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Old 08-19-2011, 12:37 PM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,858,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
I prefer countervailing tariffs to eliminate the price advantage created by low wages, dirty environments and government subsidies. "FREE TRADE" is not free. It costs far too many their living while making far too few ever wealthier.
the problem with tariffs though is that the other countries will put higher tariffs on american goods, making them more expensive over there, and that creates LESS demand for american goods.

Quote:
In the case of this business I would forbid importing any of their goods. They want to build overseas let them sell overseas. See how much money they can make in a $1 per hour economy.
closing down the importation of one companies products coming from overseas is i suspect illegal unless you include ALL companies that import products to this country from their operations overseas, and that is not a good idea either.

Quote:
These tariffs should apply to all imported manufactured goods. If a foreign company wants to avoid these tariffs they can manufacture their products here. This seems to be working for several automobile companies so why not the rest?
really? even with tariffs on imported automobiles, the cost of union work rules, local, state, and federal regulations, and taxes, mazda accountants have figured out that it would be cheaper for them to move mazda 6 production from the flat rock michigan plant BACK to japan, and pay the import tariffs, as wellas the cost of transporting the cars here.

if we are going to rebuild our manufacturing base, we HAVE to deal with the excessive regulations placed on manufacturing businesses in this country. everything from onerous epa and osha regs, to union work rules, to health care regulations, to financial regulations. we also have to deal with the taxes these companies have to pay, and the number of accountants they need to comply with the tax code.

so you can keep claiming that high tariffs will bring jobs back here, and it may bring a few back, but in the end it will only hurt the US economy MORE.
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Old 08-19-2011, 12:40 PM
 
Location: in my imagination
13,608 posts, read 21,402,861 times
Reputation: 10112
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
We don't agree on much, but I see common ground here, Greg!
Evidently, we are coming around to the same goal for the USA, because it won't let me rep you. I have to spread it.
Greg's comment about tariffs is resonating with me also.
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Old 08-19-2011, 12:42 PM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
17,531 posts, read 24,709,355 times
Reputation: 9980
Quote:
Originally Posted by summers73 View Post
Concessions? Heck no! Cut off your nose to spite your face is the preferred union approach.

American Axle closing last plant here - Business - The Buffalo News (http://www.buffalonews.com/business/article526909.ece - broken link)
Yes if they had agreed to lower their wages to Somali Levels they could be wage slaves. Americans are already competing with North Korean Wage Slaves for Hyundai Plants. THIRD WORLD WE ARE HERE. Please let us serve our Foriegn Masters better
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Old 08-19-2011, 12:52 PM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,479 posts, read 59,811,485 times
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Our "Masters" seem to be concentrated in The Hague, Zurich, the City of London and Wall Street in NYC. I do not recall electing any of them.
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Old 08-19-2011, 01:24 PM
 
Location: Southern California
15,080 posts, read 20,484,127 times
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Well, at least we still make hamburgers here.
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Old 08-19-2011, 01:25 PM
 
16,545 posts, read 13,459,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MIKEETC View Post
Well, at least we still make hamburgers here.
Too bad the beef is imported mostly from South America. I knew we could find a way to outsource burger flipping!
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Old 08-19-2011, 01:25 PM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,858,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MIKEETC View Post
Well, at least we still make hamburgers here.
are you sure about that?
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Old 08-19-2011, 01:38 PM
 
42,732 posts, read 29,898,651 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagger View Post
On the concessions from As Talks Drag, American Axle Strike Enters Third Month | Labor Notes

The last AAM contract, which contained concessions for workers yet to be hired, was ratified by a small margin, partly because it contained a $5,000 signing bonus. Rumors swirl of an even larger bonus offer—$6,000 or $7,000—this time. If strikers accept, they will lose far more than that in their first year of work, as hourly pay drops from $28 to $14.

On increased profits and a little more on concessions from Autos Insider | Union rejects proposal at American Axle plant in Buffalo, N.Y. | The Detroit News (http://www.detnews.com/article/20110817/AUTO01/108170429/1361/Union-rejects-proposal-at-American-Axle-plant-in-Buffalo--N.Y. - broken link)

Negotiations on behalf of the New York employees broke down July 31 when UAW Local 846 members voted 98 percent in favor of rejecting a proposal that was described as the company's "last best and final proposal" for Cheektowaga, the union said in a release Wednesday.

"This is an indication that hard-working people are sick of constantly helping companies through concessions and back to profitability and companies refusing to share in that," said UAW Vice President Cindy Estrada.

American Axle reported second-quarter earnings of $49.2 million, up from $25.4 million a year before.

"Here is a business that started out as an American company providing good-paying jobs to 6,000 employees," Estrada said. "As a result of the hard work of these employees, it has grown to an international company with 32 factories worldwide. All of this success was achieved off the backs of the original 6,000 hard-working Americans."

Scott Adams, director of UAW Region 9, which includes the Buffalo area, said the Cheektowaga employees made sacrifices when American Axle was in trouble and are now fighting to maintain a decent standard of living.
Just so you know, your first cite is from 2008, and has nothing to add to the discussion about the 2011 negotiation. Your second cite simply is a re-wording of the original link.

The axle-company says that they didn't ask for workers to take a pay cut, and they did propose moving some of the production line from Mexico to Buffalo.

Unless you can tell us specifically what the union wanted and what concessions the company wanted, then I stand by my contention that the union did the workers a disservice. The union overestimated its leverage, and underestimated the company's willingness to close its doors. Now those workers will be joining the ranks of the unemployed.
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Old 08-19-2011, 02:16 PM
 
Location: West Michigan
12,372 posts, read 9,319,393 times
Reputation: 7364
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
Just so you know, your first cite is from 2008, and has nothing to add to the discussion about the 2011 negotiation. Your second cite simply is a re-wording of the original link.

The axle-company says that they didn't ask for workers to take a pay cut, and they did propose moving some of the production line from Mexico to Buffalo.

Unless you can tell us specifically what the union wanted and what concessions the company wanted, then I stand by my contention that the union did the workers a disservice. The union overestimated its leverage, and underestimated the company's willingness to close its doors. Now those workers will be joining the ranks of the unemployed.
The pay concessions agreed to three years ago does have something to do with the negotiations in 2011, but here's a link to an article from July 2011.
And it depends on who you believe---the company or the union---as to whether or not AA offered to bring back work they'd sent to Mexico or if they were negotiating to lower wages. The company never had an intentions of keeping the plant open--and that relates back to the contract 3 years ago when they were asking for pay cuts to $11.00 and the fact that lower trucks sales these past few year had left them with less work for that plant---they were not bargaining in good faith what so ever.
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Old 08-19-2011, 02:18 PM
 
45,237 posts, read 26,464,208 times
Reputation: 24997
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boompa View Post
Yes if they had agreed to lower their wages to Somali Levels they could be wage slaves. Americans are already competing with North Korean Wage Slaves for Hyundai Plants. THIRD WORLD WE ARE HERE. Please let us serve our Foriegn Masters better
Wake up: With all it's millitary spending, pensions,healthcare benefits, rules, regulations, laws, restrictions and give away programs, we have been slaves to our government masters for some time now.
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