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The blue was about what previous generations did to make it unsafe to grow up in your own generations, you are I believe about 6-8 years younger than myself.
On that, I'll note that you grew up in an era much safer than the one I grew up in. When you were growing up, crime was falling and reached the lowest levels since the 1960s.
I may have mentioned it earlier in the thread, but one of the main reasons why crime increased was due to the environmental issues associated with lead pollution as it relates to leaded gasoline being used in cars for decades.
Please see link below from Mother Jones. This is one of the theories that people have had for many years about why, crime went down globally starting in the 1990s. This decrease coincides with a majority of nations stopping the use of leaded gasoline. The reason why crime is still in many inner city neighborhoods is because of lead having settled into the soil and contaminated those areas much moreso than "nicer" wealthier neighborhoods. Major freeways were built through the inner city and the lead residue that settled on the soil from the 1950s through the 1980s is still in our inner cities in America, we just are not breathing as much lead in our air and so violent crime has decreased as a result.
I personally do believe that environmental factors were the primary reasons for the increase of crime and that lead contamination was the primary culprit. I am honestly afraid what will happen to the people in Flint, MI that have been poisoned and wonder if there are on-going studies of the children affected.
On the reality TV thing, I am not all that concerned with the increase of stereotypes of black Americans today. I don't like "reality" TV because IMO it is not a true reality and is just entertainment. On stereotypes, blacks have been stereotyped as lazy, criminal, ignorant, beasts since our ancestors were brought to this country. Having something on TV showing black people in a positive light doesn't really make a difference IMO on how people view us as a demographic. IMO it is ridiculous to always be concerned with how other people view us. We should be more concerned with eradicating stereotypes only amongst black people IMO.
Mother Jones - Lead: America's Real Criminal Element
The bold is the case for ALL of them. Housing, as I stated, is a very interesting field to work in. Due to me being a history buff, I also decided to learn about the history of public housing in America and it is probably the only thing about history that I get upset about in a very personal way because for urban areas in particular, it codified segregation and discrimination. It dismantled primarily poor black and ethnic white enclaves (even though most of those people at the time agreed to participate in the "project" of public housing). Like you stated in the bold, even now, when we are demolishing the oldest public housing units (the one my great grandparents lived in was one of the first public housing locations in America. One that we demolished in Atlanta was the first in the country) they have still not built back those neighborhoods, but honestly, they cannot rebuild the neighborhoods.
It is a conundrum and I try not to think much about it, but housing laws and public housing zoning of "negro" and "white" areas created segregation in many Midwestern communities/urban areas in particular. Segregation was a "thing" in the south, but not in the Midwestern cities until the government got involved in officially zoning an area a "negro" area, like what was done to my hometown.
Public housing accepting primarily poverty stricken individuals are what caused the "ghettos" to be created that I personally grew up in and other poor black people in urban areas. It caused "redlining" to be a thing as well. Housing laws based on race contributed to the poor schools that black children are forced to attend in these ghettos today. Everything is connected. Like I said, housing is a very interesting subject. It touches every facet of one's life for everyone as where you live at age 12, studies show determines your future educational achievements and income received for your labor. And IMO there is no way to rebuild what was destroyed by these initiatives between 1932 and 1975 and forward. Housing laws are still being enacted to this day. Ironically, the one that is seen as the answer to the issues caused by public housing is HCVP since it is not actually "government housing." It is the government paying the private sector to housing poor people.
Which brings me to your next comment:
HUD and government are trying to get out of the housing industry. The bold is evident across the country. Even the developments we built on top of former public housing developments in metro Atlanta, they only have a 25-30 year agreement where the private property managers, who some partly own those developments, will accept people who have Section 8 or a public housing voucher (FWIW, the people in Atlanta who were forced to vacate public housing all were given HCVP vouchers and were given the first chance at apartments in the newly developed communities that were mixed income/market rate). Usually the new buildings are required to accept up to 20% HCVP or PBU (project based units/public housing) tenants. In some locations it can be 30-40%. As the years have passed they now are only about 10-20% and after 15-30 years they no longer have to accept those tenants at all.
So eventually public housing will no longer be in existence. I do feel that HCVP will stick around though. It is cheaper for the government to issue that program as it doesn't have as many regulations as public housing does nor any buildings to maintain.
It's interesting that you bring this up. I'm a sociology major so this kind of reading interests me, I find that a few public housing developments (particularly in New York), have actually be privatized and are now private apartments (I believe that Park Hill in Staten Island is now a private apartment complex? Correct me if I'm wrong). I guess it certainly beats the hell out of demolishing so many towers and displacing so many people.
