any doses of diphtheria, tetanus, and acellular pertussis vaccine (DTaP) (Table 2). One death was reported in an infant aged 5 weeks at the time of illness onset. Two additional fatal cases in infants who became ill in 2013 were also reported in early 2014; both were aged <5 weeks at the time of illness onset, and one was hospitalized for more than a year before succumbing to pertussis-related complications."
I thought we were on the Measles thread? I gather the Measles outbreak isn't killing enough kids to be effective so you had to use whopping cough to get the fear on. Maybe you'll luck out this week and someone will croak from the Measles.
You people that get a thrill out of this really urk me. Fear is not a tool to get the outcome you desire its just terrorism.

Good information and calming fear work way better. You should try it sometime. Not everyones an idiot, you can stop assuming that any day now. In a country will high vaccine rates your terrorist approach makes no sense. Just stop it already.
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Old 02-05-2015, 06:39 AM
 
10,237 posts, read 6,327,985 times
Reputation: 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoppySead View Post
Job well done Suzy, job well done. I didn't realize you lived in the OC. We are neighbors, awesomeness. Well, everyone has to stand for something. Continue the fight. Carry on, carry on. I guess Disneyland was the tipping point.
Maybe they'll just shoot the kids up at school now like they did when I was in school. They might have to go door to door for the little homeschoolers and drag them from their moms kicking and screaming. Fun, Fun!
I was a preteen when they came around in school. Raise your hands those of you who had measles yourself. Lot of hands by that age. These kids did not get shot up with that measles vax. This was in a NYC school.
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Old 02-05-2015, 08:29 AM
 
Location: Hyrule
8,390 posts, read 11,610,711 times
Reputation: 7544
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48 View Post
I was a preteen when they came around in school. Raise your hands those of you who had measles yourself. Lot of hands by that age. These kids did not get shot up with that measles vax. This was in a NYC school.
Yes, I am a bit younger my dear. Just a bit. My older siblings got the Measles though, like I said I'm just a wee bit younger.
I remember standing in the "shot" line at school and we also had our spines checked for scoliosis. It was like one of those strange movies, slow mo, with a few kids screaming, and a few passing out from fear. lol
They used a big gun like contraption and everyone prepared one arm with a sleeve up. I now have the dreaded mark that tells which generation I'm in on my arm like a small tat.

I recently had a booster when my kids where getting their chicken pox vaccines. I had the chicken pox so I just needed the Measles booster. I guess the year I got mine it wasn't enough to be effective. All that work up for nothing. I just hate the fear mongers, and I can understand why some parents don't trust the drug companies. Most of their crap is ****e. I'm pro personal choice when it comes to my or my kids bodies. The last thing I want is forced anything that has to do with consumption.
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Old 02-05-2015, 10:32 AM
 
Location: San Francisco, CA
15,088 posts, read 13,458,676 times
Reputation: 14266
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoppySead View Post
Yet, you are scaring everyone over a small percentage of people who in no way can cause a Measles epidemic in America by not vaccinating? Stop it will ya!!

Pick one of these: Top 10 leading causes of death in America
Heart disease: 596,577
Cancer: 576,691
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 142,943
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 128,932
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 126,438
Alzheimer's disease: 84,974
Diabetes: 73,831
Influenza and Pneumonia: 53,826
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 45,591
Intentional self-harm (suicide): 39,518
It's really a false argument to say that just because it's not as important as other things in the world, whether cancer, the national deficit, or ISIS, we should disregard it. This is important, and it does matter - especially when we have the tools readily available to address it and choose as a society not to use them.

Talk to anyone with medical expertise, and they'll tell you that what to you seems like just a small percentage of people foregoing vaccines actually has material consequences to public health. Yes, it's a relatively small percentage now, but as the trend continues like this, preventable diseases with sometimes serious complications can and will regain a foothold in this nation. And if and when that happens and we scale to thousands or tens of thousands of cases, you will see the costs to the healthcare system grow, and you will start to see deaths and life-long harm, particularly to the young and immune-compromised.

You can be flippant about it if it makes you feel clever, but those who have small babies or immune-compromised spouses die because a preventable disease like this regained a foothold and was able to spread thanks to people who chose not to vaccinate will see things differently. It's not going to be just a joke to them like it is to you.

Last edited by ambient; 02-05-2015 at 10:50 AM..
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Old 02-05-2015, 11:00 AM
 
Location: San Francisco, CA
15,088 posts, read 13,458,676 times
Reputation: 14266
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48 View Post
I was a preteen when they came around in school. Raise your hands those of you who had measles yourself. Lot of hands by that age. These kids did not get shot up with that measles vax. This was in a NYC school.
Yes, most of you from past generations survived. But quick, tell me how many didn't or had complications?

I'll tell you. From the mid 50s to 60s, there were annually on average about 4-500 measles deaths, 150,000 survivors a year with respiratory complications, and 4,000 a year with encephalitis (brain swelling) - which itself results in a lot of life-long neurological problems and has a pretty high mortality rate.

Add it all up, and measles was hospitalizing an average 48,000 people a year in those times. That imposes a real cost on the healthcare system and ties up resources that could be focused on other aspects of healthcare advancement.

If you went back further in time to the early 20th century, the toll was even worse.

Measles Elimination in the United States


You see, it's really not a good argument to say that just because you and most people with it made it through ok, that we should forego available vaccination and thereby not prevent the many deaths you DIDN'T hear about. What you are doing is arguing in favor of 4-500 measles deaths a year, 150,000 respiratory complications, 4,000 cases of encephalitis, and a total of 48K people annually hospitalized for treatment of this stuff. It's the wrong side of the argument to be on.

If it's your kid or loved one who ends up in those statistics because of a preventable disease that came back thanks to people like yourself who spurn vaccination, maybe you might come to see things differently.

From the article:
Quote:
Measles is the greatest vaccine-preventable killer of children in the world today and the eighth leading cause of death among persons of all ages worldwide[13–14]
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