Phoenix, the most unaffordable "affordable" place to live (loans, construction)
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For me it was either spending on takeouts, new clothes, mani-pedis, gym membership and frequent trips to California, or cutting out those expenses, working extra hours and doing most of those things myself.
And if you were unable to get and keep a good paying job, what would have happened?
None of the steps would have helped. You'd be bankrupt.
Once you got that good paying job and was able to keep it, financial planning is simple.
Not easy peasy - like no sacrifices are needed - but simple.
Just spend less than you make.
Can't do that if one is unemployed, or having difficulty keeping a job.
I totally agree - one has to make certain choices to make things happen.
But 100% of people do not have 100% control over 100% of their life. Hence, we have people with difficulties. Pretending this does not exist is not a good thing.
All it takes is one bad event and boom, your plans are ruined.
Working a good paying job and getting a after hours gig making good money means nothing if you get hit by a car and now you're disabled, unable to work and up to your neck in hospital bills.
Or one gets hit by the catch-22 from trying to get out of a low paying job - stuck in that low paying job, regardless of how hard work or sacrifice.
People CAN do everything right in life and still have problems.
But 100% of people do not have 100% control over 100% of their life. Hence, we have people with difficulties. Pretending this does not exist is not a good thing.
There is a percentage of people that always land on top that is God-given. Lucky critcal stuff like above average Dopamine that correlates to above average drive. Or an awesome gene pool with some smart parents. IMO, well under 50% of the people win that brainpower and motivation lottery. So your advice of worrying falls flat. They nearly always land on top.
And another group down the food chain lucked out and had incredible parenting and nurturing. As we all know, our environment matters. And as another bonus, some have parents with thick wallets AND great parenting skills. Oh, that helps a ton! Their kids often land on top and are in WONDERFUL shape most of the time as well. As in, short of poor money management of picking a stupif-ass degree/dicipline, they are winners.
When unemployment is awful around 8%, the goal is to outmaneuver the other 92%. I've never personally been worried about falling in that bottom 8%. And when I got laid off in my 20's (I deserved it as I was burnt out), I retooled and found a new job for more money and I switched careers. It took me 3 months because I worked 40-50 hours a week looking.
Another group of people down the food chain got dealt a less-than-ideal hand and based on some other lucky breaks got a dose of competitiveness or met a great mentor or __________. Again, they aren't going to be in that 8% unemployment. They are valuable employees and were smart enough to network, improve themselves etc.
And then we have another group that have some mental illness, awful parenting, health issues, etc. I certainly feel for people who find themselves in this camp. My wife has a couple of sisters in this group yet she was personally was able to rally. Butt here is absoutely NO amount of advice that will lift them up. They have given up.
I think many people posting have been talking to a inbetween group of people that simply won't change or refuse to learn or take advice. They are Hellbent on staying their challenging course. That's a group where I begin to lack compassion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobsell
All it takes is one bad event and boom, your plans are ruined.
People CAN do everything right in life and still have problems.
That's just life.
We disagree. People who do everything right in like rarely find themselves upside down. And for many (well over 50%, a bad event can mean a good thing. Like me getting laid off. I deserved it and it forced me to finally get off my butt.
Unlike you, my glass is half full. IMO, that matters.
Why Phoenix—of All Places—Has the Fastest Growing Home Prices in the U.S. 33 MONTHS IN A ROW
the median home price in the area has risen 216% since 2000, while the median salary has only risen 48%.
And if you were unable to get and keep a good paying job, what would have happened?
None of the steps would have helped. You'd be bankrupt.
Once you got that good paying job and was able to keep it, financial planning is simple.
Not easy peasy - like no sacrifices are needed - but simple.
Just spend less than you make.
Can't do that if one is unemployed, or having difficulty keeping a job.
I totally agree - one has to make certain choices to make things happen.
But 100% of people do not have 100% control over 100% of their life. Hence, we have people with difficulties. Pretending this does not exist is not a good thing.
All it takes is one bad event and boom, your plans are ruined.
Working a good paying job and getting a after hours gig making good money means nothing if you get hit by a car and now you're disabled, unable to work and up to your neck in hospital bills.
Or one gets hit by the catch-22 from trying to get out of a low paying job - stuck in that low paying job, regardless of how hard work or sacrifice.
People CAN do everything right in life and still have problems.
That's just life.
I understand misfortunes happen to the best people but most everyone who is willing to work, perform at or above standards and set goals will usually do fine in life.