The blue was about what previous generations did to make it unsafe to grow up in your own generations, you are I believe about 6-8 years younger than myself.
On that, I'll note that you grew up in an era much safer than the one I grew up in. When you were growing up, crime was falling and reached the lowest levels since the 1960s. Yet my generation, many parents were paranoid and it seems even more so than now. Maybe it's more of an awareness for what was always there?
I may have mentioned it earlier in the thread, but one of the main reasons why crime increased was due to the environmental issues associated with lead pollution as it relates to leaded gasoline being used in cars for decades.
Please see link below from Mother Jones. This is one of the theories that people have had for many years about why, crime went down globally starting in the 1990s. This decrease coincides with a majority of nations stopping the use of leaded gasoline. The reason why crime is still in many inner city neighborhoods is because of lead having settled into the soil and contaminated those areas much moreso than "nicer" wealthier neighborhoods. Major freeways were built through the inner city and the lead residue that settled on the soil from the 1950s through the 1980s is still in our inner cities in America, we just are not breathing as much lead in our air and so violent crime has decreased as a result.
I personally do believe that environmental factors were the primary reasons for the increase of crime and that lead contamination was the primary culprit. I am honestly afraid what will happen to the people in Flint, MI that have been poisoned and wonder if there are on-going studies of the children affected. Do you believe the pollutions lead to more aggression or so to speak?
On the reality TV thing, I am not all that concerned with the increase of stereotypes of black Americans today. I don't like "reality" TV because IMO it is not a true reality and is just entertainment. On stereotypes, blacks have been stereotyped as lazy, criminal, ignorant, beasts since our ancestors were brought to this country. Having something on TV showing black people in a positive light doesn't really make a difference IMO on how people view us as a demographic. IMO it is ridiculous to always be concerned with how other people view us. We should be more concerned with eradicating stereotypes only amongst black people IMO.
Responding to the bold, I said this once in a forum regarding a video with a riot, (tearing up the neighborhood) regarding a shooting. The discussion got on to black-on-black crime, and the typical argument of most whites kill whites, etc. I stated that while I agree that that is true, I do wonder why a black person would want to replicate such behavior when they see how atrocious it looks when others do it? I stated we need to start treating each other better, people tried to act like I was the one that was deluded, imagine that.
Yet my generation, many parents were paranoid and it seems even more so than now. Maybe it's more of an awareness for what was always there?
On this - yes, there was more of an awareness because of the increased media focus on crime that got people paranoid.
Do you believe the pollutions lead to more aggression or so to speak?
On this, when you get a minute, read the link I posted about lead poisoning. It is a long read but is one of the best articles about this subject. Lead is a known poison to humans and is linked with behavior issues and an increase in aggression and violent behaviors in particular. It is also linked to ADD/ADHD and other disorders. Many times when kids have behavioral problems that are associated with a "disorder" they have been lead poisoned. FWIW, this is something as well that I think black womanist/feminist need to be REALLY focused on instead of on racism against black men in particular. Our children are much more likely to be affected by lead poisoning than other demographics.
On the "black on black crime" thing in relation to "white on white" crime, there is no desire to "replicate such behavior." People bring up "white on white" crime as proof that blacks are not inferior when it comes to committing crimes primarily against people within our own demographic. All racial demographics do the same thing.
People who always want to harp about "black on black crime" are basically saying that black people are more criminally prone than other "races" of people. That is not true. That is a stereotype that black people need to curtail within our own demographic and I'm glad more of us do argue the fact that whites also primarily commit crime against each other. So do hispanics and Asians and indigenous people in this country.
ETA: Anytime I am in a conversation with a black person about "black on black crime" I make it a point to let them know that other demographics commit crime against each other as well and that this is not some sort of symptom of black pathology or some inferior characteristic based on race. Us believing we are inferior to other demographics, that we are "more" criminal, is basically being a racist against our own people. IMO this is the biggest issue in our own demographic today - the fact that we blindly believe and accept that we are inferior to other groups based on the way we are reported about in media in regards to crime, education, and other socio-economic issues. For instance, we never see stories about the heroin epidemic in "white America." Or stories about the "white opiate babies." Whites are rarely pathologized in such a way. It serves to show them as "real" people and not as a monolithic group of dysfunction. Since we do not control the media, we blacks will never be able to fully control the stereotypes of us that media puts out or even to diminish it in any negligible way from what it is now. So IMO it is VERY important for us to discuss, with kids especially, these media depictions and have a conversation with our kids about how TV and videos and internet articles depict us as black Americans in a false, unauthentic way, many times this is not consciously done by the creators IMO but the effects are negative on our children and demographic as a whole when it comes to internalizing a view of blacks as inferior to other people.
