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What's the point of getting her professional help if she isn't willing to talk to anybody? Say I take her to a therapist, knowing her she's probably just going to sit there for an hour and not say anything. She's an extremely defiant young woman. In addition, if it hasn't got anything to do with her name then why has she been hounding me for 3 years straight?
Ellie is short for Eleanore, it was my late mother's name. Since the age of 2-3 my daughter absolutely despised Eleanore so we shortened it to Ellie, which for the record was a name she had no problem with until she was nearly 13. She wants to change it to Spencer and she wants her middle name (Jessica) to change to Valeria. I haven't met anyone ever under the name Valeria and the only Spencer I've ever been close with is my old male friend from high school. Those names have no personal meaning to me, they're completely random.
You do NOT know that she won't talk to a counselor. It might take her a few sessions to open up. Who cares is she sits there with a counselor for an hour and doesn't speak? She's not talking to you. That's different. She clearly needs professional help NOW.
Who cares what she wants to be called? Just call her it as long as it isn't something offensive. Just because you haven't met someone with a name, doesn't make any difference. I absolutely guarantee you've never met anyone with my name or my sister's name. Doesn't mean we don't exist.
Your daughter needs REAL help NOW! You're NOT helping her. You're NOT being a parent. You pretty much suck as a parent actually. Your child cries for help by grabbing a kitchen knife and you do nothing? SERIOUSLY? Do you know how many parents today wish they had the kitchen knife incident happen so that they knew their child was in trouble? Many parents don't know their child is in trouble until that child is DEAD. You want to live with that? I know someone who is going through that. I would not wish that on anyone! it's been an absolutely horrible thing for the entire family. Her son killed himself while the family was on vacation.....16 years old and he's gone. That could really be you.
And no teenage girl wants to be called Ellie no matter where the name came from. She's probably been called Ellie the elephant more times than you can imagine and it's hurting her. You don't seem to care though. You're stuck on where the name came from. Who cares? It's a name! If she wanted to be called Curious George, I would go along with it. It's not like she's asking to be called crap for brains. Good grief.
Nope. Therapy first because it's too important to know what is lying behind the desire to change it to Spencer. Male name?
It's not about being authoritarian at all.
Spencer is also a female name today. One of the characters on Pretty Little Liars is a girl named Spencer. She's VERY feminine, intelligent, and is from a very well off family as well. Yes, it's a tv show, but many names are no longer boy names or girl names.
... I know she's extremely defiant and isn't exactly co-operative. It's just not who she is.
Also, I am in no way transphobic, why on earth would you even think that?
Ignore that poster. Completely irrelevant "advice."
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom
The fact that you are focusing on the name rather than the behavior is exactly focusing on trivialities.
Yep. Your daughter is not your possession, OP. The simple fact is that it really doesn't matter if you will get used to calling her a different name or not. That is not the issue.
Your daughter is very defiant because, as you have shown multiple times here, you are not being a parent. You have thrown up your hands and said "it won't work," "she won't go," "I can't make her...," You are now reaping what you have sown as a mother.
It will be hard to get her back on track, but it can be done. You both need professional counseling ASAP. These kinds of problems are WAY above our pay grade here. If the two of you go together, you can learn how to navigate the next few years together.
Does anyone get the feeling OP is slightly transphobic and narrow minded or is it just me?
OP, exactly how old were you when you had your daughter? You seem so immature and hung up over the trivial things instead of the things that matter. Like getting your daughter some help.
Whether Spencer is a good name or not or whether it's more suited for men doesn't matter. What matters is your daughter's well being.
Forget narrow minded. Closed minded. There's not even a sliver of light at the end of the tunnel. I feel so badly for her daughter. She's screaming for help and none of her parents are doing a damn thing.
Have you asked your daughter what the name "Spencer Valeria" actually means to her, and why she dislikes her given names? Returning communication to a normal, non-combative, non-accusatory, non-defensive level - on both of your parts - would certainly be desirable, but since your daughter was desperate enough to grab a knife and threaten to cut her wrists, clearly things escalated way beyond this level. I agree, you should have called the police at that point.
But you didn't, so you and your daughter are going to have to regroup and get on with things from where you are at present.
So - if things have settled down some, ask her - in a non-accusatory, non-defensive, neutral, polite and interested fashion - about her name preferences. What significance do these names have for her? Yes, of course you do feel distressed that your daughter dislikes and rejects the names you gave her, names you clearly love and associate with her and which carry additional significance and meaning. But set your own feelings for the names aside, and focus on your daughter's well-being.