You list line after line of terrible things that happen to a small percentage and most of the time it's the people who f'd up, no better way of saying it.
Let-downs happen to all of us but the people who are totally down and out and hopeless, well a lot of times it's their own fault.
I don't know what you mean by the catch-22 but all I can say is I don't make a 6-figure income and I don't have rich relatives or a trust fund, but I have a job that pays the bills. I drive an older car, do my own cooking and buy thrift store clothes and I was able to afford a small condo by cutting costs.
You keep playing the blame game and wallow in self pity.
And if you were unable to get and keep a good paying job, what would have happened?
None of the steps would have helped. You'd be bankrupt.
Once you got that good paying job and was able to keep it, financial planning is simple.
Not easy peasy - like no sacrifices are needed - but simple.
Just spend less than you make.
Can't do that if one is unemployed, or having difficulty keeping a job.
I totally agree - one has to make certain choices to make things happen.
But 100% of people do not have 100% control over 100% of their life. Hence, we have people with difficulties. Pretending this does not exist is not a good thing.
All it takes is one bad event and boom, your plans are ruined.
Working a good paying job and getting a after hours gig making good money means nothing if you get hit by a car and now you're disabled, unable to work and up to your neck in hospital bills.
Or one gets hit by the catch-22 from trying to get out of a low paying job - stuck in that low paying job, regardless of how hard work or sacrifice.
People CAN do everything right in life and still have problems.
That's just life.
That's life. The question you need ask yourself is, "How long will I remain curled in a fetal position before pulling myself up?
I understand misfortunes happen to the best people but most everyone who is willing to work, perform at or above standards and set goals will usually do fine in life.
You list line after line of terrible things that happen to a small percentage and most of the time it's the people who f'd up, no better way of saying it.
Let-downs happen to all of us but the people who are totally down and out and hopeless, well a lot of times it's their own fault.
I don't know what you mean by the catch-22 but all I can say is I don't make a 6-figure income and I don't have rich relatives or a trust fund, but I have a job that pays the bills. I drive an older car, do my own cooking and buy thrift store clothes and I was able to afford a small condo by cutting costs.
You keep playing the blame game and wallow in self pity.
If a person isn't careful they can spend their entire adult life being miserable. There are people like that. They complain about their ex-spouse decades later. Or can't stop mentioning how they were screwed over by a family member or a business partner. It doesn't matter if they are right or not. What matter is it's eating them up.
And if you were unable to get and keep a good paying job, what would have happened?
None of the steps would have helped. You'd be bankrupt.
Once you got that good paying job and was able to keep it, financial planning is simple.
Not easy peasy - like no sacrifices are needed - but simple.
Just spend less than you make.
Can't do that if one is unemployed, or having difficulty keeping a job.
I totally agree - one has to make certain choices to make things happen.
But 100% of people do not have 100% control over 100% of their life. Hence, we have people with difficulties. Pretending this does not exist is not a good thing.
All it takes is one bad event and boom, your plans are ruined.
Working a good paying job and getting a after hours gig making good money means nothing if you get hit by a car and now you're disabled, unable to work and up to your neck in hospital bills.
Or one gets hit by the catch-22 from trying to get out of a low paying job - stuck in that low paying job, regardless of how hard work or sacrifice.
People CAN do everything right in life and still have problems.
That's just life.
Anybody who is able bodied with half a brain shouldn't be unemployed and/or have difficulty keeping a job in these times when many businesses are practically begging for workers. Meanwhile, at the grocery store I frequent, their deli counter has been closed during the busiest times of the day (three times now) due to lack of staffing. Shelves need stocking, delivery drivers are needed, and customers need assistance ... however, this is not happening like it should because too many people have been unmotivated to work in the last year or two thanks to all the gov't handouts. Production and service levels are moving too damn slow! Help wanted signs advertising unskilled jobs between $15 & $23 per hour (well above minimum wage) are all over the place. I realize that some people are hit with bad luck ... however, the scenarios you described are very rare for the most part.
Quote:
Originally Posted by singlegirlinaz
I don't know what you mean by the catch-22
He brings that up a lot. I'm guessing it could be related to why I don't play Blackjack anymore because I always went over by one point and lost. I'd always try to hit 21, but instead I would catch 22.
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You list line after line of terrible things that happen to a small percentage and most of the time it's the people who f'd up, no better way of saying it.
So when someone gets hit by a car by a drunk driver, it was the victim's fault not the drunk driver's?
