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NO, that's your assumption. The same people that railed against Bush are railing against Obama. It's the patisan hacks who can't see the forrest for the trees. It's so simple to blame one side or the other, when the fact is, both sides are to blame.
It's really that simple. If you didn't like Bush, you can't possibly like Obama. The hypocrisy is to believe that because he's "your guy" everything he does is legit. So far, he's nothing but GWBush on steroids, minus the conscience.
Here's an undeniable fact: If Bush was in power during all of these scandals, he'd already have several calls for impeachment.
You are re-writing history. During the Bush years, conservatives vastly supported his actions -- from firing U.S. Attorneys to rendition to locking up Americans without charges. Liberals largely opposed those measures under Bush and largely oppose them under Obama. Conservatives now oppose these measures, that they supported before, under Obama.
You are re-writing history. During the Bush years, conservatives vastly supported his actions -- from firing U.S. Attorneys to rendition to locking up Americans without charges. Liberals largely opposed those measures under Bush and largely oppose them under Obama. Conservatives now oppose these measures, that they supported before, under Obama.
There sure seems to be a lot of defense of Obama here for something not supported.
There sure seems to be a lot of defense of Obama here for something not supported.
Oh, I'm not supporting Obama on this. I'm merely noting the hypocrisy of some who defended this policy when Bush did it and denounce it when Obama did it. If it is a bad policy it should transcend the individual.
As far as the policy, it's been the subject of debate since before the founding of the republic. What is the proper balance between privacy and security? It is a gray area that has become more gray in the digital world.
The secondary issue is how much can the government do secretly shielded from public view? We are now at the point where civil cases have been dismissed because it would require the gov't to disclose secret information.
My opinion is that when this was done under Bush, we were living through a different time. We had just had a major attack on our soil.
There seems to be no reason for major sweeps of average Americans and their privacy. You cannot simply search someone's home or belongings because of what you might find. That's what seems to be going in today.
They need to work at gathering intel and investigating from there. Not simply casting a net to see what they might find. That is not our way.
So precedent doesn't matter? Moreover, the same people criticizing Obama for getting phone numbers with a court order condoned Bush tapping phones without a court order. Thus, it is legitimate to note their hypocrisy.
Attempt to change the subject?
This topic is not about hypocrisy, of which there is plenty to go around in both parties and here in C-D.
The topic under discussion is spying by the government-- and the extent of it -- on the citizens of this country.
Oh, I'm not supporting Obama on this. I'm merely noting the hypocrisy of some who defended this policy when Bush did it and denounce it when Obama did it. If it is a bad policy it should transcend the individual.
You were speaking for the whole, not just yourself.
My opinion is that when this was done under Bush, we were living through a different time. We had just had a major attack on our soil.
There seems to be no reason for major sweeps of average Americans and their privacy. You cannot simply search someone's home or belongings because of what you might find. That's what seems to be going in today.
They need to work at gathering intel and investigating from there. Not simply casting a net to see what they might find. That is not our way.
When it was first started it was only supposed to be pointed at conversations outside the U.S.. If memory serves that was a highly contested point back then against doing the monitoring and it was promised that only conversations originating elsewhere or originating here to certain countries were looked at. Never within the country and if one was accidentally trapped it would be deleted.
Looks like that changed and must stop.
I'm also hearing that other countries are none too happy with this latest revelation. How do we as a nation scream about China and Iran hacking us when we're doing that and worse to everyone else including our own people?
It all goes into a file with your name on it. Then, if some bureaucratic 'tard feels like accessing your file, they have everything about you at their disposal. Having access to your data may be all they need. Once they determine sift they your data, and determine that they are ideologically or politically opposed to you, they can simply put your name on a list.
That's all the bureaucrats at the IRS did, they decided if you had "Patriot" in your name, then you were an ideological enemy of theirs, and they put your name on a list. With meta data, they can categorize you and me in a much broader scale, then simply the name of our organization, and they can create a lot of enemies lists, and send those list out to their friends.
This is no different than your government coming into your home and taking things that they might "need" in the future. Then keeping them on file in case they might need to pressure you down the road.
I find that calling out hypocrisy is due and legitimate when the OP calls the sitting President a "socialist turd wanna be dictator" while not mentioning the previous president who did the same thing and got a free pass from the right-wing.
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