She didn't reach such a state of desperation overnight, and the name controversy was just the last straw, it appears to me, and very likely symbolizes something else very important to her. Possibly independence, being her own person, rejecting the past and past associations, and so on. Those are just my guesses, though.
Do you have a difficult time with your daughter's maturing in other areas? Does the idea of her no longer being your little girl make you resentful or sad? Do you try to hang onto her by keeping a close eye and sometimes control over her activities, friends, and choices? Do you compare her with her older sister or others in your family?
Family counseling might be very helpful for both you and your daughter, with individual counseling added as needed.
Also - it is possible to add a third given name legally, without dropping her existing names. Might this be a compromise? But again: the name thing is just a symbol of something more serious that needs to be dealt with effectively through counseling.
Best wishes to your family, especially your daughter.
Therapists that are good can get her to discuss. I would sit her down and tell her that I was open to a name change if she would go to a counselor with me to discuss the issue.
She may be getting bullied and "Ellie" has become a name with some mean rhyme in it. She may have some gender issues and "Spencer" is a gender neutral name. You just don't know. Don't ask her any more why, because she ain't telling!
This is a very serious issue and she deserves that you take her seriously. Go together to a professional counselor and get this conversation aired. Your denial of its seriousness is a good indication of why she is not trusting you with the root cause of this issue. Just re-read what you have written here and digest that you are defending the name "Ellie" instead of trying to help your child.
This right here. I would tell her the exact same thing. I would consider it IF she were willing to go to counseling. That might get her there with a minimum of angst.
Quote:
Originally Posted by homeonthelittlemountain
Good Lord. There is nothing stopping YOU from getting professional advice. Get yourself to a therapist and take it from there based on their counsel. You don't need advice from friends and strangers on the Internet. You need a professional to assess this situation. Now.
Yes. I went to counseling through my EAP when my son was getting bullied in third grade. For some reason, it just had me completely UNDONE and unable to deal with it effectively and possibly making things worse.
The counselor told me that she was going to help my son by helping me - and she was right. I also got some great practical advice from her as an objective observer and the problem was quickly solved.
Insomuch as the daughter's desire. Treat it as an investigation task.
Make it that she has to pay for it, gather the forms and have a legal reason for the change.
You will then both go to a lawyer (she pays) and can get further advisal on the process.
I'd be surprised if she follows through since it involves more reading and conjuring up the funds to proceed.
It's a lesson to be sure in how to adjust to the rules of court and how money plays it part.
A parent does have the authority to get the child help when suicide is on the table.
OP, my pardons as this advisal was indeed a logical way to consider. I did forget to mention that the other parent will also have to sign off on this intent for name change. So even IF she gets so far as the judicial stage, the paternal & maternal parents have to also be in agreement. You may want to convey that to her.
Defiance is part of the teen stage. Her self harm is not. Tell her you will consider her request and compromise by getting her to a teen clinic for suicide prevention. Tackle her staying alive first before deciding on the name change.
She really hasn't shown any signs of wanting to run away, no. I don't think she'd be able to either, her whole life she's gotten everything handed to her on a silver platter and to be frank, I think I'm starting to agree with the people saying I need to be stricter and take her to a therapist whether she likes it or not. I think it's the only way. However, I don't know how productive it's going to be. I'll certainly try though.
My husband and I divorced when she was 8, it was a long time ago, she's turning 16 this month. I'm pretty sure that isn't why. He hasn't been in the picture in a very long time. I mean I hope it has nothing to do with changing her name because re-naming my child Spencer Valeria is something I'm never going to get used to. You're telling me it'd be easy for you to call your child something completely different than what you've been used to?
You could stick with that unreasonable bit of stubbornness. Would you be happy and content to read "Eleanore" on her headstone for the rest of your life?
For God's sake, woman, the idea that a NAME is so much more important to you than anything else is mystifying to most of us who are reading this.
Other people have done this for different reasons. I know a woman whose name was Merowyn. Her mother is Wiccan and gave her a Celtic name. She hated it. She changed it to a very ordinary name as an adult.
I have a friend whose name was Mark who became a Benedictine monk and changed his name to Justin.
I like Eleanor because of Eleanor of Aquitaine, but it's not really a very nice name for a young woman in 2016. It's an old-lady name, like Myrtle or Bertha. She probably gets made fun of at school all the time.
Spencer is also a female name today. One of the characters on Pretty Little Liars is a girl named Spencer. She's VERY feminine, intelligent, and is from a very well off family as well. Yes, it's a tv show, but many names are no longer boy names or girl names.
Look at all the "Madisons" and "McKenzies" running amok through the schools these days. Not girl names.
Neither in the past were Allison, Vivian, Beverly, or Alexis. All boy names that became girl names over time.
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