Are speeding fines too low? (Phoenix, Scottsdale: insurance, to move, vehicles)

[wase4711]

https://www.alphadictionary.com/good.../one-upmanship

[DetroitN8V]

Originally Posted by wase4711

https://www.alphadictionary.com/good.../one-upmanship

That's pretty cool and all that you know how to copy and paste links, but if you don't plan on engaging in a relatively intelligent discussion, why not just bow out? In an attempt to get this back on track, I would like to see speed limits increased to at least 70 on the 101, 17 and parts of the 10 and 51. That would allow people to cruise comfortably at 80, within the 10 mph threshold that some seem to think is the line between fine and murderous.

[JGMotorsport64]

Originally Posted by wase4711

yeah, no t bone accidents on Arizona highways...
Phoenix Fire: T-bone crash in west Phoenix, investigation ongoing - ABC15 Arizona

Wasn't on a highway smart guy. Read the story.

[DetroitN8V]

Originally Posted by JGMotorsport64

Wasn't on a highway smart guy. Read the story.

Hahaha! Good catch. I didn't bother clicking it. Too funny.

[jimj]

Originally Posted by wase4711

we are all guilty of the same thing, but, at least when there is a law on the books, you might think twice about just doing it randomly..
and, seriously man, since this metro area has the most people speeding and driving somewhat haphazardly, IMO, some sort of law needs to at least be on the books..

I know how much folks out here hate having any sorts of restrictions on how they live their lives, and, I agree with that 99% of the time, but, when it comes to seriously distracted driving, there needs to be some sort of rules about that..

If not, might as well let folks drink a beer, smoke a joint, eat a burger, and text at the same time, all while doing 62 in a 40 mph residential area..

They DO <bold>! Ever drive down Bell or McDowel Rd near any of the fast food joints?

[mzbk2l]

Originally Posted by Dewey59

From DPS Director Col. Frank Milstead:


“Unfortunately, at the speeds people are driving – 80 to 85 mph – when something goes wrong – and it will go wrong, somebody will do something inappropriate – things go wrong real fast and real violently.”


This is my beef with people like you, Detroit.... You think you have a RIGHT to do whatever you want on the road. Live and let live, your not hurting anyone else, leave me alone, etc., etc. Well, when you are driving that fast, you are risking other people's lives.

Yeah, I know, you're the best driver on the face of the earth, and YOU would NEVER cause an accident. Well, even if it is not you that causes the problem (maybe someone cuts in front of you), when you are driving that fast, you simply cannot react fast enough, or you over react which leads to an accident that can involve several other cars.

And really, what's the hurry? In most cases, people who are speeding are not late for something, they just like to speed... A completely selfish act.

Or they're intelligent to realize that speed limits on our wide, smooth, straight roads with long sight lines really are set too low... something the "traffic police" of the internet don't seem to grasp.

From the Federal Highway Administration:

Most engineering approaches to speed limit setting are based on the 85th percentile speed—the speed at which 85 percent of free-flowing traffic is traveling at or below. The typical procedure is to set the speed limit at or near the 85th percentile speed of free-flow traffic. Adjustments to either increase or decrease the speed limits may be made depending on infrastructure and traffic conditions.
Setting a speed limit based on the 85th percentile speed was originally based on safety. Specifically, research at the time had shown that traveling at or around one standard deviation above the mean operating speed (which is approximately the 85th percentile speed) yields the lowest crash risk for drivers. Furthermore, crash risk increases rapidly for drivers traveling two standard deviations or more above or below the mean operating speed. Therefore, the 85th percentile speed separates acceptable speed behavior from unsafe speed behavior that disproportionately contributes to crash risk.*
The 85th percentile speed method is also attractive because it reflects the collective judgment of the vast majority of drivers as to a reasonable speed for given traffic and roadway conditions. This is aligned with the general policy sentiment that laws (i.e., speed limits) should not make people acting reasonably into law-breakers. Setting a speed limit even 5 mph (8 km/h) below the 85th percentile speed can make almost half the drivers illegal; setting a speed limit 5 mph (8 km/h) above the 85th percentile speed will likely make few additional drivers legal.
Under the operating speed method of setting speed limits, the first approximation of the speed limit is to set the speed limit at the 85th percentile speed. The MUTCD recommends that the speed limit be within 5 mph (8 km/h) of the 85th percentile speed of free-flowing traffic. The posted speed limit shall be in multiples of 5 mph15, or 10 km/h for jurisdictions that employ metric.22
While the MUTCD recommends setting the posted speed limits near the 85th percentile speed, and traffic engineers say that agencies are using the 85th percentile speed to set speed limits, in reality the speed limit is often set much lower. At these locations, the 85th percentile operating speeds exceed the posted speed limits; and, in many cases, the 50th percentile operating speed is either near or exceeds that posted speed limit as well.16 Many agencies deviate from their agency's written guidelines and instead post lower speed limits. According to an ITE Engineering Council Technical Committee survey, these reduced speed limits are often the result of political pressures.17 However, it is important to note that setting speed limits lower than 85th percentile speed does not encourage compliance with the posted speed limit. 6

From the first bolded statement; it sounds like drivers smart enough to drive at the prevailing speed have a lower risk of crash than those of you who persist in driving "safely" at a speed well below that of the traffic around you. Please speed up and stop increasing the risks for others on the road; that is incredibly selfish of you.

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by mzbk2l

Or they're intelligent to realize that speed limits on our wide, smooth, straight roads with long sight lines really are set too low... something the "traffic police" of the internet don't seem to grasp.

Actually, the internet traffic cops are pretty amusing and easy to balk at. It's the self appointed traffic cops on the freeways who are the real menaces ... the ones who purposely stay in the far left lane and inhibit the traffic flow & won't move over. Well actually, they're pretty amusing as well (in a very annoyingly stupid way), and fairly easy to zip around if you have the opportunity.

[jimj]

Traffic and other fines have gone from being the penalty that they were originally designed for to being just another tax collection at the end of a gun...

[man4857]

Originally Posted by Dewey59

I regularly see people driving well in excess of 15mph over the limit in and around the Phoenix area. It looks like the minimum speeding fine is $250, which seems pretty steep to me, but maybe not? Is it that people are not aware the fine is that high, or is it that they just don't care? If the latter, that would seem to indicate the fines are too low.

I also heard on LivePD (when they used to follow DPS officers) that anything over 85 on the freeway (at least in the 65 zones) is felony speeding. Wow! Seems like that would be a big deterrent too!

Based on some of the other posts I have read here, I think we have lots of speeders on this forum, so I am curious as to what your thought process is. I generally run 5 over, in case anyone thinks I am one of those old codgers that is always going 10 under! (There should be a law against THAT too!)

I see DPS pulling over people more for violating the HOV lane restrictions during rush hour more than I see people being pulled over for speeding. Not sure if that's their agenda or not.

But yeah I see there's too many people speeding on freeways here. I typically go 70-75MPH and that's "slow" by the number of cars either tailgating me or passing me. Like really? Come on people.

[Colt AZ]

Originally Posted by man4857

I see DPS pulling over people more for violating the HOV lane restrictions during rush hour more than I see people being pulled over for speeding. Not sure if that's their agenda or not.

But yeah I see there's too many people speeding on freeways here. I typically go 70-75MPH and that's "slow" by the number of cars either tailgating me or passing me. Like really? Come on people.

They're just wanting to "teach" you how to go faster.

Now, if these "teachers" are gettin' right in back of your rear bumper, and you want them to stop doing that, just flip on your lights and your taillights will come on as well...

When you hear a loud SCREEEEEEEEEEEEEEE behind you -- not to worry -- it's just your "teacher" applying the brakes.