The CEO makes a bad decision, and now 1500 people get laid off. That's the fault of the 1500 people who got laid off or the CEO's fault?
Random acts of evil do happen to people - and it happens enough to be a real issue in life.
Yes, some people f-up. That's not who I'm talking about. You got a point on that about personal responsibility.
But there are those who do everything right and still have bad things happen. You pretend this situation does not exist.
Quote:
I don't know what you mean by the catch-22
No job, no experience; no experience, no job. Prevents people from getting that first good paying job. So they get stuck in low paying jobs, no matter how much education they get in in-demand fields.
Quote:
You keep playing the blame game and wallow in self pity.
Not doing that.
I speak the truth - even if you don't like it.
If you want to pretend that life never involves random evil things happening to people, that's out of touch.
If you want to blame the victim of a random evil in life, I disagree with that.
Anybody who is able bodied with half a brain shouldn't be unemployed and/or have difficulty keeping a job in these times when many businesses are practically begging for workers.
Every single example of "jobs" you gave were Mcjobs.
Mcjobs don't pay much. They don't count as good paying jobs. As the thread clearly shows - even paying the rent on a crappy apartment for a single person is impossible when working Mcjobs.
Sales jobs don't tend to pay much - 100% commission people wash out frequently. If one is good at sales, they make money. But those who wash out wind up getting Mcjobs.
Aside from those two exceptions to the catch-22, the good paying jobs require experience - which one can't get until they got the good paying job first.
OK, you expect someone to get a Mcjob. Then get paid squat and have grave difficulty paying the rent.
Apparently those are the only choices out there. Zero opportunity to get a good paying job.
You're saying one shouldn't get a better paying job because those are the only employers begging people to take their jobs?
I think that is mandatory to get a good paying job just to pay the rent - the problem is the catch-22 stands in the way. The catch-22 is: No experience, no job; no job, no experience. Employers do not count Mcjob or unrelated work experience as experience for good paying jobs.
Every single example of "jobs" you gave were Mcjobs.
Mcjobs don't pay much. They don't count as good paying jobs. As the thread clearly shows - even paying the rent on a crappy apartment for a single person is a huge challenge when working Mcjobs.
Sales jobs don't tend to pay much - 100% commission people wash out frequently. If one is good at sales, they make money. But those who wash out wind up getting Mcjobs.
Aside from those two exceptions to the catch-22, the good paying jobs require experience - which one can't get until they got the good paying job first.
OK, you expect someone to get a Mcjob. Then get paid squat and have grave difficulty paying the rent.
Apparently those are the only choices out there. Zero opportunity to get a good paying job.
You're saying one shouldn't get a better paying job because those are the only employers begging people to take their jobs?
I think that is mandatory to get a good paying job just to pay the rent - the problem is the catch-22 stands in the way. The catch-22 is: No experience, no job; no job, no experience. Employers do not count Mcjob or unrelated work experience as experience for good paying jobs.
That's always been the case. Landing a desirable, well-paying job has always been difficult. There's no reason for an employer to hire someone inexperienced when there are plenty of qualified applicants. I was living abroad and wanted to teach ESL at the university level (which is where the money is.) However, I didn't have an MA degree, five years college teaching experience or the required 3 publications. Nevertheless I had been teaching English conversation classes mostly at language schools and private students.
One day I got a call. A well-known university near my house needed someone to take over two classes for the fall semester. The scheduled teacher had some family trouble and was still in the States. Again this was for the fall semester only. I got the call on a Wednesday, went for the interview on Friday and started classes the following Monday. The reason I got the gig was because they were desperate and needed someone immediately. I jumped on the opportunity.
Within a month I started sending out a new resume with this university listed and a cover letter explaining I planned to enrolled in an MA program (a distance learning course.) My thinking was if the university which hired me for the semester (again a prestigious school) then perhaps the English department in lesser ranked colleges might think, "Well if he's good enough for them. He's good enough for us."
Within four months I lined up 20 part time classes at five other schools starting the following year and I was on my way. Bought my first rental property three years later.
Now some might suggest I was lucky. However, I had been continuously contacting universities looking for a break. Offering to teach anytime, anywhere. I was willing to commute two hours one way if that's what it took. Fortunately the most I ever had to travel was 90 min one way. (Of course the commute was on a packed train.) And when an opportunity did present itself...I made the most of it.
But without the required footwork my "luck" would never have happened.
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You're very negative.
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