Last edited by residinghere2007; 01-18-2017 at 10:19 AM..
It's interesting that you bring this up. I'm a sociology major so this kind of reading interests me, I find that a few public housing developments (particularly in New York), have actually be privatized and are now private apartments (I believe that Park Hill in Staten Island is now a private apartment complex? Correct me if I'm wrong). I guess it certainly beats the hell out of demolishing so many towers and displacing so many people.
On this, practically all public housing communities in major urban areas are managed by private property management companies. People just don't know this. My work in housing was with one of these companies.
Also, all the new developments eventually will not be public housing. The government is getting out of public housing. It's one of the reasons I got out of that area of employment. I didn't want to pigeon-hole myself in a field that is slowly going away.
A lot of people that blacks here deem as racist, aren't really racist. Bigoted no doubt, but not really racist. A lot of racist are usually not against black people, they're against black (and Hispanic) ghetto culture. Notice that many of these same white people usually don't have an issue when they find out the black person is from Africa or somewhere else. There are some hardcore racist out there who just hate anyone or anything that is black, but I've found those people rare. And usually I've found it's not white people who have a seething distain for anything black, it's usually people from Asian or Latin America who are socialized to hate anything with dark skin.
Just as we are against white trailer trash culture/lifestyle also. And when one works in a big city, there is just a lot of ghetto culture people visible seeming to be representing the majority element of a particular racial group like blacks and Hispanics.
America is having more of a problem with clashing cultures/lifestyles, and it's much less about race and the colour of ones skin. And looking at the past voting maps, it's urban versus rural lifestyles and values.
Yet my generation, many parents were paranoid and it seems even more so than now. Maybe it's more of an awareness for what was always there?
On this - yes, there was more of an awareness because of the increased media focus on crime that got people paranoid.
Do you believe the pollutions lead to more aggression or so to speak?
On this, when you get a minute, read the link I posted about lead poisoning. It is a long read but is one of the best articles about this subject. Lead is a known poison to humans and is linked with behavior issues and an increase in aggression and violent behaviors in particular. It is also linked to ADD/ADHD and other disorders. Many times when kids have behavioral problems that are associated with a "disorder" they have been lead poisoned. FWIW, this is something as well that I think black womanist/feminist need to be REALLY focused on instead of on racism against black men in particular. Our children are much more likely to be affected by lead poisoning than other demographics.
On the "black on black crime" thing in relation to "white on white" crime, there is no desire to "replicate such behavior." People bring up "white on white" crime as proof that blacks are not inferior when it comes to committing crimes primarily against people within our own demographic. All racial demographics do the same thing.
People who always want to harp about "black on black crime" are basically saying that black people are more criminally prone than other "races" of people. That is not true. That is a stereotype that black people need to curtail within our own demographic and I'm glad more of us do argue the fact that whites also primarily commit crime against each other. So do hispanics and Asians and indigenous people in this country.
ETA: Anytime I am in a conversation with a black person about "black on black crime" I make it a point to let them know that other demographics commit crime against each other as well and that this is not some sort of symptom of black pathology or some inferior characteristic based on race. Us believing we are inferior to other demographics, that we are "more" criminal, is basically being a racist against our own people. IMO this is the biggest issue in our own demographic today - the fact that we blindly believe and accept that we are inferior to other groups based on the way we are reported about in media in regards to crime, education, and other socio-economic issues. For instance, we never see stories about the heroin epidemic in "white America." Or stories about the "white opiate babies." Whites are rarely pathologized in such a way. It serves to show them as "real" people and not as a monolithic group of dysfunction. Since we do not control the media, we blacks will never be able to fully control the stereotypes of us that media puts out or even to diminish it in any negligible way from what it is now. So IMO it is VERY important for us to discuss, with kids especially, these media depictions and have a conversation with our kids about how TV and videos and internet articles depict us as black Americans in a false, unauthentic way, many times this is not consciously done by the creators IMO but the effects are negative on our children and demographic as a whole when it comes to internalizing a view of blacks as inferior to other people.
So I take it that you are not a fan of Peggy Hubbard?
What do you think of the idea that blacks need to "speak out" against the issues in the black community. I do feel that we have done much of that in this thread (such as admitting that the black community is not flawless). Do you feel that we don't publically call out wrong enough? Why or why not?
What do you think of the idea that blacks need to "speak out" against the issues in the black community. I do feel that we have done much of that in this thread (such as admitting that the black community is not flawless). Do you feel that we don't publically call out wrong enough? Why or why not?
We do and always have.
However, within recent years political correctness has made it more difficult even for blacks to speak frankly to other blacks about our own problems because, oh, my god, that would be judging.
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Speaking out
